Stroker motor 1100cc?

Status
Not open for further replies.
The Steve Maney overbored Commando is surely a big contender, but the ugly mild-chopped red Noron in te pic could be beaten by my ex Army Moto Guzzi Nuovo Falcone 500 ! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Chopper guys are often nice mates for running and drinkin' around but not too serious about racing.... :lol: :lol:

(despite an Hell's HD took some wins on the quarter mile)
 
Yeah, I guess I should stop drinking when I'm planning my engine build and concentrate on building something I won't grenade before its first oil change. I'm hard enough on bikes as it is without the bike trying to blow itself up :lol: Guess I'll stick to stock displacement+required overbore.
 
willh said:
Yeah, I guess I should stop drinking when I'm planning my engine build and concentrate on building something I won't grenade before its first oil change. I'm hard enough on bikes as it is without the bike trying to blow itself up :lol: Guess I'll stick to stock displacement+required overbore.
Click to expand...

Or buy that dude's nice 1100 special.
 
I suspect he'd not got tire enough nor lowered front enough to endure the force to shove to claimed rate. It sure don't look light enough for the job either.
My P!! I could pick up and was 2" front lowered on 4" slick did 11.49 1/4 mile when raced - before my time on it. Kinda ugly but for the Norton parts.
Ken Canaga is using Maney 1007 stroker in his salt lake torpedo.

If under 8 sec 1/4 ET then it'd do about 5 sec in 1/8 mile. Combats can break under 13 sec 1/4's, best of factory Combat recorded 12.24 1/4 ET. My pre-Peel Combat with me on it got into upper-mid 11 sec in 1000 ft track on 5 attempts before tire fold up in full upright wheelie then instant sideways crash on me.

Here's a drag strip calculator maybe someone can run the inputs for some more snickers on numbers.
http://www.hotrodpitstop.com/tools.html

hobot, 920 cc breaths like 1400 cc with 10 lb boost.
 
willh said:
The bike is good for a laugh but got me thinking after a few beer,( not like I can afford to right now, but), has anyone on here put the 93mm stroke crank into a stock set of cases? How much work was it? And ditto for the 83mm bore in stock barrel?
Click to expand...

The 1007 has the cylinder bores spaced .080" further apart, with cylinder and head bolts moved accordingly, so the 83 mm cylinders don't fit on standard cases and heads. For the 1007, The 93 mm stroke crank is spaced apart by making a thicker flywheel, but Steve also makes it with standard width flyfwheel to fit in standard cases. Several of Steve's racer customers have used the 93 mm crank in standard cases. Depending on the cases and rods used, some machining for rod bolt clearance in the crankcase might need to be done to use this crank, but it's not enough to weaken the cases. Stock length rods are used, but attention must be paid to maintaining sufficient piston-to-head and piston-to-valve clearance.

Ken
 
Ok Ken, any feed back on the effectiveness of the increased cid?
What the 80 cc's worth over a 920 with similar innards and chassis in performance?
Thats about 10% bigger. Maney gets 100 shaft with 920, so implies 110 hp zone.
What would be expected stroker red line? Maney said 7200 on his 920 racers.

The main flex deflection of hi rpm 360 crank is front and downward as pistons resist at TDC. If some center support could be arranged a short stroke big bore would be next power master.
 
http://www.hotrodpitstop.com/tools.html
8.48 1/4 ET = 159 mph. If total mass 555 lb, 159 mph needs ~175 hp.
Does that look like a 355 lb bike with 150 lb rider. Seat looks a bit too cushy for a light jockey. Big fat Harley like shocks/springs look made for hauling some ass alright. But the big HD kick peddle implies a bad boy to kick over, hm.
Even cutting the calm is half for 1/8 mile, better hunt video on what that takes.


To make 160 hp in 920 cc twin requires 8000 rpm, 10:5 CR with drag cam, very high octane fuel and 10 lb or more of boost. For that to break 9 sec 1/4 requires under 500 lb total mass and drag slick and chassis lowering. Absurdly Cdo unrealistic.
 
Thanks Ken,
that was the kind of info I was looking for. Any comment on the longevity of the long stroke engine?
The beer induced thought was to get near my Superduke power, (about 115 hp at the wheel), or as close as possible, to go into the P11 special that I figure should way less than 350lbs when finished. With appropriate strengthening of the drive-train it would be one hell of a hooligan dirt-road terror.

Hobot,
according to that calculator, my SD would be in the low 10s at about 135mph. That sounds about right with some practice launching. Magazines numbers were low 11s at 118 for stock Superduke.

Jim,
That 916 sounds interesting and might be the way to go.
The stock clutch plates allow for slip that saves the tranny. All my transmission problems started when I switched to Barnett plates. Maney outrigger and belt will help but beefier cases may be needed to handle the abuse. What are you using or are you being gentle with it?

Will
 
8.48 second quarter mile Norton Commando?

He would need this!
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqwJzzlroLI[/video]
 
Jim,
That 916 sounds interesting and might be the way to go.
The stock clutch plates allow for slip that saves the tranny. All my transmission problems started when I switched to Barnett plates. Maney outrigger and belt will help but beefier cases may be needed to handle the abuse. What are you using or are you being gentle with it?

Will[/quote]

The 916 is going to replace the motor in my injected bike. Hopefully it will give as long a life as the present 880 did. It won't be seeing any drag strip abuse. The best thing I ever did for transmission longevity was to go to the tall ratio belt drive. The trans spins faster but less torque is applied. I haven't broken the trans since I did that. I use a Sureflex clutch. Jim
 
comnoz said:
The 916 is going to replace the motor in my injected bike. Hopefully it will give as long a life as the present 880 did. It won't be seeing any drag strip abuse. The best thing I ever did for transmission longevity was to go to the tall ratio belt drive. The trans spins faster but less torque is applied. I haven't broken the trans since I did that. I use a Sureflex clutch. Jim
Click to expand...

I have no intentions of drag abuse but I do like to wheelie, drift, hack, and lug when it gets really dirty. Generally drive it like I stole it. The Surflex is on my shortlist as I don't have a cushdrive rearwheel. I assume 44t for clutch, what front are you using?

Will
 

I assume 44t for clutch, what front are you using?

If I remember right it is a 28 front. I do know it was the tallest ratio I could get in there. I run a 19-42 on the rear and the bike will still run 125. Jim
 
comnoz said:

I assume 44t for clutch, what front are you using?

If I remember right it is a 28 front. I do know it was the tallest ratio I could get in there. I run a 19-42 on the rear and the bike will still run 125. Jim
Click to expand...
That's great, thanks for the info. I used to run 19, I liked the acceleration.

Wil
 
and no one has mentioned the cost of those barrels 5000$? Trick to fit the swinging arm though.
 
willh said:
Thanks Ken,
that was the kind of info I was looking for. Any comment on the longevity of the long stroke engine?
The beer induced thought was to get near my Superduke power, (about 115 hp at the wheel), or as close as possible, to go into the P11 special that I figure should way less than 350lbs when finished. With appropriate strengthening of the drive-train it would be one hell of a hooligan dirt-road terror.

Will
Click to expand...

I don't have a lot of info on longevity, except that Steve mentioned there are a couple racers who have been running the 93 mm with 81 mm bores for a while now, and quite successfully. He mentioned who they were, and some more details, but I've forgotten all the specifics. That's happening a lot lately :? I think one of them was a Scot.

Ken
 
hobot said:
Ok Ken, any feed back on the effectiveness of the increased cid?
What the 80 cc's worth over a 920 with similar innards and chassis in performance?
Thats about 10% bigger. Maney gets 100 shaft with 920, so implies 110 hp zone.
What would be expected stroker red line? Maney said 7200 on his 920 racers.

The main flex deflection of hi rpm 360 crank is front and downward as pistons resist at TDC. If some center support could be arranged a short stroke big bore would be next power master.
Click to expand...

Probably not a lot more peak horsepower, for sure not 10%, but a lot of grunt in mid-range. Increasing the displacement doesn't make more top end horsepower unless the head will flow enough additional mixture for it. I'm building a 1007 for Bonneville, and we're going with the most radical cam we think the valve train will stand, but we still expect to hit peak horsepower somewhere below 7,000 rpm. I just don't think the head will flow enough to keep making power at higher rpms. Hopefully, we'll find out next year. It would make me very happy to find out I was wrong!

Regarding the center main bearing for the crank, maybe Jim Comstock will enlighten us. He ran one for a while back in his roadracing days. What say, Jim? The only other Norton I know of with a center main bearing was a Canadian 500 cc someone built many years back. Used part of an Alpha crankshaft, if I recall. Revved to 9,000 rpm or so. It's a natural idea to try, so I suspect there have been others, but none I know of.

Ken
 
lcrken said:
Regarding the center main bearing for the crank, maybe Jim Comstock will enlighten us. He ran one for a while back in his roadracing days. What say, Jim? The only other Norton I know of with a center main bearing was a Canadian 500 cc someone built many years back. Used part of an Alpha crankshaft, if I recall. Revved to 9,000 rpm or so. It's a natural idea to try, so I suspect there have been others, but none I know of.

Ken
Click to expand...

Ken,

I think you are referring to Roger McHardy's Norton, which I just saw run this past weekend. My goodness does it go, and it makes a wonderful noise too. But, more recently, don't forget Herb Becker with John Magyar's 500 twin Seeley MK2 - that had(has) a center main bearing too. Unfortunately, it was not the most reliable of motors and Herb put a LOT of effort into it trying to get it to keep up with the Summerfield and Molnar Manxes over the last few years. I think it's in pieces right now and Herb has retired, at least for the time being, so he said this past weekend at Mosport. But he's a junkie and won't be able to stay away for long. They all say they're retiring at one time or another. I sure would like to see that 500 run again. I think the redline on it was something crazy like 10k!
 
Yeah I built two motors in the 90's with three main cranks. One in stock cases and one in billet cases. I used a half a VW diesel crank. They went pretty good and were unbrakable. [except for the stock case] I reved them to 9 regularly with 89mm stroke and 10 with 83mm stroke . I tried them with 360,270 ,240 and 180 degree configurations. Always ended up back at 360 as I was using isolastics. I used long rods and short pistons in both engines. I should have some pictures somewhere. I will see what I can find. Jim
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Café au Lait
cNw #101 Norton Commando 850
8 9 10 11 12 13
Replies
251
Views
11,006
Café au Lait
Café au Lait
SteveA
  • Locked
Pau Arnos
2 3
Replies
47
Views
3,482
acotrel
acotrel
MexicoMike
  • Locked
Be careful buying a Commando...
2
Replies
21
Views
2,775
MexicoMike
MexicoMike
yves norton seeley
  • Locked
Testride report from my Seeley Commando in Motor Revue
Replies
9
Views
1,747
yves norton seeley
yves norton seeley
S
Hmmmm.......Where to begin.......14 961sf
2
Replies
22
Views
2,156
SkeletonCycles
S
Back
Top