1963 650SS Australia
- Thread starter Burgs
- Start date
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- Dec 14, 2013
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- 399
Thanks Mates
Well I know who's to blame for not starting, but I am not saying as he embarrassed enough, things didn't feel right when kicking it over, compression there sometimes and not others, so this afternoon, took the rocker caps off to see if the valves are going up and down, no there were not
.
Took the timing cover off and noticed the cam nut was loose?
Removed everything thinking the cam key had sheared and that the cam must have been locked, when I pulled the cam sprocket off I thought where are the two halves of the sheared key???
Ok the clot forgot to put the key in, he is sure he did though, more looking and still no remains of evidence of a key ever been fitted.
Refitted the sprocket nut to check the cam and all feels good, valve springs spin the cam no problem, end play feels good, so where did the key go
?
Checked my box that I had the Norton woodruff key set in and no key in there, so give up and hopefully I am able to pick one from Classic Bike Spares tomorrow.
Hopefully I have a good feeling story to tell tomorrow
.
Best Regards
Burgs
Well I know who's to blame for not starting, but I am not saying as he embarrassed enough, things didn't feel right when kicking it over, compression there sometimes and not others, so this afternoon, took the rocker caps off to see if the valves are going up and down, no there were not
.Took the timing cover off and noticed the cam nut was loose?
Removed everything thinking the cam key had sheared and that the cam must have been locked, when I pulled the cam sprocket off I thought where are the two halves of the sheared key???
Ok the clot forgot to put the key in, he is sure he did though, more looking and still no remains of evidence of a key ever been fitted
.Refitted the sprocket nut to check the cam and all feels good, valve springs spin the cam no problem, end play feels good, so where did the key go
?Checked my box that I had the Norton woodruff key set in and no key in there, so give up and hopefully I am able to pick one from Classic Bike Spares tomorrow.
Hopefully I have a good feeling story to tell tomorrow
.Best Regards
Burgs
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2013
- Messages
- 399
Hi All
Good feeling today, ended up machining a new key for the cam, fitted timed and tried kick starting but gave up.
Got the roller starter out and she fired up straight away, no idle though
Lifted the slides a bit and decided to see if she would start on the kick starter, all good but had to raise the idle more, bugger that inside adjuster is hard to get too.
Need to get the tacho looked at it is bouncing between 1000 and about 2000 revs per min, at steady idle it sits still.
Now starting and idling nicely, so next step check everything over and fit the primary cover and the foot rests.
I will try and upload a video of the start when I work out how, keeps saying file to large.
Best Regards
Burgs
Good feeling today, ended up machining a new key for the cam, fitted timed and tried kick starting but gave up.
Got the roller starter out and she fired up straight away, no idle though
Lifted the slides a bit and decided to see if she would start on the kick starter, all good but had to raise the idle more, bugger that inside adjuster is hard to get too.
Need to get the tacho looked at it is bouncing between 1000 and about 2000 revs per min, at steady idle it sits still.
Now starting and idling nicely, so next step check everything over and fit the primary cover and the foot rests.
I will try and upload a video of the start when I work out how, keeps saying file to large.
Best Regards
Burgs
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2013
- Messages
- 399
Hi Strom
Yeah a bit embarrassing, the workshop is at home, I sold off a precision grinder and a 3 access Vertical Machining Centre earlier this year, the new owner then offered me a job setting them up in his workshop, doing heavy Cat earthmoving remanufacturing, probably do that for a couple of years and then retire.
I still use the machines for my bike stuff which is good and I still have a 5 axis CNC, a CNC Colchester, a lathe Colchester Mascot Lathe and a small Taiwanese lathe at home to play with in my spare time.
Got to fit the primary side cover today and tidy up ready for historic registration, then hopefully get out and see if there are any bugs in her, plus fine tuning of course.
Best Regards
Burgs
Yeah a bit embarrassing, the workshop is at home, I sold off a precision grinder and a 3 access Vertical Machining Centre earlier this year, the new owner then offered me a job setting them up in his workshop, doing heavy Cat earthmoving remanufacturing, probably do that for a couple of years and then retire.
I still use the machines for my bike stuff which is good and I still have a 5 axis CNC, a CNC Colchester, a lathe Colchester Mascot Lathe and a small Taiwanese lathe at home to play with in my spare time.
Got to fit the primary side cover today and tidy up ready for historic registration, then hopefully get out and see if there are any bugs in her, plus fine tuning of course.
Best Regards
Burgs
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2013
- Messages
- 613
Did you get to sort out the thin bolts that link the stand mounts to the engine plates?, not having them is a likely reason for the bent frame rails.
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- Dec 14, 2013
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Hi Bob
Yes had to do a bit of a job to get them to fit , but there in and Loctited in place.
Reset the valve clearances and now basically only need to look at the kick starter and she is away.
Fitted the primary cover, rear brake and footrests today, light switch kept moving on the handle bar and a mate said to Supa glue in place, bugger me if it didn't work, not sure for how long though, might do the same for brake and clutch levers?
I have a bad oil leak at the two front inner head bolts, leaks oil at the 3rd fins up, I fixed this on the Commando with a sealant under the washers and head of the bolt mating surfaces, if that doesn't work I will take the head off and check out what is going on.
Need to find some decent exhaust clamps next anybody got any that work and are not ugly?
Best Regards
Burgs
Yes had to do a bit of a job to get them to fit , but there in and Loctited in place.
Reset the valve clearances and now basically only need to look at the kick starter and she is away.
Fitted the primary cover, rear brake and footrests today, light switch kept moving on the handle bar and a mate said to Supa glue in place, bugger me if it didn't work, not sure for how long though, might do the same for brake and clutch levers?
I have a bad oil leak at the two front inner head bolts, leaks oil at the 3rd fins up, I fixed this on the Commando with a sealant under the washers and head of the bolt mating surfaces, if that doesn't work I will take the head off and check out what is going on.
Need to find some decent exhaust clamps next anybody got any that work and are not ugly?
Best Regards
Burgs
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- Nov 29, 2013
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- 613
I have the same oil leak (minor) on the 99 , never had it before I "improved" the head oil supply!.
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- Nov 11, 2013
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I used the DRC SS clamps. They looked pretty good on, and I positioned them so the bolt was vertical on the inside, so it didnt stick out and catch when I was kicking it over. The spot welds aren't the most sightly, but are more noticeable in the pic than in real life. They clamp better than the cheap horseshoe style chrome clamps.
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- Dec 14, 2013
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Hi thanks for that, I bought a cheap one last 41-47mm and it closed up on the pipe just as it started to take hold, guess they should have been marked 44-47.
I will try the local bike shop and see if they stock them, they usually look blank when ask for something out of the ordinary, don't have a part number and if the bike is a bit old.
What size did you fit, the muffler is 44mm I see they have 40-43 and 44-47
Burgs
I will try the local bike shop and see if they stock them, they usually look blank when ask for something out of the ordinary, don't have a part number and if the bike is a bit old.
What size did you fit, the muffler is 44mm I see they have 40-43 and 44-47
Burgs
- Joined
- Nov 11, 2013
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- 5,396
My Commando had 1 3/8" exhausts, and the 36-39mm fit fine.
No they are not, what are you thinking?
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=T-Bar+clamps&FORM=HDRSC2
Images of DRC Ss clamps;
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=drc+ss+clamps&qpvt=DRC+SS+clamps&FORM=IGRE
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=T-Bar+clamps&FORM=HDRSC2
Images of DRC Ss clamps;
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=drc+ss+clamps&qpvt=DRC+SS+clamps&FORM=IGRE
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- Dec 14, 2013
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- 399
Hi
The ones I tried last week were the T Bar style, not as strong the brand DSR SS (Trade Name by the looks of it) style which in the old days was known to me as a super clamp, and I see they are still being called that here in Australia.
The T Bar style clamp I have is marked 41-47mm range but at 44mm they are bound, so not true.
I have ordered two Super clamps range 40-43mm, with the hope they can be made to fit the 44mm, I am thinking that if the nut is wound all but off I might be able to get it over the muffler inlet.
The 650SS has 1 3/8" pipes but at the muffler entry they are bulged up to 1.612" and the exhaust OD is 1 3/4".
Best Regards
Burgs
The ones I tried last week were the T Bar style, not as strong the brand DSR SS (Trade Name by the looks of it) style which in the old days was known to me as a super clamp, and I see they are still being called that here in Australia.
The T Bar style clamp I have is marked 41-47mm range but at 44mm they are bound, so not true.
I have ordered two Super clamps range 40-43mm, with the hope they can be made to fit the 44mm, I am thinking that if the nut is wound all but off I might be able to get it over the muffler inlet.
The 650SS has 1 3/8" pipes but at the muffler entry they are bulged up to 1.612" and the exhaust OD is 1 3/4".
Best Regards
Burgs
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2013
- Messages
- 399
Hi
Super Clamps turned up today, had to make some small changes to them to get them to work, shortened the little spacer under the head of the bolt, and flattened the radius a tad, after fitting and tighten them up ended up with a few threads sticking out of the nut so all good, at least they are nice and tight.
Been having trouble with the fuel line thought it would have been clear plastic so fitted some and it kept kinking no matter which way I ran it, had a look at the photos of the original police bikes and they were rubber with steel ferrules, so used rubber and setup as close as I could work out to be like the originals, looks a lot better IMO.
Guess the next thing is the oil leaking out of the two, or could it be the three front head nuts, I am thinking head off would be best, but may try a sealant on the washers and nuts first.
Might work as long as it doesn't leak out of the gasket lower down?
Burgs
Super Clamps turned up today, had to make some small changes to them to get them to work, shortened the little spacer under the head of the bolt, and flattened the radius a tad, after fitting and tighten them up ended up with a few threads sticking out of the nut so all good, at least they are nice and tight.
Been having trouble with the fuel line thought it would have been clear plastic so fitted some and it kept kinking no matter which way I ran it, had a look at the photos of the original police bikes and they were rubber with steel ferrules, so used rubber and setup as close as I could work out to be like the originals, looks a lot better IMO.
Guess the next thing is the oil leaking out of the two, or could it be the three front head nuts, I am thinking head off would be best, but may try a sealant on the washers and nuts first.
Might work as long as it doesn't leak out of the gasket lower down?
Burgs
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2013
- Messages
- 399
Hi
Did a 2 mile ride, mirrors both turned into whirly birds, clutch needs some attention, very hard to pull in, feels like the springs are too tight?
There was a bad miss, found the choke lever had moved to about half way position, tightened the damper down on the lever
.
The clutch is releasing good and there are no signs of slippage so I will back off the springs some and see what happens.
Loctited the mirrors and did them up tight, general check over, and then did a 9 mile ride, this time the handle bar switch did the whirly bird thing.
Still a miss at about 4,000 revs, can get through it with gentle throttle control and it purrs along quite well, so a bit of fine tuning to be done.
Did a 2 mile ride, mirrors both turned into whirly birds, clutch needs some attention, very hard to pull in, feels like the springs are too tight?
There was a bad miss, found the choke lever had moved to about half way position, tightened the damper down on the lever
The clutch is releasing good and there are no signs of slippage so I will back off the springs some and see what happens.
Loctited the mirrors and did them up tight, general check over, and then did a 9 mile ride, this time the handle bar switch did the whirly bird thing.
Still a miss at about 4,000 revs, can get through it with gentle throttle control and it purrs along quite well, so a bit of fine tuning to be done.
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2013
- Messages
- 613
To get a nice clutch has taken a lot of "fetling" . Very flat plates, springs as close to slip as possible, lift set up with a dial gauge ,oversize rollers to restrict wobble,a Venhill cable lubed with thin silicone,7/8th centers lever, modified box lever radius,drilled g/box plates for better cable run,bar risers to improve lever angle and avoid fouling fork nuts,thin oil, ETC ,ETC, Wrong spec new springs (supplied by Norton specialist!) was the hardest to spot. Mike up the wire guage and I'll tell you if its right.I have the info somewhere but will only look if you do.
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- Nov 11, 2013
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- 5,396
Looking good!
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2013
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- 399
Thanks Gortnipper.
Hi Bob what I have is new plates (RGM), cable measures 0.077" from memory it is a Venhill, lubed with Silicone spray until it came out the gearbox end, 7/8" levers, does anyone know the length of the pushrod, mine appears to be too short at 9.655", at the gearbox end the push rod lever is too close to the cable entry and looks like it could be hitting up against the cable adjuster?
RGM states pre Commando pushrod 9 11/16" (9.688 -0.010") that makes it 0.013" short, looks to me like it needs about be about 0.100" longer, maybe the new plates stack height is greater then standard?
The other thing that makes me think the stack height is different, is that if you adjust as per the book with the adjusters flush with end of the studs there is even less travel on the lever, so I have backed them off.
I think I will try a Commando pushrod, got one ordered.
Burgs
Hi Bob what I have is new plates (RGM), cable measures 0.077" from memory it is a Venhill, lubed with Silicone spray until it came out the gearbox end, 7/8" levers, does anyone know the length of the pushrod, mine appears to be too short at 9.655", at the gearbox end the push rod lever is too close to the cable entry and looks like it could be hitting up against the cable adjuster?
RGM states pre Commando pushrod 9 11/16" (9.688 -0.010") that makes it 0.013" short, looks to me like it needs about be about 0.100" longer, maybe the new plates stack height is greater then standard?
The other thing that makes me think the stack height is different, is that if you adjust as per the book with the adjusters flush with end of the studs there is even less travel on the lever, so I have backed them off.
I think I will try a Commando pushrod, got one ordered.
Burgs
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