Best electronic ignition 750 Combat

Status
Not open for further replies.

Richard Tool

VIP MEMBER
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
1,809
Country flag
Hi all - This subject is likely up there with oil & tire threads but I am exploring options for electronic ignition for my 72 Combat 750 come the day I may need / want it. I am completely ignorant on this subject so am seeking more knowledgeable opinions. I have looked at Trispark - the one that can be installed in place of the points plate / AAU behind the points cover without opening up the timing chest along with the single coil both available from Matt @ CNW .
Thanks in advance for any and all input .
RT
 
Well there are two schools of E.I. ignitions out there:

One's that keep the electronics out of the hot engine and ones that don't.
I use the Boyer and Pazon with experience. The other option out there is Trispark and P/A sold by Old Brits, these also require different coils and plugs /plug wires. various other brands including the Lucus type which are no longer produced.
Here I have No experience so I can't comment.
I use Pazon Sure Fire which I have found very reliable and I know there are plenty of Boyer's out there which are continuing to run as well. I did have a Boyer fail me on a road trip which was, I think the second generation made in the late 70's. It just crapped out and a CAA ride of shame on the back of a tilt and load back home. The Boyer is now upgraded to Mk IV's. MkIII's don't like it below 12 volts, These models also don't like it if you pull one plug lead off while running, (not good for the black box). I have no experience with Trispark type E.I.s but I am a great believer with the Pazon.
50K miles and still going strong.
YMMV.
Tom
 
Why not explore the multitude of previous threads whereby the various EI have been hacked to death? Why a new thread?.
 
The rule is: ask 10 Norton owners ‘which E.I.’ and you‘ll receive 11 answers !

FWIW / IMHO...

I use the Tri Spark and coil from Matt (fitted 2013) on my Commando and TrI Spark with Tri Spark coils on a couple of Triumphs that clutter my shed.

I think I’ve now fitted 5 Tri Sparks and (touch wood) have yet to have one fail but, it has to be said, I don’t ride my Commando across deserts.

I REALLY like the anti kick back function, and the idle stabilisation. I have replaced Lucas and Boyer with Tri Spark and noticed easier starting and better low speed running.
 
Why not explore the multitude of previous threads whereby the various EI have been hacked to death? Why a new thread?.
The reason I started a new thread was to get some answers after using the search function and reading through two pages of subject matter - perhaps my choice of wording in the search box was not the best .
 
Thanks all for the responses - I thought this Subject might bring on a lot of varying opinion . I am trying to sort out some issue that have just surfaced . Acting like pilot circuit blockage but after cleaning both circuits in both carbs without success I am now looking at ignition.
Thanks again - RT
 
Us old bike enthusiasts are a lucky lot - all these choices! And it adds to the fun.
Personally, I fitted Pazon Altair to my 750 - works a treat.
I have Boyer on my Triumphs. Main disadvantage of the Boyer is its low voltage behavior.
Have fun choosing!

PS. I still have points on my TR6 - starts first kick every time!
 
Last edited:
Richard I agree with you and think that lazyeye6 comments are over the top, I have been here for a number of years and as I have another rebuild on the go [Mk3] I to have searched and followed most posts on E.I. but still want to learn more as I am yet to decide what to use, I am angling towards a Pazon Altair as there seems to be too many failures with the Trispark but am still watching and learning.
 
I've had the (same) Trispark for 10 years with no issues whatsoever. The only other ignition I would consider if it failed is the OEM points/AAU. The bike came to me in '06 with a boyer which was essentially non-functional. I installed OEM ignition and had no interest in e-ignition. But when the TS came out with the advance curve which essentially duplicated the OEM, I decided to try it and it's been there ever since with the OEM-style dual ignition coils.
 
I’ve played with a few different systems:

Tri-Spark Classic Twin
Power Arc
Boyer MKIII
Sparx
Electrex World CDI ignition
Lucas RITA
BT-H modern magneto (it’s actually a CDI ignition)


Best electronic ignition 750 Combat
I really like the Tri-Spark - fitted several, and not had an issue which is why I keep going back for more.
I often read of failures, and wonder why the Tri-Spark product comes up often - is it because they are prone to failure or because there are so many out there now we hear about them more?
Either way, they revised the product a few years back and made some subtle circuitry changes, they are approachable and communicative as a company and their product warranty is good.
Asi said the other day, I like where Tri-Soark are at as a company - with their MOSFET reg/rec, their oil filled coils plus the features of their new hits, it shows they understand the market they are in, and listen to feedback from their customers.
Of course, people only complain when something has broken - they won’t create a post to talk about how brilliant their Tri-Spark is!
I like the idle stabilisation and improved curve for aiding cold starts.
I don’t like the fact that everything is inside the points cover - the ‘shake and bake’ ethos seems flawed.
I plan to try the new Fire Box Pro which has the separate ‘brain box’


Best electronic ignition 750 Combat
I like the Power Arc because it’s optical, and is very very precise to setup.
The wires are really long, and you can plug it in to the PC and dabble with the curves (plus it will hold multiple curves that you can switch between)
I don’t like the fact that everything is in a single unit inside the points cover - it feels vulnerable.
I also don’t like the weird starting procedure that you are supposed to adhere to (but no one, including me does)


Everyone moans about their Boyer failures - but that’s often after they’ve been on a bike for 35 years.
They need a strong 12 volts, and kick back like a ba$tard if they get anything less - an issue that has been totally addressed with the new Boyer MKIV which operates down to 8 volts.
The only thing to watch is the solder wires at the stator becoming brittle and snapping off at the soldered joints. You can overcome this by using a tywrap for strain relief.


Best electronic ignition 750 Combat
Electrex World is just wrong - nothing about it is good.
I fitted it to a Dommie, but it’s the same STK-102D-DC kit for the Commando.
The alternator output is very low, they are difficult to setup, the quality of components is poor, and their support is disgusting - check out their Facebook community page for feedback from customers.


I have not fitted a RITA, but have repaired one.
They are superb, but are not produced anymore, so anything you buy would be second hand, introducing an unknown to the mix.
I would stay clear for this reason, but would strive to keep it if you had one already.
They have become a bit of a cult item to have on a bike, I for one like to see the oversized points cover on a bike, knowing that someone is running a RITA on their pride and joy.



Two worth considering that I have no personal experience with are Pazon and Vape:

Pazon was founded by a guy that used to work alongside Ernie Bransden and when he left and setup Oazon, he address every single shortfall in the Boyer.
Their warranty is superb, and their customers always seem happy with the product.

Vape is pretty new, but they have been OEM’d by Wassell. The units look excellent, and people are talking very highly of them. So worth consideration.
 
I’ve played with a few different systems:

Tri-Spark Classic Twin
Power Arc
Boyer MKIII
Sparx
Electrex World CDI ignition
Lucas RITA
BT-H modern magneto (it’s actually a CDI ignition)


View attachment 18202
I really like the Tri-Spark - fitted several, and not had an issue which is why I keep going back for more.
I often read of failures, and wonder why the Tri-Spark product comes up often - is it because they are prone to failure or because there are so many out there now we hear about them more?
Either way, they revised the product a few years back and made some subtle circuitry changes, they are approachable and communicative as a company and their product warranty is good.
Asi said the other day, I like where Tri-Soark are at as a company - with their MOSFET reg/rec, their oil filled coils plus the features of their new hits, it shows they understand the market they are in, and listen to feedback from their customers.
Of course, people only complain when something has broken - they won’t create a post to talk about how brilliant their Tri-Spark is!
I like the idle stabilisation and improved curve for aiding cold starts.
I don’t like the fact that everything is inside the points cover - the ‘shake and bake’ ethos seems flawed.
I plan to try the new Fire Box Pro which has the separate ‘brain box’


View attachment 18201
I like the Power Arc because it’s optical, and is very very precise to setup.
The wires are really long, and you can plug it in to the PC and dabble with the curves (plus it will hold multiple curves that you can switch between)
I don’t like the fact that everything is in a single unit inside the points cover - it feels vulnerable.
I also don’t like the weird starting procedure that you are supposed to adhere to (but no one, including me does)


Everyone moans about their Boyer failures - but that’s often after they’ve been on a bike for 35 years.
They need a strong 12 volts, and kick back like a ba$tard if they get anything less - an issue that has been totally addressed with the new Boyer MKIV which operates down to 8 volts.
The only thing to watch is the solder wires at the stator becoming brittle and snapping off at the soldered joints. You can overcome this by using a tywrap for strain relief.


View attachment 18203
Electrex World is just wrong - nothing about it is good.
I fitted it to a Dommie, but it’s the same STK-102D-DC kit for the Commando.
The alternator output is very low, they are difficult to setup, the quality of components is poor, and their support is disgusting - check out their Facebook community page for feedback from customers.


I have not fitted a RITA, but have repaired one.
They are superb, but are not produced anymore, so anything you buy would be second hand, introducing an unknown to the mix.
I would stay clear for this reason, but would strive to keep it if you had one already.
They have become a bit of a cult item to have on a bike, I for one like to see the oversized points cover on a bike, knowing that someone is running a RITA on their pride and joy.



Two worth considering that I have no personal experience with are Pazon and Vape:

Pazon was founded by a guy that used to work alongside Ernie Bransden and when he left and setup Oazon, he address every single shortfall in the Boyer.
Their warranty is superb, and their customers always seem happy with the product.

Vape is pretty new, but they have been OEM’d by Wassell. The units look excellent, and people are talking very highly of them. So worth consideration.
What do you think of the elecktronik Sachs ignition?
 
@baz I cannot speak from personal experience of their ignitions.
However people that use them LOVE their simplicity and tweakability (is that even a word?)
They use a hall effect sensor as the trigger, which I really like the idea of, and their seperate black box is in a beautiful extruded aluminium case, which is a sound decision.

I do have personal experience of their regulator/rectifiers and they are brilliantly well made.
Quite early on, they expressed a sound understanding of the drawbacks of short-type systems, and they showed a genuine interest in developing a series-type system for the classic bike market.
Alas, the guy who was doing this work I believe is sadly no longer with us.
 
I’ve got the cheapest kit (Wassell) with a potted dual coil, on a Triumph. It is robustly made and works well.

I tried an expensive Boyer Micro Power kit once and it was awful.

But I don’t see how lack of electronic ignition is making a bike behave like the pilot jets are blocked. Did you physically clear them with a drill?
 
@baz I cannot speak from personal experience of their ignitions.
However people that use them LOVE their simplicity and tweakability (is that even a word?)
They use a hall effect sensor as the trigger, which I really like the idea of, and their seperate black box is in a beautiful extruded aluminium case, which is a sound decision.

I do have personal experience of their regulator/rectifiers and they are brilliantly well made.
Quite early on, they expressed a sound understanding of the drawbacks of short-type systems, and they showed a genuine interest in developing a series-type system for the classic bike market.
Alas, the guy who was doing this work I believe is sadly no longer with us.
I only ask as I bought a t160 that was fitted with Sachs ignition
And not knowing anything about it (still don't really) I asked the question of reliability on another forum
The answers I got were it's the same spec as trispark without the drama
I think it'll work down to 7 volts
I know it has 4 advance curves to chose I've never adjusted it because the bike run's superbly
On my Norton I have Lucas Rita that I'm very happy with
Cheers
 
I have had a Pazon Surefire for quite a while now. Fit it and forget it. No problems. Usually starts first kick and no low voltage kickback problems. @ approx $240.00 NZ . good value for money. [ mine cost less than $200.00 when I bought it ]

Dereck
 
Unless this cleaning out included a #78 or 16 thou drill then the pilots are still suspect No1.


Best electronic ignition 750 Combat
Thanks Kommando - cleaning included removing float bowl and idle screw , several cycles of blowing compressed air through fuel circuits in both float bowls and carb bodies ( in both directions) inserting fine soft brass wire ( smaller dia than pilot orifice) in pilot jet and spraying carb cleaner ( aerosol can with straw ) through fuel circuits ( again in both directions. These are brand new Premiers that were disassembled on the bench and thoroughly inspected for swarf, etc before mounting. Total mileage on bike since rebuild is 150 miles.
Until yesterday morning it was running beautifully. Starting first kick, idle nice , etc. Need to get inductive timing light on it to check for ignition faults.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top