help in Australia

Rosey said:

Casual
There was a good Norton repair man (even his house was called Norton) here in Sydney but he has retired which is a pity,he did a great job on my 850 head. A friend of mine had his 750 head fitted with bronze inserts in both exhaust ports by a place in Perth W.A .I can get you the details if no one else pipes up. They did a good job.
Sorry you have had to deal with the bearded scumbag BS artist.
Brett

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Thanks brett,im just not sure at present how to go about this but if you post his details I'd be gratefull

kommando said:

I was 99.9% certain it was Les, pity you had to learn the hard way as a single request for info here would have warned you off.

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My situation has moved so quickly in all this that my initial attempt at signing up was left unfinished and as i said earlier it really was only after the purchase that alarm bells started to ring. It is ultimately my fault and if it transpires ( as many suggest) that i dont get my money back ,then I'll just have to live with it.

baz said:

I can't imagine him giving the money back !!!!!

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The engineer did not actually do any tests he made the comment whilst looking at it. Perhaps due to the vug below the threads ( you can actually push a piece of fine wire in to a depth of 4mm) he simply assumed the outcome. Now a couple of posted ways of actually determining if the whole cast is porous, i can check. Many thanks baz

Well we now know he still has that stock or rejected heads so can still recommend not going near Les with a bargepole.

If the thread is the only issue then I think it can be used as is or new threads installed, the threads wearing out is a common issue so the fix is available. The factory did have a run of porous heads giving issues with oil leaks from odd places on the head. Their cure was to have the heads injected with a resin to fill the voids and stop the leaks.

The process was similar to this one

Regarding the threads, so long as a rose screws in ok I’d personally be very happy to use that. There are loads of good threads.

Regarding the potential porosity, I can’t comment.

baz said:

Please DO NOT use Norton's own thread destroying exhaust lock tab washers

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I actually started this whole eppisode with the thought that it would be a great idea to have a ready to go head in case of emergency . It would now seem ive created a bigger problem thru my own ignorrance lol. The real benefit to me now is knowing there are so many knowlegabe people around, that in an emergency i can get advice. I'm really not a tech guy and have basic mech skills But i sure do like riding my bike, ive had a few but nothing compares to the lightfooted sureness of a norton and the absolute blast of that motor. This is a hell of a way to meet all you people.thanks baz

Fast Eddie said:

Regarding the threads, so long as a rose screws in ok I’d personally be very happy to use that. There are loads of good threads.

Regarding the potential porosity, I can’t comment.

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Looking at the rest of the threads they seem fine.i have been told that a bronze rose will stay tighter without extra wire etc. Problem is who sells those???

Casual said:

I actually started this whole eppisode with the thought that it would be a great idea to have a ready to go head in case of emergency . It would now seem ive created a bigger problem thru my own ignorrance lol. The real benefit to me now is knowing there are so many knowlegabe people around, that in an emergency i can get advice. I'm really not a tech guy and have basic mech skills But i sure do like riding my bike, ive had a few but nothing compares to the lightfooted sureness of a norton and the absolute blast of that motor. This is a hell of a way to meet all you people.thanks baz

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Luckily on this site there are some really knowledgeable people
Nobody is born with this knowledge and we all make mistakes, looking at the photos of the exhaust threads it's not the end of the world
Hopefully the porosity is not bad enough in the wrong places
Cheers

kommando said:

Well we now know he still has that stock or rejected heads so can still recommend not going near Les with a bargepole.

If the thread is the only issue then I think it can be used as is or new threads installed, the threads wearing out is a common issue so the fix is available. The factory did have a run of porous heads giving issues with oil leaks from odd places on the head. Their cure was to have the heads injected with a resin to fill the voids and stop the leaks.

The process was similar to this one

What is Porosity Sealing? - ISL Impregnation Services

During the casting process, small voids or holes can form in materials when changing from a liquid form to a solid state, this is called micro-porosity. Despite these small holes being hard to see, they have the ability to cause detrimental effects to the quality of the finished product...

www.impregnation.co.uk

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Well kommando ,i guess my way forward is to take advice, check to see if the whole head is truely porous and procced from there. I have sent 2 messages to norvil but have had no reply.thanks

I use the RGM nuts recommended by Jim Comstock in the test below. You do also need to buy their dedicated spanner, which is great and really allows you tight tighten ‘em in proper. I don’t use any lock tabs or lock wire on mine, just a smear of copper grease. Remember to tighten them up when warm. And ideally with the engine running (the vibes act kinda like an impact wrench).

baz said:

Luckily on this site there are some really knowledgeable people
Nobody is born with this knowledge and we all make mistakes, looking at the photos of the exhaust threads it's not the end of the world
Hopefully the porosity is not bad enough in the wrong places
Cheers

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Yep ,maybe a little rattle isnt the end of the world

Fast Eddie said:

I use the RGM nuts recommended by Jim Comstock in the test below. You do also need to buy their dedicated spanner, which is great and really allows you tight tighten ‘em in proper. I don’t use any lock tabs or lock wire on mine, just a smear of copper grease. Remember to tighten them up when warm. And ideally with the engine running (the vibes act kinda like an impact wrench).

Exhaust nuts and expansion

I have heard a lot of tails about exhaust nuts so I did a simple test. And no I don't get any special deals on RGM nuts, but I do recommend them from my experience.

www.accessnorton.com

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Thanks ,ill get onto that.

Casual said:

My situation has moved so quickly in all this that my initial attempt at signing up was left unfinished and as i said earlier it really was only after the purchase that alarm bells started to ring. It is ultimately my fault and if it transpires ( as many suggest) that i dont get my money back ,then I'll just have to live with it.

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Welcome Casual,
How did you pay for it? Credit cards and Paypal have buyer protection, so it may be worth following up that way?

I'd have a really good look and a gentle poke around in case there are other cavities as yet unseen.

Cheers,

cliffa.

If I remember correctly (sorry, but I'm not inclined to pull it apart to check). one of my ports had only about half the threads of any use where I assume a previous owner had let the others 'chatter' away...
But those left have been sufficient to keep the pipe in place for the past ten years without any undue attention or aftermarket locking devices, just a hefty tug when hot with a decent exhaust rose spanner...

cliffa said:

Welcome Casual,
How did you pay for it? Credit cards and Paypal have buyer protection, so it may be worth following up that way?

I'd have a really good look and a gentle poke around in case there are other cavities as yet unseen.

Cheers,

cliffa.

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Yep paypal,and still looking for a way to get a definitive test. Thanks

EstuaryBoy said:

If I remember correctly (sorry, but I'm not inclined to pull it apart to check). one of my ports had only about half the threads of any use where I assume a previous owner had let the others 'chatter' away...
But those left have been sufficient to keep the pipe in place for the past ten years without any undue attention or aftermarket locking devices, just a hefty tug when hot with a decent exhaust rose spanner...

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Thanks mate

Your problem with Paypal etc will come if they tell you the head has to be returned to Norvil before the refund is issued with proof of delivery. They know all the tricks and in the UK with Covid courier deliveries are currently made without signature needed. I would expect them to make full use of this, not sign for the delivery so no proof of delivery, and so you potentially end up with no head and no refund.

I cannot overstate the potential effort Les will go to so he can wriggle out.

Remember he told you it was a new head he manufactured and not a rejected porous head, that is the level he stoops to.

kommando said:

I cannot overstate the potential effort Les will go to so he can wriggle out.

Remember he told you it was a new head he manufactured and not a rejected porous head, that is the level he stoops to.

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If you have written proof that he said that, then it falls under the trade descriptions act, as you have the proof.

Bernhard said:

If you have written proof that he said that, then it falls under the trade descriptions act, as you have the proof.

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Legal redress from outside the UK is impossible without exposing you to significant costs. Within the UK you have access to the small claims where the consumer is only ever exposed to their own costs which if they self represent is only their own time.

Bernhard said:

If you have written proof that he said that, then it falls under the trade descriptions act, as you have the proof.

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As i tried to go back to sleep a number of things were swirling in my brain. A number of members asked how the engineer tested the head for porosity. He didnt test it. He simply stated porous head. Now i dont know why he said that.So the reality is i have no actuall submissable evidence that proves the head is porous,simply an opinion, which by the way kommando, means there is no evidence to conclude that this head is from the original batch. Ive probably made things worse now telling norvil what the engineer said. Secondly i have checked the paypal site and they do require the item returned and i appreciate that no proof of delivery means no help from paypal. So really it looks to me as though, unless norvil decide to agree to a refund ( which,if i had any chance ive ruined it by mentioning porosity prior to having actual proof) i havnt got a legal case. Which leads me right back to the start of this thread,where i am trying to find a suitable engineer over here to assess the head. At some point last night Full Auto posted something on this thread ,but i cant find it. That may have been the advice I'm after ( could you repost,FullAuto?). As to legal action ,i doubt id waste my time or money after reading all the stuff about norvil. Id be better off finding out the true condition and then make a ballanced decission.Onethings for sure,i really struck a nerve in this community by raising this issue, I do regret wasting so much of everyones time on this and once i can see a way forward i look forward to getting back to the real reason this forum exists,which as i seeit is to share information on our bikes. Thanks to all and if anyone comes up with an engineers name on the east coast I'd appreciate it . Many thanks casual

If you do go ahead and use it as is and you are concerned about the thread, have a look at the nice brackets concours made ...


It's a great Idea, which I will replicate one day as it relieves the load on the collars. ( as mentioned on that thread why didn't the factory do that from the outset?)