961SE (UKDM) observation

Think we’d all be interested in seeing that video Tony! In awe of you more technically inclined types and your travails in maximising this somewhat flawed machine! I hope some day to be able to ‘ride on your collective coat tails‘ and follow the idiots guide to 961 success! Until then, I’ll keep riding and hope that it doesn’t explode!!:oops:
I am just yelling from my rocking chair !

 
I am just yelling from my rocking chair !

I’m suspecting smug satisfaction really Tony, in sorting your bike - and rightly so! Most of us will only get one crack at this machine. I’d never get (higher) authority to buy a Birmingham Norton model, so my Donington 961 CR is what it is. I’m pretty confident though, that future fixes (and maybe a little luck) will see me riding until it is passed to my son. Then it’s his problem!😄

Long live Norton.
 
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With the help of dedicated individuals like Stu and Ollie and a supply of (overpriced) parts from Solihull Norton I am following the same path. And by the time your son inherits it he'll probably remove the engine and convert it to electric ;)
 
With the help of dedicated individuals like Stu and Ollie and a supply of (overpriced) parts from Solihull Norton I am following the same path. And by the time your son inherits it he'll probably remove the engine and convert it to electric ;)
I suppose anything is possible Clive😄!!

961SE (UKDM) observation
 
Should have done that with my rotary and saved myself a few quid in the bargain.:)
 
Hi Clive,
Did you manage to connect to your EURO 4 ECU and take it to the Dyno?
No - I had to spend time getting my rockers sorted. Still not quite right yet. Got a nice Ducati and started thinking that the effort to get a bit of extra performance from the 961 is never going to match the delivery of the Ducati so accept the adequate performance for what it is. Sure - if I can get into the ECU then I will tweak it to get the best from it but I have a lot of tasks queueing up for my time.
 
No - I had to spend time getting my rockers sorted. Still not quite right yet. Got a nice Ducati and started thinking that the effort to get a bit of extra performance from the 961 is never going to match the delivery of the Ducati so accept the adequate performance for what it is. Sure - if I can get into the ECU then I will tweak it to get the best from it but I have a lot of tasks queueing up for my time.
what's the remaining issue Clive?
 
what's the remaining issue Clive?
Above 5k revs I am getting a bit more noise than before my rocker problem. Of course with these engines it's tricky to hear where the noise is coming from. Strangely the noise, which is a bit like a loose timing chain, seems most noticeable on the overrun. I have tried resetting the timing chain.

At lower revs it's fine so I have to decide whether to open it all up again and measure the rocker side float; I don't know how critical the rocker side float is. Would just a few thou. extra make a difference? Also the rockers were very close to each other - are they just brushing each other?
 
Above 5k revs I am getting a bit more noise than before my rocker problem. Of course with these engines it's tricky to hear where the noise is coming from. Strangely the noise, which is a bit like a loose timing chain, seems most noticeable on the overrun. I have tried resetting the timing chain.

At lower revs it's fine so I have to decide whether to open it all up again and measure the rocker side float; I don't know how critical the rocker side float is. Would just a few thou. extra make a difference? Also the rockers were very close to each other - are they just brushing each other?
Hi Clive , They should definately not be touching each other. Did you set the valve lifter pre-load to 2.25 turns from just touching ?
From the manual :

 Remove the spark plugs.
 Remove cylinder head cover (see Cylinder Head Cover Removal).
 Remove cam chain cover (see Cam Chain Cover Removal).
 Rotate the crank clockwise – using a wrench on the end of the crankshaft nut.
 Locate TDC on cylinder #1.
 Set the rocker adjuster on cylinder #1 inlet to zero clearance and then wind the adjuster a further 2.25 turns to preload the hydraulic lifter. Lock the lock nut.
 Set the rocker adjuster on cylinder #2 exhaust to zero clearance and then wind the adjuster a further 2.25 turns to preload the hydraulic lifter. Lock the lock nut.
 Turn the crankshaft to set TDC on cylinder #2
 Set the rocker adjuster on cylinder #2 inlet to zero clearance and then wind the adjuster a further 2.25 turns to preload the hydraulic lifter. Lock the lock nut.
 Set the rocker adjuster on cylinder #1 exhaust to zero clearance and then wind the adjuster a further 2.25 turns to preload the hydraulic lifter. Lock the lock nut.
 Rotate the crank 720° clockwise to ensure smooth operation.
 
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No - I had to spend time getting my rockers sorted. Still not quite right yet. Got a nice Ducati and started thinking that the effort to get a bit of extra performance from the 961 is never going to match the delivery of the Ducati so accept the adequate performance for what it is. Sure - if I can get into the ECU then I will tweak it to get the best from it but I have a lot of tasks queueing up for my time.
Then how did you put your bike on the Dyno?
 
Hi Clive , They should definately not be touching each other. Did you set the valve lifter pre-load to 2.25 turns from just touching ?
From the manual :
Yup done that but found the rockers are so close that the lock nut fouls on the adjoining rocker when you turn it. There is around 15thou clearance when the rockers are at their closest but of course that is cold and turning the engine by hand. How that changes when it's hot and thrashing around is anyone's guess.

Ran it, opened it up, set it again but couldn't see any scuffing. I could open it all up yet again and just grind a little bit off the (£400+) rockers just to make sure maybe.

The other thing I wonder about are the hydraulic lifters. Let me tell you a little story; I have a 65000mile 2007 BMW MINI and after an oil change one of the tappets/hydraulic lifters became very noisy. I bought a replacement but was not looking forward to fitting it when I read about a number of people who had the same thing happen and found that an application of oil flush then another oil change sorted it. Now I have been working on cars for 50 years and I always regarded the stuff like Snake Oil remedies. But for £5 I tried it. And by Jingo it worked like magic!!!! Might give it a try on the 961????

All a bit annoying - you spend all that money on the parts and expect it to be sorted. Such are the joys of 961 ownership. The 2017 Ducati is still running perfectly and I'm sure it has developed a smug expression.
 
Yup done that but found the rockers are so close that the lock nut fouls on the adjoining rocker when you turn it. There is around 15thou clearance when the rockers are at their closest but of course that is cold and turning the engine by hand. How that changes when it's hot and thrashing around is anyone's guess.

Ran it, opened it up, set it again but couldn't see any scuffing. I could open it all up yet again and just grind a little bit off the (£400+) rockers just to make sure maybe.

The other thing I wonder about are the hydraulic lifters. Let me tell you a little story; I have a 65000mile 2007 BMW MINI and after an oil change one of the tappets/hydraulic lifters became very noisy. I bought a replacement but was not looking forward to fitting it when I read about a number of people who had the same thing happen and found that an application of oil flush then another oil change sorted it. Now I have been working on cars for 50 years and I always regarded the stuff like Snake Oil remedies. But for £5 I tried it. And by Jingo it worked like magic!!!! Might give it a try on the 961????

All a bit annoying - you spend all that money on the parts and expect it to be sorted. Such are the joys of 961 ownership. The 2017 Ducati is still running perfectly and I'm sure it has developed a smug expression.
Serves you right.

EVERYONE knows you’re supposed to lighten and polish rockers…😉
 
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