Exhaust Rose Nut Question

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I also never use silencer clamps
They put more stress on the system
 
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Exhaust header supports? (2014)

About ready to put on new headers from CS. Got new nuts / crush washers and my threads seem OK, although one pipe was a bit loose when I removed it. Wondering if anyone sells, or has fabricated a double clamp support for the pipes in the area near where the headers meet the mufflers. Seems like...
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how the exhaust rose joint can be preserved.
 
I replaced my untidy ones with some chrome brass ones I think , and they came loose after first and second ride , but then I took the muffler off and found that it wasn't letting the pipe seat squarely, gave it a good tighten then re installed the mufflers got it hot, and tightened again , I haven't had any more issues, except the locking washes are junk the inside hole is far too big and its impossible to get them to work properly , one just rattles . I have also wondered if anyone had made oversize thread versions + .005 or + .010 , maybe in past times , not that hard . Cheers .
 
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Shelby-Right said:
I replaced my untidy ones with some chrome brass ones I think , and they came loose after first and second ride , but then I took the muffler off and found that it wasn't letting the pipe seat squarely, gave it a good tighten then re installed the mufflers got it hot, and tightened again , I haven't had any more issues, except the locking washes are junk the inside hole is far too big and its impossible to get them to work properly , one just rattles . I have also wondered if anyone had made oversize thread versions + .005 or + .010 , maybe in past times , not that hard . Cheers .
Click to expand...
I seem to remember them being available in an oversize but I'm not sure
But pattern ones certainly do vary in size and quality
 
Back in the nineties when I worked at the former Norton/BMW dealer, we dealt with the exhaust rose issue weekly and some weeks daily. Many bikes required pulling the head to send out for inserts. Some owners were lucky and the loose roses could be tightened. Most owners could be convinced to have the head and rose drilled for lockwire. Sometimes I wrapped the lockwire around a valve cover nut. Once lockwired they did not come loose.
On bikes with balance tubes I painted the joints with Never Seeze and used only three clamps. That seemed to eliminate the cracking unless the mounting rubbers had been broken for some time. My theory was that the cracking occurred from stress induced by expansion and contraction of the length of the balance tube. If it was free to move some it would not crack. On my own Commando I have run pipes with and without balance tubes and have always used only three clamps on those with and haven't had them crack.
 
Alot of good suggestions combined with others from previous postings on this topic.
What I did last time I had the pipes off was use copper exhaust washers between the pipe flange edge
and the port. Tightened them,took it for a ride, came back to the shop and backed them out a turn or so, (kept the locking rings as I hadn't considered the
potential problem of using them) few drops of Loctite (don't remember which color) on the threads and reefed down on them. Then I took some mechanic wire, circled it around the pipe and between the locking ring and gave it a couple of twists, on the bottom, to fill in the gap of threads that remained.
(You really have to be looking closely to observe the wire)
Seems to have taken care of it, as I did this 2 seasons ago now, rendering the ring immovable and no chatter from them. As has
been mentioned, the locking rings are far from an ideal cure as none of the slots align perfectly
with a fin to make them truly effective on their own. Good luck Bonzo, it is an issue nobody wants to deal with, sorry You are.
 
There are some stainless alloys that are a poor mix with aluminum threads but The RGM stainless alloys work very well and are much stronger than the plated bronze nuts.
 
Hi Bonzo,
I have a stripped thread on my Mk2, it has previously been welded up and the thread recut (before I owned it) but alloy filler wire used in welding isn`t very strong compared to the original cast alloy of the head although to be fair, I have had the bike 10 years now and kept wondering when it would let go every time I tightend up the rose nuts. I have recently had a bronze insert fitted to my Mk3 head, it cost £180 at T&L engineering near Bedford, that was for one side only but did include a cylinder joint skim which it also needed. Looks like you will probably need both sides doing which isn`t cheap but it shouldn`t ever happen again. For now, I have refitted the exhaust on the Mk2 with silicone sealer, like your bikes previous owner and used lock wire to hold the rose nut to the head and it`s holding up ok. I plan to have inserts fitted over winter if it lasts till then.
Chin up mate.
 
Thanks Grumpy knob.

Hah. From reading your reply I'm clearly more deserving of your forum name than you are ;)
 
Just thought I would add that welding repairs like pistons and heads were there are hi temps involved etc require 4047 or similar tig wire , the 5356 wire is not suitable its better for other general purpose things like tanks etc .
 
Going back to this,

Bearing in mind it's a standard '74 850 mk2 (So, balance pipe, big square finned nut, short thread, retaining collet), any reason why I cant use the big square finned, long threaded nut from the 750 (06.3555), without the ret. collect - to get a bit more thread into the head?
 
Bonzo said:
any reason why I cant use the big square finned, long threaded nut from the 750 (06.3555), without the ret. collect - to get a bit more thread into the head?
Click to expand...

There would be nothing retaining the 850 balance pipes to the cylinder head without the collets but which 850 balance pipe system is it?
 
L.A.B. said:
There would be nothing retaining the 850 balance pipes to the cylinder head without the collets but which 850 balance pipe system is it?
Click to expand...

Of course. The nut would just pass over the header :rolleyes:
 
Bonzo said:
As far as I'm aware, it's this one..

andover-norton.co.uk

Motorcycle parts and spares for Norton motorbikes - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Andover Norton Motorcycles Parts - Original Andover Norton Parts

Motorcycle parts and spares for Andover Norton motorbikes: Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002.
andover-norton.co.uk

..which it seems is for a mk3
Click to expand...

Yes, it is, although technically isn't the correct system for the Mk2. This is (disregard "Mk2A" in the Feked title)...

Exhausts :: Norton :: Exhaust Pipes :: 850cc :: Norton Commando 850cc MK2A Exhaust Pipes Set with Balance

Set of two exhaust pipes and the three section balance pipe required to fit a MKIIA / MK2A Norton Commando. OEM: 06-3397, 06-3398, 06-6332, 06-3991
www.feked.com www.feked.com
Exhaust Rose Nut Question


...so the Mk3 spherical seatings, as well as the collets, are required to fit the flared Mk3 pipes, not 06.3995 sealing washers and NOT the 06.4148/49/50 brackets mentioned as they are the black cap silencer mounting brackets. One day, perhaps AN will correct the error (as I gave up trying to get AN to correct various errors).
 
Last edited:
Bonzo said:
Of course. The nut would just pass over the header :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Maybe a good time to switch to unbalanced downpipes
They are a little louder but a bit less troublesome than the balanced type
 
The drawings appear to be correct, but the parts photo's don't match the drawings. As you say, the feked.com headers are mine, not the flared mk3's.

I'm shocked that AN have made a mistake (and haven't corrected it). I wonder how many people have bought those pipes only to find they don't fit.
 
baz said:
Maybe a good time to switch to unbalanced downpipes
They are a little louder but a bit less troublesome than the balanced type
Click to expand...

I guess I'd have to change the main jet from a 260?
 
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