Uprated charging system

As Les indicated in an earlier thread, searching for a graph showing the output of the rm23 was futile. I did find mention of 140 watts output at 3000 rpm then in another location 100 watts at 3500 rpm. Also mentioned was the figure 75% of full output at 3,000 rpm. This would give 135 watts, since the rm 23 is good for 180 watts Max, or was when new at least.
The actual output of my original RM23 seems to be quite adequate. Running Boyer analogue ignition, a 60/55 H4 headlight and standard tailight plus heated vest for a day ride last week, it did quite well. Starting resting battery voltage after a couple of weeks sitting was 12.5. At the end of the ride it was 12.8 and the next morning measurement (as suggested by Comnoz) was 12.65. I do keep the revs above 3000 most of the time as that is where things get smooth. This ride included a bit of stop start city riding, maybe half an hour ea way, so an hour of stop start and about three hours of secondary roads with light traffic, no freeway riding, so pretty slow going overall.

I can't see a need for more electrical power on this bike, though if the alternator was being replaced due to failure, then it would make sense to add a bit of spare capacity.

Glen

Nice explanation Nathan, very interesting, makes sense for you to go back to the RM 21 then.

Worntorn, Glen, it would be very interesting to see a output graph for all of the RM alternators, I had a look online and could only find, on the RM23, much what you posted above, well, it said 100 Watts at 3500RPM.

Mr Sparks, glad to hear you're 180 Watt set up is reliable, I have a podtronics regulator for my RM24 set up.

I always thought the original set up was very good, have even run mine with out the battery, just to see if it would!, just wanted a bit more Watts, the three phase does seem to tick all the boxes, I hope...

John

Well, I've gone full circle on this now. It started out with the installation of the 200W stator along with a Podtronics rectifier/regulator in hopes of being able to run an H4 bulb. Then onto an LED headlamp. Added a Sparktronics multi-colored LED voltage monitor to keep track of the system. It all played well together.
Starting this Spring, the monitor tells me that the voltage occasionally (and very randomly) drops below 12.5V while tooling down the highway at 4000 rpm. Headlight output is constant, winkers aren't winking to drain the battery down, voltage verified with a DMM. It's gotten progressively worse as the Summer wears on. The problem can't be duplicated while running in the driveway (of course).
Poking and prodding through the harness tells me nothing. Tried the original 120W stator; no joy. Out of desperation, the original rectifier and zener were reconnected: All Better.
Since changing to the LED lamp, all concerns of weak headlight output are gone, so I guess I'll stick with the stock charging setup. Sheesh!

Nathan

Nater_Potater said:

Well, I've gone full circle on this now. It started out with the installation of the 200W stator along with a Podtronics rectifier/regulator in hopes of being able to run an H4 bulb. Then onto an LED headlamp. Added a Sparktronics multi-colored LED voltage monitor to keep track of the system. It all played well together.
Starting this Spring, the monitor tells me that the voltage occasionally (and very randomly) drops below 12.5V while tooling down the highway at 4000 rpm. Headlight output is constant, winkers aren't winking to drain the battery down, voltage verified with a DMM. It's gotten progressively worse as the Summer wears on. The problem can't be duplicated while running in the driveway (of course).
Poking and prodding through the harness tells me nothing. Tried the original 120W stator; no joy. Out of desperation, the original rectifier and zener were reconnected: All Better.
Since changing to the LED lamp, all concerns of weak headlight output are gone, so I guess I'll stick with the stock charging setup. Sheesh!

Nathan

Click to expand...

See my post here voltage-regulators-t22113.html it may explain what you experienced.

Jean

Jeandr said:

Nater_Potater said:

Well, I've gone full circle on this now. It started out with the installation of the 200W stator along with a Podtronics rectifier/regulator in hopes of being able to run an H4 bulb. Then onto an LED headlamp. Added a Sparktronics multi-colored LED voltage monitor to keep track of the system. It all played well together.
Starting this Spring, the monitor tells me that the voltage occasionally (and very randomly) drops below 12.5V while tooling down the highway at 4000 rpm. Headlight output is constant, winkers aren't winking to drain the battery down, voltage verified with a DMM. It's gotten progressively worse as the Summer wears on. The problem can't be duplicated while running in the driveway (of course).
Poking and prodding through the harness tells me nothing. Tried the original 120W stator; no joy. Out of desperation, the original rectifier and zener were reconnected: All Better.
Since changing to the LED lamp, all concerns of weak headlight output are gone, so I guess I'll stick with the stock charging setup. Sheesh!

Nathan

Click to expand...

See my post here voltage-regulators-t22113.html it may explain what you experienced.

Jean

Click to expand...

I certainly don't dispute what you said. But I installed a highout put 220 Watt stator and a Pazon electronic ign several years ago and have pretty much ignored it since because it has never given me a lick of problem. Batt stays at 13.8 give a take one or two tenths

lwmcd1 said:

Jeandr said:

Nater_Potater said:

Out of desperation, the original rectifier and zener were reconnected: All Better.

Click to expand...

See my post here voltage-regulators-t22113.html it may explain what you experienced.

Jean

Click to expand...

I certainly don't dispute what you said. But I installed a high output 220 Watt stator and a Pazon electronic ign several years ago and have pretty much ignored it since because it has never given me a lick of problem. Batt stays at 13.8 give a take one or two tenths

Click to expand...

I won't begin to argue that the aftermarket units aren't up to the task, but it appears that my latest travails were brought about by a failing non-stock regulator. I find a bit of ironic humour in it all. Who'd-a-thunk the stock setup would win out? I am keeping an open mind with the idea that I merely have a failed regulator. It could just as easily have been the stock zener that puked.

As noted in other posts, I'm assuming an electric start will be a future addition. At that point, it'll have to go with a three-phase and its associated regulator system. Although, I definitely like the way Jean thinks about regulators. As I said before, the current system impresses me as riding around with the throttle wide open, and controlling your speed with the brakes. Maybe over-simplification...

Jean, thanks for the o-scope images. Very telling, and they confirm long-standing suspicions. Keep it up!

Nathan

I ordered one of the watercraft series regulators and it arrived today. I'll play around with it and see if it helps out with my ballistic LIPO battery undercharging and report back. The regulator was $56 new, and another $14 for the plug kit.

I am currently going through the same loop - trying to work out what to do for my project.

I have a new "genuine" Lucas RM24 175 watt 3 phase stator, but have been watching this thread (and Jean's) with interest as to what to do about the regulator.

I had originally decided on the Sachse unit based purely on reputation and word of mouth, but am now seriously considering the Shindengen unit instead (it's half the price, and the number of applications it's used for is pretty vast)

The more I look into this, the better that I understand the reasons why you see so many 'new' alternators that fail and/or melt into a solid lump.

This site http://www.vstrom.info/Smf/index.php/topic,20426.0.html has also made really interesting reading, as has this one http://hildstrom.com/projects/buellregulator/

Did a test today of the new regulator, promising results. I have an 8 cell Ballistic EVO battery in the bike.

Here are the results. A little high on the voltage, but not too bad. I'm sure my meter is out a bit, it's had a hard life. I should hook up my Mooshi meter and see what that says.




Now to tackle the other problems that I found. Oil leaks, smoking out the RH cylinder..... Ugggg. After I finished up the bike 3 years ago, all hell broke loose in life and I never got to finish tuning it, now it has sat since then and I really need to get it all done. It will have to wait until next summer now, no room yet to work on it until I get my building up.

Thanks for posting the images, Brent! What load/rpm/battery charge conditions did you get that at? Yes, 14.97V is a touch high, but at least you know you'd be charging the battery.

Nathan

No real load other than ignition, at 2,000 rpm. Didn't have much time to play around with it, oil started pouring out of the inner primary by the sprocket. I have issues to deal with.