Severe Oil Leak

grandpaul said:

DogT said:

If he offered your money back, TAKE IT.

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YAHTZEE!!!

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YES! Unless you got a really good deal on this bike in the first place...get your money back. Find another one.

As other's have said the story about putting the wrong oil lines on the bike seems a little fishy...then you will start to wonder what else is not right...I see a thread where you are asking about clutch adjustment and shifting problems.

That's not to say you can't start from the ground up and have an awesome motorcycle when your done...but those of us who know will tell you to expect to spend some serious cash...but then for us it's an obsession and desease but your welcome to join the club

I don't know if this applies to Nortons. but my 70 Bonneville suddenly started leaking oil which hit me mostly on my boots. I took the old girl home, and she didn't dissapoint. Oil was dripping on the driveway, and the engine cases were covered in oil, from the front to the back. Nothing on the cylinders' but the lower exhaust was covered. looking at the front of the engine, I noticed oil coming from the tachometer cable....the outer sheathing had pulled out of the Farrell at the housing, the O ring on the tachometer gear was trash, so out she flowed. I think she leaks more oil out the drains and case halves now.
'
Mike

It looks as if the OP has been very lucky in his choice of seller - not everyone would be willing to take the bike back and cancel the sale. My experience of classic bike sellers (and classic bike people in general) has been very positive over the last 40 years or so.

We are fortunate in that good blokes are grossly over represented in our ranks...

Great the O.P. can get made whole ($$$) again.
HOWEVER....
Anytime you start down the road of an old machine being recommisioned, you must perform due diligence. FORTY YEARS of use, misuse, abuse, dormancy, lost interest, lack of/improper maintenance, repairs done poorly/incorrectly, misinformation all conspire to cause trouble. A seller may or may not know about, or even be able know what they're looking at regarding these deficiencies.
Unless you've paid handsomely to purchase a bike COMPLETELY inspected/reconditioned by a knowledgable expert, (CNW comes to mind) then it is wise to SUSPECT EVERYTHING. A pre-purchase inspection by a qualified mechanic is always a good idea. Enter the nostolgic romance of the vintage bike... when we think with our heart, sometimes it's easy to overlook sound reasoning.

JMWO

concours said:

Unless you've paid handsomely to purchase a bike COMPLETELY inspected/reconditioned by a knowledgable expert, (CNW comes to mind) then it is wise to SUSPECT EVERYTHING. A pre-purchase inspection by a qualified mechanic is always a good idea. Enter the nostolgic romance of the vintage bike... when we think with our heart, sometimes it's easy to overlook sound reasoning.

JMWO

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Absolutely! Can't count how many times I have found rodent nests in air cleaners on a simple first inspection. I pulled the dipstick on a bike the other day and a gieser of oil and stale fuel shot into the air. Inspect everything you can before running a new purchase. In this case a little more complicated but a run in the driveway may have given a clue (or noise from the valve train).

Good things to keep in mind and remember. This wasn't my first 40+ year old purchase, and with my experience, which may just be pretty bad as of late, some problems develop quicker than others. On to the next.

sturrubiarte said:

Good things to keep in mind and remember. This wasn't my first 40+ year old purchase, and with my experience, which may just be pretty bad as of late, some problems develop quicker than others. On to the next.

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Search and read, many have gone before you. (I am MOST thankful for this!) Good luck on your search. :mrgreen:

Not sure if anybody else has mentioned it, but those black plastic rocker pipes are notorious for blowing off their connectors when the oil pressure relief valve get “clogged up” with muck from the oil.
This is the large domed nut at the L.H. side of the timing case-you need to unbolt/loosen the large nut – then the inner nut. And carefully dismantle noting where the spring and spacers go before cleaning out and reassembling HTH
P. S. as someone else has stated there is a very good chance of the conrod coming out of the crankcases if big end has been starved of oil, how many miles did you ride before you stopped and found the oil leak, if it was only a couple you may have got away with this, well at the bottom end , the top end has clearly been starved of oil.

I'm curious about a few things:

1) how much did you pay for the bike? If you didnt pay a lot, you might fix it... or if you paid a lot, you should definately return the bike and get your money back if you can.

2)IF these oil lines melted because they are some generic soft plastic lines that the PO put on the bike, What happened to the old lines? and why did he change them to these?

3) also he couldn't have ridden the bike far after he added these lines or they would have melted when he ran the bike, so I wonder if the bike was a real "runner" or just a bike that the PO got as a non-runner and added these lines to complete the bike and then got the bike to run... You should find out the whole story...

*Granted, the bike could have been a "runner" that was a good running bike, and the PO just wanted to add new looking oiling lines to make it look newer, but chose the wrong kind of plastic lines.... Honestly, that chance seems remote to me. IMO, after these lines were added, that bike was only started up to show a potential buyer that the bike ran. No one "rode" this bike any distance with those lines on the bike... And that would make me skeptical of this bike as a "runner" and skeptical of it's value too.

o0norton0o said:

No one "rode" this bike any distance with those lines on the bike... And that would make me skeptical of this bike as a "runner" and skeptical of it's value too.

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+1

This picture is not an engine that just had an oil supply failure. If that was the case, there should still be a fair amount of oil coating the inside of the rocker box, rocker, spring retainer (maybe), spring; and the gasket looks suspiciously dry. The appearance of the rocker towards the right-rear almost displays a rusty patina. Granted, this could be accelerated by high heat, but not good in either case.
I see where the crossover line in the upper-left going across the picture appears to be low temp (we already knew that) vacuum/windshield-washer-fluid hose, and it's held on with a spring clip. The stock nylon line doesn't have/need a clip, as it's insanely tight on the banjo.

My condolences, and I pray that the seller is good on his word to you.

The seller is good for his word. I paid upwards of 7k. Not as much as I've seen these things go for but enough money that this shouldn't have been an issue. As I've mentioned before I've bough older bikes and have a specific run through before I purchase but let it slip this time.

At the end of the day it's my fault for not being more thorough or paying attention to detail, all my past ncos would have a field day with that. Does go to show the amount of money you have to spend to get something in great condition is always higher than you think.

sturrubiarte said:

As I rolled it off the trailer to look over it I never saw a line connecting the two sides of the head. There was only the melted/broken plastic one that is visible from the picture with the oil all over the ground. I did smell smoke from the time it started up and quickly shut off to see if it was just excess being burned off or if there was a leak. No leak identified, until the bad one.

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Post mortem here, is it possible the anti-wetsump valve wasn't opening because of an air bubble in the pump? And only when spun up at highway speed/duration, finally sucked air hard enough to open? (Coupled with the top end oil line being absent, as stated) :?:

sturrubiarte said:

I sincerely appreciate the help but if the motorcycle I bought is that delicate then it's my fault for making a poor choice to purchase and should have stayed with my bullet proof xs11 and just been happy. Guess time will tell the mistake this will amount to.

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The XS1100 is a great bike. I bought one new 35 years ago, rode it 65,000 miles. Even the UJM will fail in a very very fatal/$$$ way if not maintained. Final gear oil changed. MIDDLE gear oil checked/changed... Moly grease applied to the driveshaft spline... Moly grease on the wheel hub spline....
All mentioned in the manual. I've seen so many neglected ones

Little off topic but I've owned two myself, 78, the best, and 79. Previous owner of the 79 drove it for a couple months on 3 barrels. Say what you will but those Japanese bikes can, and do, live through hell and more and can come out still doing ok.

For $7K you shouldn't have had this problem IMO. Looks like a cosmetic rebuild which is sad because when a bike looks good a buyer is prone to not look very close.

That may be less money than other's you have seen, but good ones are out there for less money. Very nice ones will cost a lot more than $7K.

There are seller's out there just trying to turn a profit. It looks like this is the case here. Properly done a Commando is difficult to make money on.

Take your time and keep looking if you really want one. I suspect you will shy away due to this experience, but they are good bikes and a blast to ride.

Ha shy only because it's slim pickens in my region of Texas. If I find one that's worth the dollar, which like another member said "Learned some things to be sure to look at on these bikes", I'll scoop it up. The fact that I'll be moving soon to Colorado won't help either, what with those CNW boys turning everything into extremely expensive, but very nice, bikes.

Although I've had my eye on this one



http://denver.craigslist.org/mcy/5241399746.html

sturrubiarte said:

Although I've had my eye on this one

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Most MkIII owners love them, although there's a running squabble about whether or not it's the slowest model (uptight mufflers?).
Disc brakes on both ends, electric start (once you upgrade the associated pieces) and no worries about which side to shift on. Re-sleeve the front master cylinder for better braking action, and go.

Nathan

Nice, Jubilee paint theme.

MK3 has 20+ lbs on the earlier Commands due to E-Start and related bits.
It may be the slowest of the commands, but certainly the most refined.

lOOKS LIKE AN OIL SLICK UNDER THAT ONE TOO.

Something manageable in my opinion, as compared to my last venture. The add was taken down from craigslist a day or so ago anyway. Too bad.