Stuart Garner's pension fraud

robs ss said:

This forum has to be better than the last half dozen posts - doesn't it?

Click to expand...

Bit of luck and even AJD might show her face in here to complete the 961 bagging brigade.

As a genuine suggestion, how about a new forum - “Norton the Company” entirely seperate from the Modern Bike thread? Or are a chosen few still to wedded on the put downs?

Gojuu said:

Bit of luck and even AJD might show her face in here to complete the 961 bagging brigade.

As a genuine suggestion, how about a new forum - “Norton the Company” entirely seperate from the Modern Bike thread? Or are a chosen few still to wedded on the put downs?

Click to expand...

Has some merit, for the modern Norton motorcycle enthusiast.

kommando said:

As a declared bankrupt then nothing would have come from Garner, it came from the Fraud Compensation Fund which is funded by UK Taxpayers. So I paid for his sins without ever buying a 961 or telling anyone to consider buying one.

Click to expand...

Yeah, nah.

Yes people lost their pension fund. I don't suggest that's acceptable in anyway.

But given the amount of welfare paid in the UK to so many people , should the UK gov't have said, no we aren't covering these people's pensions, let them rot?

The Fraud compensation fund is there for this reason. The people paid their tax each shift / payroll, same as in some way many people do.

Personally, whilst the reason the issue came about is distasteful, you should be proud that your taxes could be used to support those people that - through no fault of their own - ended up in this situation.

Holding Gardiner accountable is one thing. Doing it by taking pensions from hard working people doesn't do that.

But, yeah, nice pot shot. Keep telling people not to buy 961's. If they understand how near sighted you are on a lot of things - they'll likely see throught it.

Gojuu said:

Yeah, nah.

Yes people lost their pension fund. I don't suggest that's acceptable in anyway.

But given the amount of welfare paid in the UK to so many people , should the UK gov't have said, no we aren't covering these people's pensions, let them rot?

The Fraud compensation fund is there for this reason. The people paid their tax each shift / payroll, same as in some way many people do.

Personally, whilst the reason the issue came about is distasteful, you should be proud that your taxes could be used to support those people that - through no fault of their own - ended up in this situation.

Holding Gardiner accountable is one thing. Doing it by taking pensions from hard working people doesn't do that.

But, yeah, nice pot shot. Keep telling people not to buy 961's. If they understand how near sighted you are on a lot of things - they'll likely see throught it.

Click to expand...

With respect, you are finding suggestions and pot shots that aren’t there.

Kommando’s point was not that the pensioners should have been left high and dry. I can’t imagine any right minded person would think like that ?!

The point of angst is that the person behind it all has very largely gotten away with it. Yes, maybe (only maybe) he’s lost his Aston Martins etc, but otherwise he’s largely unscathed, with zero prison time, and people who had absolutely nothing to do with it at all had to pick up the pieces.

On the other hand, the fact that, as a country, we have processes in place to safeguard people from such sharks, is indeed reassuring, and you're right, we should rightly be proud of that.

Gojuu said:

Bit of luck and even AJD might show her face in here to complete the 961 bagging brigade.

As a genuine suggestion, how about a new forum - “Norton the Company” entirely seperate from the Modern Bike thread? Or are a chosen few still to wedded on the put downs?

Click to expand...

I’m not sure what it would achieve, or what you would like it to achieve?

Generally speaking, creating different forums won’t stop the differences of opinion, or consequent discussions that arise. That’s the nature of a ‘global conversation’.

For example, this thread is already very clearly and correctly titled for its content. Anyone not wishing to discuss such a topic can simply avoid the thread, in just the same way as they would avoid a separate forum.

Anyway, seems to me that the topic of the miss-handling of Donington Norton by Garner is actually one of the few topics on here that there is almost universal agreement on !

Fast Eddie said:

With respect, you are finding suggestions and pot shots that aren’t there.

Kommando’s point was not that the pensioners should have been left high and dry. I can’t imagine any right minded person would think like that ?!

The point of angst is that the person behind it all has very largely gotten away with it. Yes, maybe (only maybe) he’s lost his Aston Martins etc, but otherwise he’s largely unscathed, with zero prison time, and people who had absolutely nothing to do with it at all had to pick up the pieces.

On the other hand, the fact that, as a country, we have processes in place to safeguard people from such sharks, is indeed reassuring, and you're right, we should rightly be proud of that.

Click to expand...

Fast Eddie said:

With respect, you are finding suggestions and pot shots that aren’t there.

Kommando’s point was not that the pensioners should have been left high and dry. I can’t imagine any right minded person would think like that ?!

The point of angst is that the person behind it all has very largely gotten away with it. Yes, maybe (only maybe) he’s lost his Aston Martins etc, but otherwise he’s largely unscathed, with zero prison time, and people who had absolutely nothing to do with it at all had to pick up the pieces.

On the other hand, the fact that, as a country, we have processes in place to safeguard people from such sharks, is indeed reassuring, and you're right, we should rightly be proud of that.

Click to expand...

Disagree.

If there’s no shot - why is a 961 even mentioned.

Gojuu said:

Disagree.

If there’s no shot - why is a 961 even mentioned.

Click to expand...

Because his point is that he’s one of those who is totally uninvolved (ie not even involved enough to be an owner or remotely interested in being one) yet he still had to pick up the tab as a taxpayer.

I could be wrong, and I’m sure he’ll correct me if I am. But that’s how I read it.

Not sure about this instance but it’s been noted (on many occasions) that the small group of vintage lads we know and love, take every opportunity possible to pour negativity over anything ‘modern Norton’ related. No secret there; virtually 100% of posts. That winds some of us up - Gj included. We’re allowed to be negative (which we are - often) cos we own one right; we’re invested!

Lots of comments and digs in the background about the 961 - tank shape, how the bike just looks ‘all wrong’ and jibes at any mention of the word ‘special’ etc, etc and on! Difficult to come from the vintage forum into the modern forum and talk shite about current bikes directly though, without being called a troll.

Comment on modern Norton (the business) is open to every Norton enthusiast though and offers plenty of opportunity for the spreading of that ‘vintage’ love for all things ‘modern’! Hence Gj’s suggestion of an alternate sub-forum I guess. Agreed though, it would’nt work. Conversation would just meander all over the place as it always does.

Fast Eddie said:

The point of angst is that the person behind it all has very largely gotten away with it. Yes, maybe (only maybe) he’s lost his Aston Martins etc, but otherwise he’s largely unscathed, with zero prison time, and people who had absolutely nothing to do with it at all had to pick up the pieces.

Click to expand...

My point, EXACTLY.

Never mind his assets were sheltered (may as well not mind, it won't do you any good), but certainly the magnitude of the outright grand theft far exceeds that of a bank robbery. SIGNIFICANT (10 years) jail time was easily warranted... It's not like the "investment" scheme turned out to be a poorly planned project that failed; it was never a "plan" other than to blindly rip off investors, just like a bank robbery.

Add to that the PITTANCE that many pensioners were granted as "compensation" will hurt and even destroy many lives going forward. Unconscionable.

grandpaul said:

My point, EXACTLY.

Never mind his assets were sheltered (may as well not mind, it won't do you any good), but certainly the magnitude of the outright grand theft far exceeds that of a bank robbery. SIGNIFICANT (10 years) jail time was easily warranted... It's not like the "investment" scheme turned out to be a poorly planned project that failed; it was never a "plan" other than to blindly rip off investors, just like a bank robbery.

Add to that the PITTANCE that many pensioners were granted as "compensation" will hurt and even destroy many lives going forward. Unconscionable.

Click to expand...

ok.

We hear you grandpa.

Any chance you’ll stop now?

Gojuu said:

ok.

We hear you grandpa.

Any chance you’ll stop now?

Click to expand...

Yes.

Yes, there is a CHANCE. Then again, depending on future replies, I see no need; not as long as i don't violate forum rules. You see, I'm based in America, and it is a (mostly) free country.

Feel free to reply...