Clutch rod oil seal and more

I have the design pretty well finished, I still have to make the adjuster and finish measuring everything as well as making flats so I can tighten it down, but I think it will work out. I will safety wire it in place to make sure it doesn't come off and ruin my day As far as I know, the center nut does not have to deal with great stresses besides the one required to release the clutch so even an alloy nut should be good enough. In my friend's shop there is a Norton with a cluch so effortless you could swear it was on a 50cc yet it does not slip at all, I am shooting for something as good if not better.

Jean

Hi Jean. I am impressed with your project, I am going to machine up a nut to screw on the shaft with a seal but I like your thrust bearing set up. Would you be offended if I copied your idea?
Ian

hi jean, i like the thrust bearing idea but how are you going to lube it,are you running a wet clutch

Scruff said:

Hi Jean. I am impressed with your project, I am going to machine up a nut to screw on the shaft with a seal but I like your thrust bearing set up. Would you be offended if I copied your idea?
Ian

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Not at all, if I wanted to keep it a secret, I would not have put pictures in a public forum. I will post pictures of the finished product as soon as it is completed.

Jean

chris plant said:

hi jean, i like the thrust bearing idea but how are you going to lube it,are you running a wet clutch

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The Norton clutch is supposed to be a dry clutch... mine I hope will be bone dry since it will run exposed. A drop of oil or grease will be enough to lube the bearing, after all it is only turning when the clutch is pulled in.

Jean

I don't think the loading of the nut should be a problem but the accel /decel of the mainshaft against the clutch center can jar it into loosening up. Norton changed the method of retaining this nut a couple times. I did have mine loosen up when the bike was brand new with about 2000 miles on it and when I went to pull in the clutch lever after miles of highway riding, there was nothing there. I have been using the later tab washer to keep it together but I have read that blue loc-tite alone seems to work well also.

After looking at your idea and the nice work I'm sure you probably know all this and have a plan in mind.

batrider said:

I don't think the loading of the nut should be a problem but the accel /decel of the mainshaft against the clutch center can jar it into loosening up. Norton changed the method of retaining this nut a couple times. I did have mine loosen up when the bike was brand new with about 2000 miles on it and when I went to pull in the clutch lever after miles of highway riding, there was nothing there. I have been using the later tab washer to keep it together but I have read that blue loc-tite alone seems to work well also.

After looking at your idea and the nice work I'm sure you probably know all this and have a plan in mind.

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Since I am of the belt and suspender type, I will safety wire it in place as mentionned and also use locktite, that should do it.

Jean

Jean, I wish you were my neighbour.

I'm with Coco...

Nice work mate. BMWs used a very similar design as do both of my changs which, after all, are a bMW design. I lube those bearings with high temp wheel bearing grease as it stays put, takes the heat, and has not yet migrated to clutch plates.

It certainly looks the part, but I have to say, is there a problem with the standard arrangement? I dont think so!

The saying "Dont try fixing what is'nt broken" comes to mind.

I do appreciate the seal part though.

Regards

Bob.

What does the stock setup look like? Does the pushrod just rub against the clutch center?

The thrust bearing is exactly like how it is on a Bultaco.

The pushrod pushes against the adjustment screw on the stock unit.

Cookie said:

The pushrod pushes against the adjustment screw on the stock unit.

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So no bearing or anything, just a dab o' grease? Is there much wear there?

In theory after you push on the clutch the rotation should stop (unless I'm having another senile day.) In the years I ran Nortons I had to adjust now and again but I never replaced a rod or screw.
I did , however, replace cables, plates, and I think the spring plate once. I just oringed mine and put some wheel bearing grease on it. When Jean is done he will have a ting of beauty that should survice several centuries.

If the goal is to reduce the friction and pull of the clutch, I think that an o-ring would be less desirable than the seal. Of course we are, as they say, probably splitting hairs.

Jean, you should probably ask comnoz how to market your parts through someone like CNW.

Very nice, but why not simply use the Dave Corneau pushrod seal like the rest of us (including CNW)? :?

Debby

I'll be very interested to see what Jean comes up with, it's a thing of beauty and very creative. He makes me feel like I work with a sledgehammer.
Interestingly enough on Honda's first try at reducing Goldwing clutch effort they just went to the longest clutch lever I've ever seen. It works but you have to remember to pull way out on the lever. Later they went to hydraulic.

debby said:

Very nice, but why not simply use the Dave Corneau pushrod seal like the rest of us (including CNW)? :?

Debby

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Because that's just an o-ring holder. Jean's solution incorporates a bearing at the end of the pushrod (plus the seal behind the bearing) to theoretically reduce the friction of the clutch actuation process. If you've been that far into your Bultaco clutch it should look familiar.

debby said:

Very nice, but why not simply use the Dave Corneau pushrod seal like the rest of us (including CNW)? :?

Debby

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We ALL want our bikes to be different than the guy next door, that could be a snotty answer, but the real answer is more down to earth. My café racer ( see http://www.pbase.com/jeandr/cafe_racer ) is different in many respects, one of which seems to be the front belt alignment. To get the right tracking, I had to put a few more spacers behind the clutch to bring it out a bit more, that left no threads on the end of the mainshaft onto which an o-ring holder could be screwed on. Since I am running an open primary I didn't want any oil to ooze out and gum up te clutch plates. I feel a real oil seal is better than a crushed o-ring, and since I am starting with a clean sheet, why not do something different?

Although I have no links, I have heard there is someone in Australia or New Zeland who makes a radial throwout bearing to make clutch operation smoother and again starting with a clean sheet, why not incorporate that to an oil seal holder?

To answer another question "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", we have ALL had a clutch cable break and I feel it is a hard pull causing this to happen, the solutions are try to get the easiest clutch pull by having the right stack height and reduce frictions where ever they may occur OR go to an hydraulic clutch like the one Jim Comstock has developped for CNW. To get a classic look, hydraulics are out.(I am even running drum brakes so having an hydraulic reservoir on the left would look really weird).

Jean