Starts but won't run

Sgt80 · Dec 1, 2019

BritTwit said:
I'm still wrestling with the same codes 0335, and 0340 on my bike.
Bike runs fine, I clear the codes then go for a ride, come back, and find the same codes again.
I'm thinking that this state may just be a peculiarity of the SCS Delta ECU or how can the bike run so well with the ECU receiving faulty sensor data?
Forum member lcrken has had similar experiences.

I would take your bike out for a short bike and see what happens.
Not farther than you're willing to push the bike back home.

The owner I bought the bike from 2 years ago (one of those guys who put his deposit down and waited 4 years for delivery) mentioned that this bike was like a "Supermodel with low self esteem". I thought, at the time, that it was certainly an amusing statement. I just didn't realize how right on the money he was!
Thanks again BritTwit for your assistance. I'll let you know what happens. We'll get this figured out eventually.

richard-7 · Dec 1, 2019

BritTwit said:
Yes. Helped me find I had a cylinder head temp sensor issue.
It's not a perfect solution though, it just helps to reduce your search for the actual problem.
But it beats the usual; try this, then that, then something else, so on, and so forth....

My ecu keeps raising the crankshaft senor error, I clear it, go for a ride, and ecu reports it again, and again.
Bike runs fine, so don't know what is causing the fault code.

Although I'm saying this — dont be alarmed and start ripping your engine apart — right away!

another Person had this exact issue. Fault codes on crank sensor. Ended up the crank support was loose. Had loose bolts. He also had a nasty vibration. But when he rode another 961 he realized his was really buzzy. So it made sense to tear the engine apart. So if you completely run out of ideas you can give it a look.

Sgt80 · Dec 1, 2019

iwilson said:
They all do this it's nothing to worry about. Just a configuration issue with the ECU. Has no effect on performance etc.

Here's mine.

ECU configuration page - for my SCS programmable version.

OBD configuration page - as you can see the error reporting for those two codes is turned on for 'reasons'... Maybe drop an email to SCS Delta.

richard-7 said:
Although I'm saying this — dont be alarmed and start ripping your engine apart — right away!

another Person had this exact issue. Fault codes on crank sensor. Ended up the crank support was loose. Had loose bolts. He also had a nasty vibration. But when he rode another 961 he realized his was really buzzy. So it made sense to tear the engine apart. So if you completely run out of ideas you can give it a look.

An interesting side note while trying to find out why this bike is "surging" and "bucking" at partial throttle....I have cleaned and checked the gap on both the original NGK's and the Iridium version. They have been re-installed and the bike ridden approx. 30-40 miles with each set of clean plugs. Within this 30-40 miles both plugs already have a nice, dark carbon coating. Any ideas why, after such a short distance, they would have such a coating?

TonyA · Dec 1, 2019

Too much idling , Going too slow , Air filter dirty , O2 sensor faulty ? Not enough steady higher speeds ? How was it running ? Have you tried reading the ODB2 codes ?

Sgt80 · Dec 1, 2019

TonyA said:
Too much idling , Going too slow , Air filter dirty , O2 sensor faulty ? Not enough steady higher speeds ? How was it running ? Have you tried reading the ODB2 codes ?

No,No,No,No,No,"surging" and "bucking" at partial throttle (see above),See page 3 of this discussion.

iwilson · Dec 1, 2019

I'd buy an bluetooth OBD scanner, you can get a cheap EML327 type for about $10. Then install the Torque App on your phone. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.prowl.torque&hl=en there's an iOS version as well.

Gives a huge amount of info in an easy to see format. Will make it a lot easier for you to figure out what's going on.

TonyA · Dec 2, 2019

When you open up the throttle it is good ? Maybe the TPS ? Do you have any spare parts (sensors) to try out ? Might I suggest getting some spare parts to have on hand ? If you want to do your own work you will need a little help and some parts.
- Bosch Cam position sensor (can swap with speedo)
- Bosch or Norton Jumo Head temp sensor
- TPS
- Air Box Temp sensor
- O2 sensor or resistor plugs for trouble shooting
- a couple of relays (all the same on the bike)
- tip over sensor (or resistors cheater plug)
- ODBII scan tool
- DVM for checking voltages and ohming out your wires.

BritTwit · Dec 2, 2019

iwilson said:
OBD configuration page - as you can see the error reporting for those two codes is turned on for 'reasons'... Maybe drop an email to SCS Delta.

Hosted on Fotki

Wilson,

Is your SCS ECU unlocked?
Are you using SCS software?

Will changing the default status of these settings to "disabled" status prevent the ECU from reporting encountered fault codes during actual engine operation?

BritTwit · Dec 2, 2019

SgtUSAF80 said:
No,No,No,No,No,"surging" and "bucking" at partial throttle (see above),See page 3 of this discussion.

Not saying that it is the same issue as yours, but you might want to read the thread and see if you recognize similar problems:

961 - Heavy Misfire - the full kangaroo

https://www.accessnorton.com/NortonCommando/961-heavy-misfire-the-full-kangaroo.27601/

TonyA · Dec 2, 2019

I did not read to the end . Was it a clogged injector for TerryW ? Well you can add that to the list 2 fuel injectors and a billet fuel rail. Again , not terribly expensive , I bought them as well. And easy to service-install . By the way I am still running my original injectors and steel tube fuel rail almost 15K miles soon.

BritTwit · Dec 2, 2019

Tony,

I don't think TerryW or Norton ever resolved the issue, but rather I wondered if the "full kangaroo" as described by TerryW is what SgtUSAF80 was experiencing. The bucking about, and missed ignition pulses and such.

TerryW also reported raw fuel in his airbox - either an injector issue, or an ECU control issue. This is something that SgtUSAF80 may wish to check for, if he hasn't done so already.

TerryW finally arranged a trade-in deal with the Norton factory to replace his 2011 Commando with a 2018 model.

BLIGHTYBRIT/SF · Dec 2, 2019

Link out lamda sensors I say , best thing I’ve done , all sorts of problems if their faulty , need to do it anyway on that age/model bike

iwilson · Dec 2, 2019

BritTwit said:
Hosted on Fotki

Wilson,

Is your SCS ECU unlocked?
Are you using SCS software?

Will changing the default status of these settings to "disabled" status prevent the ECU from reporting encountered fault codes during actual engine operation?

Mine is the programmable version of SC ECU. The software can't be used on the stock ECU as it doesn't have the capability to programmed this way. But in terms of the map it's the same. Turning off those error codes would stop them from reoccurring. I don't know why exactly they pop up, but they don't seem to relate (normally) to an actual fault. But they're not configured to put the engine into a safe mode, so other than popping up on an OBD reader they have no effect on the engine.

BritTwit · Dec 3, 2019

iwilson said:
Mine is the programmable version of SC ECU. The software can't be used on the stock ECU as it doesn't have the capability to programmed this way.....

SCS will unlock the standard Norton ECU for a fee.
They claim that this will allow anyone to use their software to configure the ECU.
Are you saying that you have something different?
A different ECU entirely?

iwilson · Dec 3, 2019

BritTwit said:
SCS will unlock the standard Norton ECU for a fee.
They claim that this will allow anyone to use their software to configure the ECU.
Are you saying that you have something different?
A different ECU entirely?

My ECU is the SCS Delta 400, which can be accessed and adjusted while the engine is running. The stock SC ECU is sufficiently different internally that the maps are not interchangeable. I got this from SCS when I tried loading stock factory maps into SXTune.

That’s because the factory cal files were made for a different ECU!
Norton were supplied with a specific ECU with only the hardware that the bike needed, so the cal did not need to be configured.
Delta 400 is an aftermarket user programmable ECU (plug compatible with the Norton ECU) which can be configured for many different applications.

My understanding was SCS were going to supply Norton with the Delta 400 ECU as an upgrade option for owners, but the relationship soured (surprise, surprise) and Norton switched back to OMEX.

For those with the SC ECU who want to sort their engines out this is a great purchase. With the click of a mouse no more o2 sensors for one! Realistically if you have any plans to fiddle a programmable ECU is a must - and a far superior option to a power commander.

As far as the stock ECU goes Ken (lcrken) got his unlocked so he might know if SXTune works with it and what the limitations are for programming it. I don't have the stock SC ECU anymore my dealer took it off me when they replaced it with an OMEX.

BritTwit · Dec 3, 2019

OK, I remember Ken (lcrken) saying that he bought a D400 from SCS.
It's about $650 I believe.
Not cheap.

iwilson · Dec 3, 2019

BritTwit said:
OK, I remember Ken (lcrken) saying that he bought a D400 from SCS.
It's about $650 I believe.
Not cheap.

No, not cheap but is what it is. Price is long forgotten when the bike is running as well as mine is now! These days if you can't get into the ECU there's very little you can do to change or improve an engine that doesn't involve modifying the programming in the ECU.

Starts but won't run

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