Going Racing

storm42 · Aug 13, 2019

SteveA said:
Not forgetting whiskery old bastard Mervyn Stafford on a pre war 250 Rudge who laps most places faster than a lot of '70s/'80s 750s.

He was there. That Rudge is brilliant, girder forked solid rear 4 valve 250cc. he was in race 4 and his best lap was 1:12, my first race was race 7 and my best lap was 1:25. Similar conditions and my first time there, but wow.

Bernhard · Aug 13, 2019

SteveA said:
Tyre warmers also banned! And really not needed with classic tyres. Riding modern race/track tyres without warmers is something I did once, it hurt!

they were also banned in the UKs clubman's races- but it didn't stop some guy racing a TZ350 removing his wheels between the races and you can guess what was happening in the back of his van!

Fast Eddie · Aug 13, 2019

Ralph, I applaud you whole heartedly going out in those conditions, especially at such a tight n twisty track!

I do think you’d have a different opinion about 3 Sisters had you enjoyed better weather. Personally I think it’s a tremendously enjoyable and fun track. And as you point out with Merv the Swerves lap times, it’s a good ‘riders circuit’ as they say.

I remember trying (in vain) to follow a rider called Doug Jones on his Manx around there. I couldn’t see anywhere in particular he was gaining any specific time, but he just kept pulling away. Then I watched him from the sideline once and he was millimetre perfect every lap. Very impressive.

storm42 · Aug 13, 2019

I think for me to enjoy the circuit, I would have to be on a smaller bike, might be time to look at the Velo or the 250 Ducati I have.

Apparently, Josh Brookes goes to this track when he feels he needs to sharpen up, he says it reminds him that he can actually ride a bike. Can you imagine turning up at a track day and Josh rocks up.

cliffa · Aug 13, 2019

storm42 said:
Ha, that top pic was the shallow end, check out the deep end on the grid.

View attachment 11625

They cannot race in that and if it hadn't cleared then I guess the meeting would have to be cancelled and that is the organisers decision not the riders.

The marshals (and some of the riders) did a brilliant job of getting the track ready to race on, they got rid of all that standing water and although the track was still wet with a few puddles, it was manageable. It comes down to the fact that everybody is in the same boat when it comes to tires on the classics, and yes the lap times are slower than they would be if wets were allowed, but from a riders point of view, just as much fun. Still don't like that track though.

Jeez, how did that get cleared, not with brooms (and what looked like in the other picture) snow shovels?

acotrel · Aug 13, 2019

Fast Eddie said:
Ralph, I applaud you whole heartedly going out in those conditions, especially at such a tight n twisty track!

I do think you’d have a different opinion about 3 Sisters had you enjoyed better weather. Personally I think it’s a tremendously enjoyable and fun track. And as you point out with Merv the Swerves lap times, it’s a good ‘riders circuit’ as they say.

I remember trying (in vain) to follow a rider called Doug Jones on his Manx around there. I couldn’t see anywhere in particular he was gaining any specific time, but he just kept pulling away. Then I watched him from the sideline once and he was millimetre perfect every lap. Very impressive.

You will find that you go faster if you practice braking up further into the corners and getting on the gas earlier coming out. When you go faster there are fewer degrees of freedom. A Manx, in particular will improve your riding, because they do everything right. Converted road bikes often do not. A good A-grade rider on a fast Manx is extremely hard to beat on any tight circuit.

Chris · Aug 15, 2019

My only link to say I was at Donington. lol
Must sort out an on board camera.

Chris

Moto55UK · Aug 15, 2019

Great presence of mind from the guy that went straight on down craners, not to touch the brakes ; was that early on saturday before the biblical rain storm! Lucky chap!

Chris · Aug 16, 2019

Hi
It was the second classic 1300 race before the rain came!
I've been explaining to people how scary running off at Craners is. Passing buttons. He did well.
Chris

acotrel · Aug 16, 2019

When it rains, you need the plastic rain suit. But if it rains and you are you are riding a Commando, you are in with a big chance of winning. Bikes with big horsepower which understeer coming out of corners are at a disadvantage in the wet. If it is bad for you, it is worse for them. And if you slip off in the wet, it does not hurt.

storm42 · Aug 17, 2019

cliffa said:
Jeez, how did that get cleared, not with brooms (and what looked like in the other picture) snow shovels?

That is how they cleared it!

The thing is I didn't know that was going on, we were just hanging around waiting to go racing, If we had known then we would have been out there as well. I guess they had a limited supply of brooms and shovels so more people may have just been in the way.

storm42 · Aug 17, 2019

Chris said:
Hi
It was the second classic 1300 race before the rain came!
I've been explaining to people how scary running off at Craners is. Passing buttons. He did well.
Chris

I like that bit of video Chris, shows the drop down Craner well, most video flattens everything out.

storm42 · Aug 21, 2019

This coming weekend is probably the reason for going racing in the first place. The Gedinne Classic road race is one I have wanted to do since I first went as a spectator. https://crmb.be/?page_id=78&lang=en

The van is packed and after a quick shower we will be off for the ferry to France and then on to Belgium.

Looks like my races are well supported.

acotrel · Aug 21, 2019

Chris said:
My only link to say I was at Donington. lol
Must sort out an on board camera.

Chris

Looks like a really great circuit. There appears to be plenty of room around it, if you get silly. I like race circuits which don't have walls around them, because then you don't have to be so careful. When I used to race regularly, I could never get heavy-handed because I would always get bitten. Even on our local circuit at Winton, there are two places where you come out of corners facing a wall.

Chris · Aug 22, 2019

Hi Ralph
Have a great time.
Enjoy & build up to it.
Looking forward to your videos.
All the best Chris

SteveA · Aug 22, 2019

Your biggest problem is likely to be getting paddock space! Have a great weekend....I am missing it.......

SteveBorland · Aug 23, 2019

I'm not at all envious.
Really.
Absolutely not one tiny bit, no question what so ever.
:-(

Have a great weekend Ralph, looking forward to the report.
/Steve.

Steves · Aug 23, 2019

I finally got on the track yesterday with the Mk3 750. Ran well with a couple of issues. First one is gearing (Brands Hatch), what gearing do you guys use, I have a 43 rear, feel I need to go to 46 or thereabouts. I can’t remember the front, will have a look later. I know 1 on the front is worth 3 on the rear.
Also baffles, I ended up using (out of a box of baffles) the baffle of last resort, a Supertrapp which got the static at 101db. It strangled the engine, at least on the current carb setup. What is everyone using? I have a Maney 2:1

acotrel · Aug 23, 2019

With gearing and an underpowered motor, you can choose where you want to lose a race. If you gear low, you will be faster around the tight parts od the track, but you won't have the legs towards the ends of the longer straights. The Commando motor usually has loads of torque, so it is normal to gear relatively higher, but for fast acceleration with the heavy crank, you need close ratios. If you get into drag racing against other bikes down long straights with a Commando, you will probably always lose. Faster around the corners is always better and if you get into the next straight faster, your speed at the end of it will be higher.
Some guys brake before corners, ride carefully around them, get the bike upright, then point and squirt. It is OK with a two-stroke because your rolling speed us usually higher. A Commando is different. You need to brake into corners while cranked over, roll zero distance while turning, then get straight back onto the gas while still cranked over - all done as smoothly as possible.

acotrel · Aug 23, 2019

GEARING :
Winton Raceway is a fairly tight circuit. I use single row primary chain. The engine sprocket is 24, the clutch about 43, countershaft is 17, rear sprocket 38. There are three straights on the circuit and one is fairly long. The bike is still accelerating at the end of it. The motor is just under 900cc and I use methanol fuel. The last time I raced I used an American 4 speed close box which has first gear higher than a Manx. The bike was slow off the mark, but excellent everywhere else. That box cost $700 and I was too dumb to fit a standard Commando first gear, for the clutch starts.
If you try to race with a standard gearbox, you are wasting your time. It is too slow everywhere.

Going Racing

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