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Stephen_Spencer said:

Bye bye previously agreed spares access. Each dealer likely dealing with Donny owner spares requests as they see fit.

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This is the kind of stuff that makes me angry with Norton .

Called Judd, spares (Owen) about the above parts. He was helpful if a little cagey:

- He recognised my overseas number and seemed a little reluctant to discuss.
- Recognised which footpeg parts I required, they’ve supplied quite a few (I guess for Solihull bikes).
- Said he needed to go back to Norton for availability and price. Brush-off? Suspect that may be the last I hear from him; we’ll see.
- Told me Norton seem to be sending most enquiries through Judd which he said was good, but they were short of some spares and Norton were slow to ressuply. May have been another brush-off.
- He reminded me they sell the new bike which seemed to be a hint that spares for Solihull bikes come first (understandable).

Called Oakmere, spares (Paul) - he recognised my overseas number and dodgy Lancastrian accent.

- Sounds like they are processing all spares requests back through Norton - like a post box rather than full parts supply system. Difficult to tell though from the little I gleaned.
- Norton are slow to reply to their requests with price and availability.
- When asked about Donington bikes he also added that an assessment of whether they would fit was part of the price/availability request.

Late here - I’ll give it some more thought tomorrow.

Stephen_Spencer said:

Called Judd, spares (Owen) about the above parts. He was helpful if a little cagey:

- He recognised my overseas number and seemed a little reluctant to discuss.
- Recognised which footpeg parts I required, they’ve supplied quite a few (I guess for Solihull bikes).
- Said he needed to go back to Norton for availability and price. Brush-off? Suspect that may be the last I hear from him; we’ll see.
- Told me Norton seem to be sending most enquiries through Judd which he said was good, but they were short of some spares and Norton were slow to ressuply. May have been another brush-off.
- He reminded me they sell the new bike which seemed to be a hint that spares for Solihull bikes come first (understandable).

Called Oakmere, spares (Paul) - he recognised my overseas number and dodgy Lancastrian accent.

- Sounds like they are processing all spares requests back through Norton - like a post box rather than full parts supply system. Difficult to tell though from the little I gleaned.
- Norton are slow to reply to their requests with price and availability.
- When asked about Donington bikes he also added that an assessment of whether they would fit was part of the price/availability request.

Late here - I’ll give it some more thought tomorrow.

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Thanks for checking .

TonyA said:

Thanks for checking .

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All good Tony,

Not sure that we are any wiser about the spares situation though. Let’s face it, our original ‘understanding’ with Norton was informal at best; my ‘bye bye’ comment above was maybe premature though. I suspect changes at Norton (production and the dealer network) have just changed the reality - and maybe our original access was badly communicated to dealers.

We are still the red headed step children of course; I think we’ve just moved further down the inheritance list. Spares enquiries to a dealer place us in their busy workflow (multiple marques), before entering a likely busy Norton system. Norton’s priorities are doubtless production first, Solihull bike owners second - whilst maintaining a spares level to support both - before we get a look in.

We likely continue to be a concern for Norton/TVS as holding spares costs money; ordering new by batch qty only. The Solihull 961 production run is gonna be limited, as advertised, so we may end up in a situation where there are more Donny bikes out there than Solihull machines. Maintaining 10+ years parts supply for Solihull bikes is Norton’s responsibility. To do so for Donington bikes is not, from a purely hard nosed business perspective. We also don’t know who’s pulling the strings.

At this stage I think the only option is to continue to process spares requests through a dealer and try to be patient, whilst supporting our other sources (Stu, Ollie etc). If a member is off the road for spares, post on this forum and the FB site - ya ever know your luck. Situation - no change!

Stephen_Spencer said:

All good Tony,

Not sure that we are any wiser about the spares situation though. Let’s face it, our original ‘understanding’ with Norton was informal at best; my ‘bye bye’ comment above was maybe premature though. I suspect changes at Norton (production and the dealer network) have just changed the reality - and maybe our original access was badly communicated to dealers.

We are still the red headed step children of course; I think we’ve just moved further down the inheritance list. Spares enquiries to a dealer place us in their busy workflow (multiple marques), before entering a likely busy Norton system. Norton’s priorities are doubtless production first, Solihull bike owners second - whilst maintaining a spares level to support both - before we get a look in.

We likely continue to be a concern for Norton/TVS as holding spares costs money; ordering new by batch qty only. The Solihull 961 production run is gonna be limited, as advertised, so we may end up in a situation where there are more Donny bikes out there than Solihull machines. Maintaining 10+ years parts supply for Solihull bikes is Norton’s responsibility. To do so for Donington bikes is not, from a purely hard nosed business perspective. We also don’t know who’s pulling the strings.

At this stage I think the only option is to continue to process spares requests through a dealer and try to be patient, whilst supporting our other sources (Stu, Ollie etc). If a member is off the road for spares, post on this forum and the FB site - ya ever know your luck. Situation - no change!

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Maintaining supply chains for legacy spares (ie spares for obsolete models) is incredibly expensive for any OEM. They all hate doing it.

When production is flowing, suppliers get screwed down to the absolute minimum on price by OEMs (they are often VERY unfair / ruthless and Garner was excellent at this), but suppliers put up with it as the steady flow and volume allows for some profit (or at least that’s what they’re promised). As soon as that flow and volume stops, so does their profit margin. Disrupting otherwise profitable business to gear up for small ad hoc batches is a total pain in the arse for them and is only remotely viable if priced accordingly.

And that’s just the individual supplier. Managing the (global) supply chain, the sales and ordering, the inventory, building / filling / operating warehouses etc all costs money. This is why OEM spare parts are so expensive even for mass produced vehicles.

Doing all of this for a previous entity, for which you have no obligation, that kept incredibly poor records of running design changes etc, would make this exponentially worse. And doing so for a product that had such low numbers must just kill the whole idea.

TVS Norton were fairly clear in their written statements IIRC, stating that they would not support Donington era bikes. They seemingly unofficially relaxed this a little for a while, and I personally suspect that they may have been bitten by customers complaining that they’ve bought parts that don’t fit right etc. So have now decided to leave the decision as to what to supply to who to the dealers. I would advise continuing with a cautious approach here as they could quite easily impose an outright ban by only selling specific parts for specific VIN numbers. Meaning, no TVS VIN number = no parts for you.

My belief (experience based only, no evidence) is that TVS have looked into this whole spare parts issue and concluded that trying to support Donington era customers is just not viable for them, it exposes them to too many problems and potential liabilities and simply soaks up too much ‘bandwidth’ for them. Their focus will understandably be on looking after their own.

And personally I wouldn’t blame them if that’s the case. What I do blame them for is the dreadful way they have handled and communicated this (or not) and left you guys in a very precarious and uncertain situation. Also the way they have treated those who do try and step into this space. The irony for me, here as none invested observer, is that this was Voodoos point, a point for which he simply got labelled negative.

Nevertheless, you are where you are, and yooz guyz need to get behind hero’s like Stu and Ollie 200%. They are your only realistic hope of being able to continue to use and enjoy your machines as intended IMO.

Fast Eddie said:

Maintaining supply chains for legacy spares (ie spares for obsolete models) is incredibly expensive for any OEM. They all hate doing it.

When production is flowing, suppliers get screwed down to the absolute minimum on price by OEMs (they are often VERY unfair / ruthless and Garner was excellent at this), but suppliers put up with it as the steady flow and volume allows for some profit (or at least that’s what they’re promised). As soon as that flow and volume stops, so does their profit margin. Disrupting otherwise profitable business to gear up for small ad hoc batches is a total pain in the arse for them and is only remotely viable if priced accordingly.

And that’s just the individual supplier. Managing the (global) supply chain, the sales and ordering, the inventory, building / filling / operating warehouses etc all costs money. This is why OEM spare parts are so expensive even for mass produced vehicles.

Doing all of this for a previous entity, for which you have no obligation, that kept incredibly poor records of running design changes etc, would make this exponentially worse. And doing so for a product that had such low numbers must just kill the whole idea.

TVS Norton were fairly clear in their written statements IIRC, stating that they would not support Donington era bikes. They seemingly unofficially relaxed this a little for a while, and I personally suspect that they may have been bitten by customers complaining that they’ve bought parts don’t fit right etc. So have now decided to leave the decision as to what to supply to who to the dealers. I would advise continuing with a curious approach here as they could quite easily impose an outright ban by only selling specific parts for specific VIN numbers. Meaning, no TVS VIN number = no parts for you.

I believe (experience based belief only, no evidence) is that TVS have looked into this whole spare parts issue and concluded that trying to support Donington era customers is just not viable for them, it exposes them to too many problems and potential liabilities and simply soaks up too much ‘bandwidth’ for them. Their focus will understandably be on looking after their own.

And personally I don’t blame them! What I do blame them for is the dreadful way they have handled and communicated this (or not) and left you guys in a very precarious and uncertain situation. Also the way they have treated those who do try and step into this space. The irony for me, here as none invested observer, is that this was Voodoos point, a point for which he simply got labelled negative.

Nevertheless, you are where you are, and yooz guyz need to get behind hero’s like Stu and Ollie 200%. They are your only realistic hope of being able to continue to use and enjoy your machines as intended IMHO.

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Agreed FE, although we had an (albeit informal) understanding (in writing - on this site) that we would have access to all 961 spares that have been through Norton’s quality system, with the caveat that there was no guarantee that they would fit. This was working for a period; I and other members received spares without too much difficulty.

The situation appears to have changed again now spares are being processed through the dealer network. The arrangement may just have been badly communicated (they have form), or they may have just left our priority so low such that we’re likely to suffer extended delays. They may even put a premium on parts for legacy machines - who knows. And yes, Norton/TVS may also have revisited this and decided it is no longer viable from a business perspective.

Norton has been widely criticised on this forum for their poor communication as you know, especially in the area of spares but in others to - yes, even by me! Agreed also, if things have changed there should be a clear policy for the sale of spares to legacy owners. There isn’t, which is poor to say the least; some here have tried to actively resolve the spares issues on multiple ocassions so it’s pretty disheartening. In the end, Norton may simply say that there is no change - we were warned of the possibility of extended wait times. Not sure where this leaves us, but treading lightly is good advice.

There was plenty of negativity about of course which extended far beyond just spares, or any one individual. That is what it is - in the end though its personal choice right. We’re a bunch of mainly 60+ years olds - we make our own decisions.

Stephen_Spencer said:

Agreed FE, although we had an (albeit informal) understanding (in writing - on this site) that we would have access to all 961 spares that have been through Norton’s quality system, with the caveat that there was no guarantee that they would fit. This was working for a period; I and other members received spares without too much difficulty.

The situation appears to have changed again now spares are being processed through the dealer network. The arrangement may just have been badly communicated (they have form), or they may have just left our priority so low such that we’re likely to suffer extended delays. They may even put a premium on parts for legacy machines - who knows. And yes, Norton/TVS may also have revisited this and decided it is no longer viable from a business perspective.

Norton has been widely criticised on this forum for their poor communication as you know, especially in the area of spares but in others to - yes, even by me! Agreed also, if things have changed there should be a clear policy for the sale of spares to legacy owners. There isn’t, which is poor to say the least; some here have tried to actively resolve the spares issues on multiple ocassions so it’s pretty disheartening. In the end, Norton may simply say that there is no change - we were warned of the possibility of extended wait times. Not sure where this leaves us, but treading lightly is good advice.

There was plenty of negativity about of course which extended far beyond just spares, or any one individual. That is what it is - in the end though its personal choice right. We’re a bunch of mainly 60+ years olds - we make our own decisions.

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Wanna buy two low mile 961 bikes? One a 2016 SF, the other a 2017 Domi Naked. I’ll sell them 2 for 1.
Both are in the 300 mile range. I haven’t ridden either of them in at least 2 years.

I’m done with them, just seeing them sit there is ridiculous. I’m going the classic route, at least with the classic, they have a ton of parts available, more dependable and more interesting.

In my opinion, TVS could have really of done some great things. I’m not gonna make my first comment here in a long time a rant, but as I said many times in the pass, they ruined a good thing.

Voodooo said:

Wanna buy two low mile 961 bikes? One a 2016 SF, the other a 2017 Domi Naked. I’ll sell them 2 for 1.
Both are in the 300 mile range. I haven’t ridden either of them in at least 2 years.

I’m done with them, just seeing them sit there is ridiculous. I’m going the classic route, at least with the classic, they have a ton of parts available, more dependable and more interesting.

In my opinion, TVS could have really of done some great things. I’m not gonna make my first comment here in a long time a rant, but as I said many times in the pass, they ruined a good thing.

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Reckon you’ll get the best price if you break ‘em for spares !!

I was getting my Cafe Racer MOT'd earlier this year at a large branded dealer in Scotland and the owner was chatting to me and disclosed they had applied for a dealership/franchise and the hoops they had to jump through was incredible. For example, they (Norton) want to be situated within a dealership that sells premium cars....WTF?! Since that conversation happened, a dealership opened up in Scotland, guess where.....in a used car dealership.

Madness.

Voodooo said:

Wanna buy two low mile 961 bikes? One a 2016 SF, the other a 2017 Domi Naked. I’ll sell them 2 for 1.
Both are in the 300 mile range. I haven’t ridden either of them in at least 2 years.

I’m done with them, just seeing them sit there is ridiculous. I’m going the classic route, at least with the classic, they have a ton of parts available, more dependable and more interesting.

In my opinion, TVS could have really of done some great things. I’m not gonna make my first comment here in a long time a rant, but as I said many times in the pass, they ruined a good thing.

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I’d give my first born, left testicles and yes, maybe even my right (to be overly optimistic), to have a Domi in my garage! Not gonna happen any time soon!

On the optimism front though, a little premature maybe to say that Norton has ruined anything just yet, until they present their first new models to the world at the fast approaching NEC. The success (or otherwise) of these variants will go a long way to telling the story of Norton’s future. Vital that they get this release right. Plus, whatever activity we see coming out of Honsur.

Stephen_Spencer said:

I’d give my first born, left testicles and yes, maybe even my right (to be overly optimistic), to have a Domi in my garage! Not gonna happen any time soon!

On the optimism front though, a little premature maybe to say that Norton has ruined anything just yet, until they present their first new models to the world at the fast approaching NEC. The success (or otherwise) of these variants will go a long way to telling the story of Norton’s future. Vital that they get this release right. Plus, whatever activity we see coming out of Honsur.

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Wanna buy a bridge? Cheap.
How much longer are you going to buy into this pipe dream?

Cheers for the support guys, and I think I'm pretty safe to say thank you on behalf of Ollie too!
Ollie has been a great help with parts to my customers, and I've returned the help to him with some hard to find parts too. Brexit is a bind in that import duty does bump those prices up (I actually took a 5hr detour from a wedding in Germany two years ago to collect stock from Ollie to try and keep costs down). Norton are determined to not assist either of us in any way...to date the only parts I've bought from Norton was a selection of parts to finish my Domi, via a mate, and that was way back when Maria and Gaz were still doing parts from the temporary site at Raynesway, Derby. It does slow me down in the workshop, waiting for some parts....but I'm stubborn enough to not let it beat me, if anything it spurs me on to succeed with or without them.
I've contemplating breaking bikes for parts...but as a long term solution, that would certainly be like shooting myself in the foot. Crashed bikes on the otherhand, I'll buy anything and everything. The last one, I had them going through the skip to retrieve any damaged parts that they'd slung...it may be damaged, but there may be a part on there that would get an owner out the shit.

Stu Bodycote said:

Cheers for the support guys, and I think I'm pretty safe to say thank you on behalf of Ollie too!
Ollie has been a great help with parts to my customers, and I've returned the help to him with some hard to find parts too. Brexit is a bind in that import duty does bump those prices up (I actually took a 5hr detour from a wedding in Germany two years ago to collect stock from Ollie to try and keep costs down). Norton are determined to not assist either of us in any way...to date the only parts I've bought from Norton was a selection of parts to finish my Domi, via a mate, and that was way back when Maria and Gaz were still doing parts from the temporary site at Raynesway, Derby. It does slow me down in the workshop, waiting for some parts....but I'm stubborn enough to not let it beat me, if anything it spurs me on to succeed with or without them.
I've contemplating breaking bikes for parts...but as a long term solution, that would certainly be like shooting myself in the foot. Crashed bikes on the otherhand, I'll buy anything and everything. The last one, I had them going through the skip to retrieve any damaged parts that they'd slung...it may be damaged, but there may be a part on there that would get an owner out the shit.

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Norton should be keeping people like me sweet when it comes to supplying parts for my 961.
If god forbid anything happens to my present Norton due they think that I would be a ready new customer!

Voodooo said:

Wanna buy a bridge? Cheap.
How much longer are you going to buy into this pipe dream?

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Hi Voodooo , It's looking more and more like you may be correct. New bikes will come from Norton eventually , but will they be good and will I want to buy it ? I have emailed Judd Racing yesterday and will let this forum know what they say.

TonyA said:

Hi Voodooo , It's looking more and more like you may be correct. New bikes will come from Norton eventually , but will they be good and will I want to buy it ? I have emailed Judd Racing yesterday and will let this forum know what they say.

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I gave up waiting long ago. I’m sorry, but I’m also done with all the “optimistic” promises from TVS Norton.
Stephen says “little premature”. How the hell is 4 years a little premature?

Life’s to short to wait and see what they have planned, or lack of.
It’s been over 4 years. No renderings, no photos, no news, etc
Too many other brands have something available to offer in the current or future and they have no problem showing and telling.

Even Garner shown and told.

Voodooo said:

I gave up waiting long ago. I’m sorry, but I’m also done with all the “optimistic” promises from TVS Norton.
Stephen says “little premature”. How the hell is 4 years a little premature?

Life’s to short to wait and see what they have planned, or lack of.
It’s been over 4 years. No renderings, no photos, no news, etc
Too many other brands have something available to offer in the current or future and they have no problem showing and telling.

Even Garner shown and told.

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Hi Voodooo , Nobody has to wait , there are other good bikes out there to buy and ride . I guess it's just wishful thinking that Norton will finally come through. They are either too expensive or not good enough , take your pick I suppose . Here's to wishful thinking .

TonyA said:

Hi Voodooo , Nobody has to wait , there are other good bikes out there to buy and ride . I guess it's just wishful thinking that Norton will finally come through. They are either too expensive or not good enough , take your pick I suppose . Here's to wishful thinking .

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What would it take to get you on a brand new Norton?

Cafe bike trend is dying off for now. The new trend is desert sleds and adventure bikes. Is Norton going to offer one or ?

Voodooo said:

What would it take to get you on a brand new Norton?

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A dealer here for starters and more disposable income in the bank !

TonyA said:

Hi Voodooo , It's looking more and more like you may be correct. New bikes will come from Norton eventually , but will they be good and will I want to buy it ? I have emailed Judd Racing yesterday and will let this forum know what they say.

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I am placing an order with Judd Racing soon. I have gotten a good response thus far and will be moving forward with this. I am planning some head work (porting) and wanted new parts to install after I did this. I will keep you guys posted . This is Owen I contacted , so all is good with Judd atm !

Hi Anthony,

Please see attached prices for your Norton 961 parts, all prices are including VAT and for all quantity's you require

Intake valve - £45.92
Exhaust valve - £58.34
Intake valve spring - £20.33
Exhaust Valve spring - £33.54
Valve spring retainer - £18.66
Valve collets - £10.80

TonyA said:

I am placing an order with Judd Racing soon. I have gotten a good response thus far and will be moving forward with this. I am planning some head work (porting) and wanted new parts to install after I did this. I will keep you guys posted . This is Owen I contacted , so all is good with Judd atm !

Hi Anthony,

Please see attached prices for your Norton 961 parts, all prices are including VAT and for all quantity's you require

Intake valve - £45.92
Exhaust valve - £58.34
Intake valve spring - £20.33
Exhaust Valve spring - £33.54
Valve spring retainer - £18.66
Valve collets - £10.80

Click to expand...

They should not be charging VAT to an ex-UK customer, so ask them to knock 20% off those prices.