Ignition Advice Needed

[DaveinCanada]

@marshg246 Completed post #35 - Here are the results:

Tested signal housing to battery positive - red light
Tested signal housing to centre connector - green light
Tested Centre connector to battery positive - green light

What does this tell you and what do I have to do?

 

[Tornado]

With the stock lucas flasher, I was fooled into thinking it was not working. Replaced it with a modern two prong automotive flasher and everything worked well on my 74 850, positive earth bike. Later testing showed the oem lucas was ok as well, but the bike battery level had dropped too much during testing things and was not enough to make the lucas unit work...so watch out for low batt voltage conditions when testing older tech components.

Never found any modern two prong flashers, electro-mechanical or fully solid state, had problems with the stock bike, positive earth etc. Maybe I'm F.O.S.?

 

[marshg246]

@marshg246 I've made progress and completed post #25. I connected the white with green/brown wires as you said. Disconnected the amber indicator light. When I move the signal switch on the handlebars, I get the left and right signal bulbs lighting up respectively. Woohoo.

Onto post #35 using my tester. Do I keep the white and green/brown wires connected with the paperclip or do I put the flasher relay back in place before doing the tests? Do I also need to reconnect the amber indicator wires?

Since the turn signals light now correctly when you select them, no need for #35. Just put the flasher back in a see what happens. If it is similar to what @L.A.B. found, I do not expect it to work. A standard Lucas flasher also will not flash (will just stay on) as they require the load of both a front and rear turn signal.

 

[DaveinCanada]

@marshg246 SUCCESS! I connected a flasher relay and I now have signal indicators flashing. Thank you (and everyone else) for your advice to help me get through this. I really appreciate it.

 

[DaveinCanada]

@marshg246 @L.A.B. I have a question about the fuel line from the carbs to the tank. The two banjo fittings that screw into the carburetors has a small piece of hose between them. I need to replace the whole assembly (banjo broke, hose is brittle). Is the small connector hose between the banjos necessary? Can I use a single fittings to run straight from the tank to the carbs without the middle hose?

 

[L.A.B.]

Is the small connector hose between the banjos necessary?

Without the crossover pipe you will have no reserve fuel supply as the crossover allows both carbs to draw fuel from the main tap and then both to be fed from the reserve tap. The carb fed by the main tap will run out of fuel first unless replaced with a second reserve or the existing tap is converted to a second reserve tap.

 

[DaveinCanada]

Without the crossover pipe you will have no reserve fuel supply as the crossover allows both carbs to draw fuel from the main tap and then both to be fed from the reserve tap. The carb fed by the main tap will run out of fuel first unless replaced with a second reserve or the existing tap is converted to a second reserve tap.

Thanks L.A.B. I figured I couldn't get away with making my own fuel line assembly. Looks like I have to buy a new one.

 

[L.A.B.]

All parts are available and you can probably reuse some of the original parts.

Andover Norton Parts Drawings - Andover Norton Factory Parts - Commando Parts

Andover Norton Parts are the only Norton spare parts in the market manufactured to original drawings, within the factory-approved tolerances, from the correct materials, and with the correct finish.

andover-norton.co.uk

You can use small hose clips instead of the original ferrules. Others here can recommend which fuel line to use.

 

[DaveinCanada]

All parts are available and you can probably reuse some of the original parts.

Andover Norton Parts Drawings - Andover Norton Factory Parts - Commando Parts

Andover Norton Parts are the only Norton spare parts in the market manufactured to original drawings, within the factory-approved tolerances, from the correct materials, and with the correct finish.

andover-norton.co.uk

You can use small hose clips instead of the original ferrules. Others here can recommend which fuel line to use.

If I'm going to order parts from afar, then I should just order the assembly. I was hoping to go to my local auto parts store and use some fittings and lines from there to make an assembly. I can easily find the hose and fitting to the gas tank (I still have them). The problem is one of the banjo fittings is broken, and I can't find anything that could replace it, other than an OEM part.

What is the thread size of the banjo bolt?

 

[L.A.B.]

What is the thread size of the banjo bolt?

Should be 3/8" x 26 BSC.

 

[Tornado]

Don't order until you've taken apart the carbs and thoroughly cleaned then, confirming the jets are flowing correctly and floats/needle valve, gaskets are all in good order....as you will likely need to also order carb parts as well. Always good to have spare gasket sets and renewal of the needle valve, even new needle jets & needles are wise. I just run standard 1/4" silicone (ethanol-rated) fuel lines and either spring type or screw type hose clamps, never used the oem assembly. That way when some section needs changing/modifying, no need for the full assemble replacement.

EDIT: See this excellent guide to checking/testing the Amal concentric carbs....written by Jim Bushman...a Vancouver BC local Brit Bike expert: https://www.ntnoa.org/pdf/Bushmans Carb Tuning Secrets.pdf

 

[marshg246]

Thanks L.A.B. I figured I couldn't get away with making my own fuel line assembly. Looks like I have to buy a new one.

It's easy enough to make one. There are two types. the simplest has a hose ot each petcock and a hose between the carbs.

Early style: https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details-2/15631/fuel-pipe-assembly-h-style-1968-to-1973-
Later style: https://andover-norton.co.uk/en/shop-details-2/16457/fuel-pipe-assembly-1974-onwards-

If trying to be "correct" I use the correct on. Otherwise, I prefer the later style. If you have either style, the pieces you have, some 1/4" ID gas line, and some clamps (I used fuel injector type) will let you make new.

 

[marshg246]

If I'm going to order parts from afar, then I should just order the assembly. I was hoping to go to my local auto parts store and use some fittings and lines from there to make an assembly. I can easily find the hose and fitting to the gas tank (I still have them). The problem is one of the banjo fittings is broken, and I can't find anything that could replace it, other than an OEM part.

What is the thread size of the banjo bolt?

Plenty of people in the US, including me, have banjos and banjo bolts. They should be easy to find in Canada as well. They will not be at an auto-parts store - you need the correct banjo, filter, bolt, and fiber washer.

 

[L.A.B.]

Note that the original banjos were nylon and had no sealing washer between the banjo and the head of the banjo bolt which is why no washer is shown on the original parts lists. Later banjos are metal therefore require a 13/163 sealing washer that's either available separately or is contained in the carb gasket kit.
The carb gasket kits may also contain a larger sealing washer 14/175 that looks as if it should go at the upper end of the banjo, however, that washer is for use with alcohol fuel so should not be fitted as the banjo seals against the flange of the banjo fuel filter.

 

[DaveinCanada]

@L.A.B. @marshg246 @Tornado Can any of you tell me what this connection is for? Where do those thin wires go to?

 

[marshg246]

@L.A.B. @marshg246 @Tornado Can any of you tell me what this connection is for? Where do those thin wires go to?

I think you're pointin at the power socket. I can simply be disconnected (the two wires from behind it go to connectors nearby) - you'll never use it. Warning - the Brown/Blue wire to it is hot.

 

[DaveinCanada]

I think you're pointin at the power socket. I can simply be disconnected (the two wires from behind it go to connectors nearby) - you'll never use it. Warning - the Brown/Blue wire to it is hot.

A power socket? What is it used for?

 

[marshg246]

A power socket? What is it used for?

Your electric razor or possibly charging the battery. I eliminate things in this order:

Chokes (I've never had chokes on AMAL carbs that had ticklers)
Assimilator (light the red waring light with an oil pressure switch and generally won't work with a solid-state regulator)
Power Socket (Smoke/burned up wiring harness waiting to happen, and plugs for them were not available for a long time)
Capacitor (Most install electronic ignitions, and the capacitor has much less possible use than with points, and a failed one can really confuse troubleshooting)
Bridge Rectifier and Zener(s). Switch to a solid-start regulator
Points (Switch to electronic ignition)

 

[Triton Thrasher]

Your electric razor or possibly charging the battery. I eliminate things in this order:

Chokes (I've never had chokes on AMAL carbs that had ticklers)
Assimilator (light the red waring light with an oil pressure switch and generally won't work with a solid-state regulator)
Power Socket (Smoke/burned up wiring harness waiting to happen, and plugs for them were not available for a long time)
Capacitor (Most install electronic ignitions, and the capacitor has much less possible use than with points, and a failed one can really confuse troubleshooting)
Bridge Rectifier and Zener(s). Switch to a solid-start regulator
Points (Switch to electronic ignition)

It has taken some of us many years to eliminate mostly the same things.

 

[johnm]

Except for the zener and chokes they all went on my bike in 1979.

Zener has also gone now but I retain and firmly beleive chokes are a good idea.