Born Again Bikes Experience

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JimC said:
When Grandpaul posted that he used Loctite on the head fasteners, that was it for me. I needed no more proof that he should not have a wrench in his hand, even for himself, let alone paying customers.
Click to expand...

This is exactly the problem. There's the guy and there's the business. Personally I enjoy the guy's posts as much as any body else's; maybe they're not 100% correct all of the time but whose are? 99% of the list have had no dealings with the business; are probably mildly interested in your complaints and opinions, but that's it. Last year, once it got started, there were completely unprovoked attacks on the guy, it was childish and embarrassing. You might not understand this, but Jerry does and if he see's things heading in a bad direction I personally support him in pulling the plug on a thread.

Gary
 
Someone's got to ask the stupid question, so here goes:

What's the problem with loctite on head fasteners?

(relatively new Commando owner, and definitely a newbie at spanner-wielding)
 
ed.lazda said:
Someone's got to ask the stupid question, so here goes:

What's the problem with loctite on head fasteners?

(relatively new Commando owner, and definitely a newbie at spanner-wielding)
Click to expand...

As far as the two 5/16" studs (barrel side) concern loctite is recommended to prevent oil leakage from the pushrod tunnels. Other head fasteners do not need loctite at all.
 
head fasteners on a Norton among others have to be re torqued several times. as lock tight is a thread locker it does 2 things once it is broken loose it it no longer functions as it is suppose to 2nd is it interferes with a proper torque reading. if you know much as a mechanic you also know that head fasteners are to be lubricated to achieve the the proper torque.

ed.lazda said:
Someone's got to ask the stupid question, so here goes:

What's the problem with loctite on head fasteners?

(relatively new Commando owner, and definitely a newbie at spanner-wielding)
Click to expand...
 
ed.lazda said:
Someone's got to ask the stupid question, so here goes:

What's the problem with loctite on head fasteners?

(relatively new Commando owner, and definitely a newbie at spanner-wielding)
Click to expand...

You need to retorque the head fasteners at least once after an initial startup when you install a new head gasket. You will find the fasteners may turn slightly before indicating the correct torque reading. Having Loctite™ on the threads will not allow for a true torque reading. This is not Norton specific. It applies to any engine.
 
Bill,

Your post wasn't up when I read the thread. Didn't mean to be redundant. And I go along with the several times retorqueing, but in commercial situations this is seldom done.
 
ggryder said:
JimC said:
When Grandpaul posted that he used Loctite on the head fasteners, that was it for me. I needed no more proof that he should not have a wrench in his hand, even for himself, let alone paying customers.
Click to expand...

This is exactly the problem. There's the guy and there's the business. Personally I enjoy the guy's posts as much as any body else's; maybe they're not 100% correct all of the time but whose are? 99% of the list have had no dealings with the business; are probably mildly interested in your complaints and opinions, but that's it. Last year, once it got started, there were completely unprovoked attacks on the guy, it was childish and embarrassing. You might not understand this, but Jerry does and if he see's things heading in a bad direction I personally support him in pulling the plug on a thread.

Gary
Click to expand...

I enjoyed Granpaul's posts as well. I didn't have any thing against him. I never had any dealings with him, so I assumed he was a competent bike builder. When HE said HE used Loctite on the head fasteners, including the head bolts, I wrote him off as a hack. I never bad mouthed him on this or any other forum. As far as I'm concerned, Grandpaul exposed himself. Grandpaul had ample opportunity to defend himself but chose not to.

This country has consumer protection agencies established for the very same reasons Hungry Joe posted his experience with Born Again Bikes. I'm certain you, as a prospective buyer, would want to be informed of a poor product or poor workmanship. If this is the case, then you must agree Hungry Joe did us Norton consumers a service. As for Jerry's action, I questioned that. I now have to give him the benefit of doubt.
 
bill said:
if you know much as a mechanic you also know that head fasteners are to be lubricated to achieve the the proper torque.
Click to expand...

Lubricating only when specific dictated. As far as I know Norton (head) fasteners should not be lubricated at all for proper torque.
 
I doubt that many members would have any objections to someone posting their own first hand account of a bad experience with a particular vendor or company.

However, if it is the intention of the poster to name the person, vendor or company concerned-then I think it is only right and proper for that poster to inform the administrator of his intentions and seek his approval beforehand-especially if the vendor concerned happens to be a member of this forum, then, if the administrator deems it necessary, the "other party" can be given the opportunity to respond to any allegations or give his side of the story before the topic is aired on the forum.
 
L.A.B. said:
I doubt that many members would have any objections to someone posting their own first hand account of a bad experience with a particular vendor or company.

However, if it is the intention of the poster to name the person, vendor or company concerned-then I think it is only right and proper for that poster to inform the administrator of his intentions and seek his approval beforehand-especially if the vendor concerned happens to be a member of this forum, then, if the administrator deems it necessary, the "other party" can be given the opportunity to respond to any allegations or give his side of the story before the topic is aired on the forum.
Click to expand...

so you are judge dredd? - nice! :shock:
 
mikegray660 said:
L.A.B. said:
I doubt that many members would have any objections to someone posting their own first hand account of a bad experience with a particular vendor or company.

However, if it is the intention of the poster to name the person, vendor or company concerned-then I think it is only right and proper for that poster to inform the administrator of his intentions and seek his approval beforehand-especially if the vendor concerned happens to be a member of this forum, then, if the administrator deems it necessary, the "other party" can be given the opportunity to respond to any allegations or give his side of the story before the topic is aired on the forum.
Click to expand...

so you are judge dredd? - nice! :shock:
Click to expand...

Why would I be Judge Dredd, explain?

Edit
Administrator: Jerry Doe
 
nortonspeed said:
bill said:
if you know much as a mechanic you also know that head fasteners are to be lubricated to achieve the the proper torque.
Click to expand...

Lubricating only when specific dictated. As far as I know Norton (head) fasteners should not be lubricated at all for proper torque.
Click to expand...


I don't know about Norton specific, but the torquing of fasteners is universal. Measuring applied torque is an indication of the fasteners tension. It's the tension we are interested in. The torque reading is only a relative indication that the correct tension is being applied. Torque is only a measured resistance to turning. If the fastener is resisting turning, such as a nicked thread, rust, dirt, etc. you may achieve the correct torque reading well before the fastener achieves the correct tension. If the fastener does not have the proper tension, it's not doing it's job, regardless the torque reading. That being said, I agree with Bill. A light application of a very thin weight lubricant is desirable, as well as chasing the threads with the correct die or tap. The other important factor is the surface the fastener is turning against. It must be consistent. That is the purpose of the washer. The way torque specification are derived is by using a skidmore. This device measures tension. After the correct tension is reached the torque is read. This reading then becomes the torque specification.
 
I for one have had enough of this thread. The point was made long ago.

If you want to have a torque thread please start it somewhere else. I'd be interested.

Russ
 
batrider said:
I for one have had enough of this thread. The point was made long ago.

If you want to have a torque thread please start it somewhere else. I'd be interested.

Russ
Click to expand...


The torque vs. tension explanation was in reference to to previous posts that indicated an explanation was in need. There is no need to tell us you already know it all.
 
L.A.B. said:
I doubt that many members would have any objections to someone posting their own first hand account of a bad experience with a particular vendor or company.

However, if it is the intention of the poster to name the person, vendor or company concerned-then I think it is only right and proper for that poster to inform the administrator of his intentions and seek his approval beforehand-especially if the vendor concerned happens to be a member of this forum, then, if the administrator deems it necessary, the "other party" can be given the opportunity to respond to any allegations or give his side of the story before the topic is aired on the forum.
Click to expand...

I don't think there would be problem if anyone with a complaint to make on this forum named the business, not the associated member. If you have to name a member, make the point once and then refrain from jumping on the band wagon when months down the road someone else reopens the subject.

It's tough if you feel you have legitimate grudge against someone to hold-off attacking them at every opportunity, but to everyone else on the list, who isn't taking sides, it just looks like bullying and vindictiveness.
 
Let's back the truck up. Hungry Joe posted his experience with Born Again Bikes. Bill posted that he had done warranty work on a Born Again Bike. I posted Grandpaul's comment about Loctite. Is this what you perceive as jumping on the bandwagon?

Second point: Joe was accused of being slanderous. Many members jumped on the bandwagon to defend Joe.
 
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