Best electronic ignition 750 Combat

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gtiller said:
I’ve played with a few different systems:

Tri-Spark Classic Twin
Power Arc
Boyer MKIII
Sparx
Electrex World CDI ignition
Lucas RITA
BT-H modern magneto (it’s actually a CDI ignition)


View attachment 18202
I really like the Tri-Spark - fitted several, and not had an issue which is why I keep going back for more.
I often read of failures, and wonder why the Tri-Spark product comes up often - is it because they are prone to failure or because there are so many out there now we hear about them more?
Either way, they revised the product a few years back and made some subtle circuitry changes, they are approachable and communicative as a company and their product warranty is good.
Asi said the other day, I like where Tri-Soark are at as a company - with their MOSFET reg/rec, their oil filled coils plus the features of their new hits, it shows they understand the market they are in, and listen to feedback from their customers.
Of course, people only complain when something has broken - they won’t create a post to talk about how brilliant their Tri-Spark is!
I like the idle stabilisation and improved curve for aiding cold starts.
I don’t like the fact that everything is inside the points cover - the ‘shake and bake’ ethos seems flawed.
I plan to try the new Fire Box Pro which has the separate ‘brain box’


View attachment 18201
I like the Power Arc because it’s optical, and is very very precise to setup.
The wires are really long, and you can plug it in to the PC and dabble with the curves (plus it will hold multiple curves that you can switch between)
I don’t like the fact that everything is in a single unit inside the points cover - it feels vulnerable.
I also don’t like the weird starting procedure that you are supposed to adhere to (but no one, including me does)


Everyone moans about their Boyer failures - but that’s often after they’ve been on a bike for 35 years.
They need a strong 12 volts, and kick back like a ba$tard if they get anything less - an issue that has been totally addressed with the new Boyer MKIV which operates down to 8 volts.
The only thing to watch is the solder wires at the stator becoming brittle and snapping off at the soldered joints. You can overcome this by using a tywrap for strain relief.


View attachment 18203
Electrex World is just wrong - nothing about it is good.
I fitted it to a Dommie, but it’s the same STK-102D-DC kit for the Commando.
The alternator output is very low, they are difficult to setup, the quality of components is poor, and their support is disgusting - check out their Facebook community page for feedback from customers.


I have not fitted a RITA, but have repaired one.
They are superb, but are not produced anymore, so anything you buy would be second hand, introducing an unknown to the mix.
I would stay clear for this reason, but would strive to keep it if you had one already.
They have become a bit of a cult item to have on a bike, I for one like to see the oversized points cover on a bike, knowing that someone is running a RITA on their pride and joy.



Two worth considering that I have no personal experience with are Pazon and Vape:

Pazon was founded by a guy that used to work alongside Ernie Bransden and when he left and setup Oazon, he address every single shortfall in the Boyer.
Their warranty is superb, and their customers always seem happy with the product.

Vape is pretty new, but they have been OEM’d by Wassell. The units look excellent, and people are talking very highly of them. So worth consideration.
Click to expand...
I have been considering and researching the switch to EI and really like the Vape Wassel. Looks like a very good unit and could not find any negative comments about it. The price is an added befit. I have not pulled the trigger yet as my points system is working good (knocking on wood).

jrcengineering.com

Vape Ignition Installation and Troubleshooting | JRC Engineering, Inc.

Click here to download the installation instruction PDF Vape Electronic Ignition For British Motorcycles 12 VOLT IGNITION – TWIN CYLINDER...
jrcengineering.com jrcengineering.com
 
Most of my bikes have magnetos so I'm not the right person to answer.
But I have a BSA B40 which came with a Boyer Mk IV fitted. It works well and can be started without battery, 2MC capacitor fitted.
 
Richard Tool said:
Thanks Kommando - cleaning included removing float bowl and idle screw , several cycles of blowing compressed air through fuel circuits in both float bowls and carb bodies ( in both directions) inserting fine soft brass wire ( smaller dia than pilot orifice) in pilot jet and spraying carb cleaner ( aerosol can with straw ) through fuel circuits ( again in both directions. These are brand new Premiers that were disassembled on the bench and thoroughly inspected for swarf, etc before mounting. Total mileage on bike since rebuild is 150 miles.
Until yesterday morning it was running beautifully. Starting first kick, idle nice , etc. Need to get inductive timing light on it to check for ignition faults.
Click to expand...

My statement stands, you have not used the right sized drill so cannot rule the pilots out 100%, brass wire is not sized correctly and carb cleaner does not work on small jets. The pilot jets are prone to pick up deposits even overnight from modern fuel. If you have premiers then the pilot jet size could be 17 or 19, check the number of rings on the od of the jet, 17 takes a 16 thou drill, 19 takes an 18 thou drill.
 
Saber said:
I have been considering and researching the switch to EI and really like the Vape Wassel. Looks like a very good unit and could not find any negative comments about it. The price is an added befit. I have not pulled the trigger yet as my points system is working good (knocking on wood).

jrcengineering.com

Vape Ignition Installation and Troubleshooting | JRC Engineering, Inc.

Click here to download the installation instruction PDF Vape Electronic Ignition For British Motorcycles 12 VOLT IGNITION – TWIN CYLINDER...
jrcengineering.com jrcengineering.com
Click to expand...

I have a negative for you, I like the unit, very neat and the stator part of it is very well made, but the rotor has two small magnets which are on the edge of the rotor, one of mine fell off. Not too much of a problem because the bike kept running but I lost confidence with it and changed it for a Pazon, which was the biggest mistake ever.

www.accessnorton.com

Pazon Altair kickback

I replaced my aged Boyer with the Pazon Altair when rebuilding my engine. Followed their published directions to a T. It kicked back like a mule more than 50% of the time. Bent my kicker, munched the pawl. I started this new thread to make it easily searchable, for those struggling. bill had...
www.accessnorton.com www.accessnorton.com

I think I will dig the Wassel out and have a go at re attaching the magnet, like I said a nice unit otherwise. I guess someone somewhere will have had a problem with anything ever made.
 
baz said:
What do you think of the elecktronik Sachs ignition?
Click to expand...

Curious as well. They seem to have two preset ignition curves along with two preset rev limiters. Tri-Spark seems to make a similar unit as well, the FireBox Pro that looks to be programmable (at a separate cost). Hard to tell what programming comes from the factory tho.
 
Fast Eddie said:
Have you changed the spark plugs?
Click to expand...
Thanks for the help Nigel once again - I have not changed plugs yet -
they look fine - nice cocoa color - sparking while out of cylinder head . Here are symptoms which initially led me to pilot circuit .
As stated bike was running fine . Starting on one kick , idled nice smooth running throughout rpm range. After putting 100 miles on it I changed oil & filter , re torqued head and cylinder base , adjusted valves , primary and final drive chains and went over all fasteners .
Following that I rode it for an hour out and an hour back . Ran beautifully. Went for ride yesterday and after 8 - 10 miles it began to stumble intermittently at idle . I turned for home and idle situation worsened and then acceleration began to get rough . Once home it would intermittently drop one cylinder. All the while though it ran fine above 2500 rpm. I went through idle fuel circuits as described above.
I did not go as far as removing carbs to remove idle jet which I understand is now removable on the Premiers . After going through idle circuits I ran it again and after about 10 minutes it started acting up again at idle.
A buddy is bringing me an inductive timing light tomorrow. I am not concerned with the timing but the light should indicate a loss of spark and which cylinder is at fault. If it stumbles while running but strobe says still sparking then I will remove carbs to get at idle jets and do the number drill method.
Does this seem like the path to take ?
Thanks again all for the responses.
Richard
 
It may well NOT be spark plugs, but it is absolutely the easiest thing to check. You then either rule them in, or rule them out. Either way, you’ve moved forwards !

Just swap them out, if things improve bin your old ones (NEVER keep suspect plugs). If there’s no change, keep the old ones as spares.

I spent weeks chasing my arse setting up the brand new carbs on my T140, yes, there were some carb issues that I eventually resolved, but duff plugs certainly had me running off down rabbit holes during that time.

If the plugs are ruled out, you gotta removed those pilot jets. If there was crud in there, it’s quite likely all your squinting and blowing has blown the crud into the jet !

You did ensure #19 pilots were fitted didn’t you ?
 
Had a Trispark on my 73 850 for a year. Ran very well, no complaints. Last winter while doing some rewiring I hooked the wires up wrong and let out the magic smoke. No fault but my own. Decided to try a Pazon Altair. Bike runs excellent but sometimes when the engine temp is such that it needs the enricher, (single Mikuni ) but at the same time it is a bit too much fuel (not that cold) it will kick me back. Usually if I crack the throttle a little it's ok. The Trispark didn't do that. Idles great, runs great but the kickback has me thinking about getting a replacement stator for the Trispark.
 
Thanks all for the responses - should I plunge head first into this century and go the electronic route it seems I am leaning towards Trispark .
 
I've got the wassell and have only one issue with it..... remembering to check and keep my battery up to snuff.
 
Battery is two years old and took a dive in the heat. If I fail to open door on shed I bet it hits 130F> in there... Anyway it's now shot.... failed... kaput.
 
OK, I'll jump in.
I've run Boyer, Pazon Altair and TriSpark.
Boyer never failed me except that time the wire broke inside the insulator. That was fun!
Pazon has never failed me. One kick starter every time.
Tri-Spark. Have had 3 units. one failed (older style). Replaced under warranty. The other 2 have been perfect for years.
Points on one bike were one kick fine. Don't even know why I replaced them with the Pazon, but I lost nothing
in the transaction besides money.

There are a number of fine EI's on the market. I'm sure most of them will do a fine job of running your engine.
Some are highly sophisticated such that one can attach it to a computer and program advance curves. I'm not
sure that this kind of sophistication is what the average old man Commando rider needs or wants. Don't we
all just want to have a good time and at least be able to ride as much as we wrench. This whole subject is just
another oil thread. I think most folks need to spend a bit more time accurately timing their beast. Who cares
what EI you have if timing is off.
Whatever you do, try new spark plugs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Hi Richard,

You asked the question correctly. Most of the replies did not address “combat” which has different needs than an other standard CommandoS. One of the best I’ve used on my combat was the Lucas RITA. The worst was a Boyer. The main issue is advance curve and how far the advance continues. Search DynoDave for advance curves on this site and try to match the original points which at least I know the RITA does. My RITA died after many years. Currently I’m using a second TriSpark that works very well after the first unit failed after 1,000 miles.
 
Good question. Assume the higher compression Combat will need less advance. Think most of the options have fixed curves. What's the best fit for a Combat? Or is the compression difference not that big of a deal?
 
MexicoMike said:
Just curious, was there any difference in the advance setting or the actual curve (spring/weight changes) on the original Combat vs the standard motor?
Click to expand...
Not sure if the Lucas Rita had a different advance for the combat motor
Or for a motor fitted with a 4s cam?
Can't remember,but there was a different one
Someone will correct me on this
Cheers
 
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