Barnett clutch plates.

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Yes, that is correct but the Barnet plates might not have been needed if the bronze plates would have been cleaned and ran in ATF type F instead of motor oil.
 
In the 80s when Barnett plates became available, they had difficulty with sticking. Mainly it was due to notching on the clutch center. 750s did not have hardened centers making them more of a problem, but even the hardened 850 factory centers would get notched with Barnett. I just ordered a Colorado Norton Works center that says it is vacuum heat treated. Probably will not have the notching issue. I’m using fairly new Sureflex plates on my combat.
 
Peter R said:
Some time ago I replaced the bronze clutch plates with a set of Barnett plates.
However, I found the clutch action very grabby, (if this is the correct term) it is either ON or OFF, which I find somewhat unplesant.
Does any of you have the same experience ? or a possible solution ?
Click to expand...
I have the same grabby/abrupt clutch action on my bike that still has the bronze plates. I have to concentrate to get it moving from a stand still. It was even worse before I fitted a new clutch cable. Off the bike the cable seemed to move reasonably smoothly, but when loaded there was a lot of friction. As you took pressure off the lever it wouldn't necessarily move, the cable friction holding everything in place, then it would move more than you wanted.
I wouldn't think the type of oil used would affect clutch engagement . Thick oil might hold the plates together during disengagement but, if anything, it might make for a softer engagement as the oil transmits a little torque before the plates actually contact.
 
I love the Barnett plates for several reasons.
No slip, no drag, progressively linear, smooth as buttuh clutch.



The aluminum host plates reduce rotating mass (and that clutch is a big, orbiting mess!)

The aluminum host plates do not wear the hub. At all.

They are priced right, a consumable item. I was pleased to buy a second set after 32,000 miles.
1667296067923.jpeg
 
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ggryder said:
I have the same grabby/abrupt clutch action on my bike that still has the bronze plates. I have to concentrate to get it moving from a stand still. It was even worse before I fitted a new clutch cable. Off the bike the cable seemed to move reasonably smoothly, but when loaded there was a lot of friction. As you took pressure off the lever it wouldn't necessarily move, the cable friction holding everything in place, then it would move more than you wanted.
I wouldn't think the type of oil used would affect clutch engagement . Thick oil might hold the plates together during disengagement but, if anything, it might make for a softer engagement as the oil transmits a little torque before the plates actually contact.
Click to expand...
Venhill Featherlight cable works great.
 
ggryder said:
I wouldn't think the type of oil used would affect clutch engagement . Thick oil might hold the plates together during disengagement but, if anything, it might make for a softer engagement as the oil transmits a little torque before the plates actually contact.
Click to expand...

According to Barnette's FAQ page, 1) they do not recommend automotive type oils or any additives, and 2) they say ATF is OK, Type F produces more friction and is more grabby, Dextron is smoother.

Slick
 
So what's the bottom line for using with a belt drive? Pre-lube or run dry? Hopefully the later because i don't want to have pull my clutch
 
hershey said:
Yes, that is correct but the Barnet plates might not have been needed if the bronze plates would have been cleaned and ran in ATF type F instead of motor oil.
Click to expand...
On my 850 running Type F ATF I'd still get clutch slippage in top gear after a year or so and cleaning the bronze plates would fix it for another year, that is why I installed Barnett plates...but due to the rapid wear of the splines the bronze plates are back in for now.
 
When I was doing several Commando clutch services a week, we used ATF rather than motor oil, Dexron or type-F at the customer's preference. We also used several Barnet plates mixed with the bronze ones. Three seemed to be the magic number as I recall. I did the combo pack on my MKIII and it's been so long since I had it apart that I don't remember how many Barnet plates it has. When hardened clutch centers became available we replaced many worn center with those. One fix I did on my own bike was to gin up a felt seal around the clutch rod to keep trans oil out of the clutch. That made a huge difference in service frequency and I was forbidden to do that on customers bikes. At the time, late eighties, using all-Barnet clutch packs were grabby and dragged. The hotter they got, the more they dragged, especially when soaked with gear-box oil. Many, if not most of our customers rode mostly in city traffic so clutch drag was a big deal.
 
Thomasa said:
When I was doing several Commando clutch services a week, we used ATF rather than motor oil, Dexron or type-F at the customer's preference. We also used several Barnet plates mixed with the bronze ones. Three seemed to be the magic number as I recall. I did the combo pack on my MKIII and it's been so long since I had it apart that I don't remember how many Barnet plates it has. When hardened clutch centers became available we replaced many worn center with those. One fix I did on my own bike was to gin up a felt seal around the clutch rod to keep trans oil out of the clutch. That made a huge difference in service frequency and I was forbidden to do that on customers bikes. At the time, late eighties, using all-Barnet clutch packs were grabby and dragged. The hotter they got, the more they dragged, especially when soaked with gear-box oil. Many, if not most of our customers rode mostly in city traffic so clutch drag was a big deal.
Click to expand...
The magic number so to speak for me for a reliable light clutch action (once you stop the GB oil from entering)...was fitting a anodized (thicker) pressure plate which almost made for a 1 finger operation along with careful routing and lubed cable ...now using the same plate with a dry Barnett clutch stack with hydraulic operation...smooth as
 
I am still running my original bronze clutch since new, I did have problems at first with clutch slipping but the dealer and manual said to used GTX motor oil in the clutch after trying to resolve this by experimenting with lighter oils was slowly winning but had to replace the oil in the primary more often, then the ATF type F and have had no more problems at all, I ran fiber plates for about a year when I misplaced my original bronze plates when doing the Featherbed conversion before finding them in a container of oil, in 46 years of ownership and well over 160k miles my clutch is very light and has always been since new (one finger operation if I want), hasn't slipped since 1982 have run my primary with chains, have run the stock clutch dry when running a belt drive (bites a bit quicker) and now running back with chain, I run between 5floz to 7floz of ATF-F and no more than that as well I never over fill my GB I measure all my levels by the book, I have never suffered GB oil in my primary but I do put grease on my clutch rod every time it's been pulled out, my primary cover has never leaked as I never over tighten the centre nut but after 3 or more times removed the front cover I do replace the rubber seal, I pull my clutch apart for regular maintenance every 3rd oil change or sooner if any problems.
I run a sealed bearing in my clutch housing and have only replace the clutch centre once about 12 years ago, I use to replace broken clutch cable every 6 months at first till I started to put grease on the cable where it runs through the handle bar adjuster since doing this haven't broken a clutch cable for over 35 years, I use the good V cable as well, I still run the original alloy clutch lever but I have ridden earlier Norton's with the steel levers and find for some reason they make the clutch operation stiff, not light at all.
I have heard so many complain about bronze plates but to me they work the best and will outlast any other clutch plates and work very well but still got to do maintenance on them once every so often, not a big job pulling them out, it's also a good time to make sure Rota and ALT is all running good and checking the primary chain, it's all part of maintenance and making sure everything is running right inside.
So in over 46 years of ownership have only replaced the clutch bearing once, the clutch centre once, 3 primary chains the 3rd one still going, ran a belt for about 3 years before going back to a chain and a few clutch cables in the first few years, so not bad for the bike that was an everyday rider till 2013 and for about 20 years was my only transport.

Ashley
 
ashman said:
I am still running my original bronze clutch since new, I did have problems at first with clutch slipping but the dealer and manual said to used GTX motor oil in the clutch after trying to resolve this by experimenting with lighter oils was slowly winning but had to replace the oil in the primary more often, then the ATF type F and have had no more problems at all, I ran fiber plates for about a year when I misplaced my original bronze plates when doing the Featherbed conversion before finding them in a container of oil, in 46 years of ownership and well over 160k miles my clutch is very light and has always been since new (one finger operation if I want), hasn't slipped since 1982 have run my primary with chains, have run the stock clutch dry when running a belt drive (bites a bit quicker) and now running back with chain, I run between 5floz to 7floz of ATF-F and no more than that as well I never over fill my GB I measure all my levels by the book, I have never suffered GB oil in my primary but I do put grease on my clutch rod every time it's been pulled out, my primary cover has never leaked as I never over tighten the centre nut but after 3 or more times removed the front cover I do replace the rubber seal, I pull my clutch apart for regular maintenance every 3rd oil change or sooner if any problems.
I run a sealed bearing in my clutch housing and have only replace the clutch centre once about 12 years ago, I use to replace broken clutch cable every 6 months at first till I started to put grease on the cable where it runs through the handle bar adjuster since doing this haven't broken a clutch cable for over 35 years, I use the good V cable as well, I still run the original alloy clutch lever but I have ridden earlier Norton's with the steel levers and find for some reason they make the clutch operation stiff, not light at all.
I have heard so many complain about bronze plates but to me they work the best and will outlast any other clutch plates and work very well but still got to do maintenance on them once every so often, not a big job pulling them out, it's also a good time to make sure Rota and ALT is all running good and checking the primary chain, it's all part of maintenance and making sure everything is running right inside.
So in over 46 years of ownership have only replaced the clutch bearing once, the clutch centre once, 3 primary chains the 3rd one still going, ran a belt for about 3 years before going back to a chain and a few clutch cables in the first few years, so not bad for the bike that was an everyday rider till 2013 and for about 20 years was my only transport.

Ashley
Click to expand...
I've noticed over the years Commando's without a clutch rod seal that are generally parked up on the side stand suffer alot from the EP 90 blues...
 
KiwiShane said:
I've noticed over the years Commando's without a clutch rod seal that are generally parked up on the side stand suffer alot from the EP 90 blues...
Click to expand...
If the bike is on the side stand and if the GB is not over filled then there be no way the oil could get down the clutch rod, with a centre stand the bike be level and if the GB is over filled be more chance of the oil sweeping down the clutch rod, I haven't had a centre stand since 1980 when I did the Featherbed conversion.
But as I have said I have never suffered with GB oil in my primary, I don't use the level tube I go by the right measure by the book using a measured cup, but I very rarely replace my GB oil only if I have to go inside it.
 
When the gear box is operating there is much oil splashing around inside. Some of this gets inside the mainshaft along with the clutch rod. So, when parked on the side stand, said oil runs downward toward the clutch and if not stopped somehow runs into the clutch under the pressure plate. If parked on the center stand a bit of oil will still work its way to the clutch but much more slowly. Do not over-fill the GB for the very reason Ashman says. My Matchless G80 has the same clutch and gearbox as an Atlas but the Matchless GB is rotated such that oil will run out the gear-change shaft if filled to the factory sight plug, resulting in a low oil level nearly all the time. The G80 does not suffer from GB oil in the clutch; the Atlas, however does, resulting in clutch drag but not slippage for some reason and I've never fixed it as I don't ride in town anymore. I park everyone on its center stand for more than just a day.
 
ILLF8ED said:
In the 80s when Barnett plates became available, they had difficulty with sticking. Mainly it was due to notching on the clutch center. 750s did not have hardened centers making them more of a problem, but even the hardened 850 factory centers would get notched with Barnett. I just ordered a Colorado Norton Works center that says it is vacuum heat treated. Probably will not have the notching issue. I’m using fairly new Sureflex plates on my combat.
Click to expand...
You seem to be implying just the opposite of what the results from utilizing the soft aluminum Barnett plates as opposed to the harder steel backed OEM plates. While the hard OEM steel backed bronze plates my out last the softer Barnett plates, we are then relegating the clutch hub to an "expendable" item. Better to relace the barnett plates occasionally IMO. They are less expensive than clutch hubs and much easier to change.

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