What's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

My Mark 3 - a question on this mystery piece.

I was putting the innards of my primary case(s) back together, after:
1) replacing the sprag
2) re-setting the torque on the anti-backfire device and replacing a broken nut (yes, I put it back together with Locktite, and peened the nut)
3) replacing a broken clutch location circlip
4) fixing cracked insulators on wires on the stator (Sparx 3-phase) (used a combo of "liquid electric tape - amazing stuff, and double-wall shrink tubing)
and generally cleaning things up.

I had the inner and outer primary covers off, which I have done at least 3 times previously over the years, and know my way around in there pretty well by now (and have the service manual and parts diagrams).

However, when near the tail end of the project today, I went to put the rotor back on I found this unfamiliar item stuck to the rotor in my plastic bin. I scoured the parts diagrams, and my memory, and can't figure out where this came from .

Maybe it was in my plastic parts bin before I started my dis-assembly and I didn't notice?

It sure looks like a locating dowel for something. But the 2 locating dowels on the outer primary are both female (hollow) to allow screws to pass through them.

Anybody recognize this?

DIMENSIONS: 1/4" diameter and 3/4" long



Not closing up the outer primary until I solve this .

Thanks

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

that looks like the idler gear spindle. Pt.no 06-4703

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

303 fmj said:

that looks like the idler gear spindle. Pt.no 06-4703

Click to expand...

You beat me to it.

http://www.nortonmotors.de/ANIL/Norton% ... 012&Part=4 Item [4]

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

my money is on the locating dowel for the stator outrigger.
If it is the idler spindle and it was inside the primary just how did it get in there?

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

AntrimMan said:

my money is on the locating dowel for the stator outrigger.
If it is the idler spindle and it was inside the primary just how did it get in there?

Click to expand...

Well--maybe but the one in mine is 1/4 dia and 1-1/4" long.----I just pulled it out and measured it.

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

no offense meant at all.
The idler gear spindle is diameter .375 and hollow with internal threads for easy removal.
All the best.

Re: Whaat's this extra piece from Primary Dis-assembly?

It's one of the two the dowel pins that locate the outer cover.

The dowel pins that locate the outer cover are hollow, for the screws to pass through.

This piece is solid, and only 1/4" diameter.

And it is not the idler gear spindle either.

I'm leaning to the conclusion that it was in already in my plastic tray i pulled from under the bench to place parts during dis-assembly. But will take another very thorough look at all the options tomorrow before I close up the outer cover.

pkeithkelly said:

The dowel pins that locate the outer cover are hollow, for the screws to pass through.

This piece is solid, and only 1/4" diameter.

And it is not the idler gear spindle either.

I'm leaning to the conclusion that it was in already in my plastic tray i pulled from under the bench to place parts during dis-assembly. But will take another very thorough look at all the options tomorrow before I close up the outer cover.

Click to expand...

The primary cover is retained by only ONE bolt in the center... and located by two pins. Are we talking apples and cannonballs here? :mrgreen:

I believe he has a Mark3.

Guido said:

I believe he has a Mark3.

Click to expand...

doh.

Outrigger dowel???

http://www.nortonmotors.de/ANIL/Norton% ... 11&Part=19 Item 19

Bingo - it is the dowel pin for the stator outrigger.

How about that, all those other times I took the primary components apart, I didn't even notice this little dowel pin existed. It must have always remained inside the outrigger, or inside it's sleeve on the inner primary.

Thanks, LAB and AntrimMan - good detective work. I'll finish the re-assembly, turn the key and hop on for a ride - it's a gorgeous day here in Southern California (again).

Keith

The outrigger dowel is 1/4" dia and 1-1/4" long---at least in my MK3---i just pulled it and measured it----you said the part is only 3/4" long--???

303 fmj said:

The outrigger dowel is 1/4" dia and 1-1/4" long---at least in my MK3---i just pulled it and measured it----you said the part is only 3/4" long--???

Click to expand...

According to the parts book, the outrigger dowel is the same part as the timing cover dowel: 06-7621/NM11790.

I don't have any spare 06-7621 items to measure, but 1-1/4" seems excessive?

Be careful with what you find on the floor. Yesterday I was putting the engine and gearbox back in the bike. Suddenly I start finding ball bearings scattered across the floor. Freaked me out for a minute. Where the heck are these coming from? Start reviewing all the Norton bits to see where the source is. Then I look down at a little roll around seat that I have and realize they are coming from a broken caster on it. Whew!

Yes, the dowel is only 3/4" long.

It protrudes enough from one recess to engage the opposite/mating surface, although I can see that a longer one would also fit, as the 3/4" length does reach "end-to-end" from the bottom of one recess to the bottom of the other. If it was 1 1/4" it would probably fit in there. Not sure why mine is shorter, but it still does the job.

Actually, having a locator dowel/pin for the stator outrigger seems kind of overkill, since the outrigger is already sitting on the 4 studs.

In any case, it's back together, cleaned up, and running.

All good, appreciate the help.

L.A.B. said:

303 fmj said:

The outrigger dowel is 1/4" dia and 1-1/4" long---at least in my MK3---i just pulled it and measured it----you said the part is only 3/4" long--???

Click to expand...

According to the parts book, the outrigger dowel is the same part as the timing cover dowel: 06-7621/NM11790.

I don't have any spare 06-7621 items to measure, but 1-1/4" seems excessive?

Click to expand...

Hello L.A.B.------it may seem excessive but this is what it measured in mine---look at the thickness of the location bore in the outrigger and then the depth of the bore in the cover---3/4 " may be ok but the pin would not locate in the outrigger all the way through---perhaps only part way---it may work--then it is also a possibility that someone replaced the pin in my MK3 somewhere along the way and installed a longer pin. I guess this is what causes all these mysteries--substituted parts that work and owners, like I, who then think they are original--I need a few parts yet so I'll order one just to see what I get from my OEM Norton parts supplier. I will reply when I get it ---added to this post.

303 fmj said:

-----it may seem excessive but this is what it measured in mine---look at the thickness of the location bore in the outrigger and then the depth of the bore in the cover---3/4 " may be ok but the pin would not locate in the outrigger all the way through---

Click to expand...

If we look at the dowel in two of the Old Britts photos then I think we should be able to agree that it's protruding by around 1/4"?


http://www.oldbritts.com/e_start_gears.html

Check Jed's blog photo, as I think you will see that again, the dowel only protrudes by a small amount.
http://members.ii.net/~janards/commando ... moved.html

I don't have a spare dowel-but I do have a spare inner cover, and the depth of the drilling is just under 1/2" so about right for a 3/4" dowel with 1/4" visible. I don't recall that dowel protruding by as much as 3/4" when working on my own Mk3. It is curious that the drilling in the outrigger plate is far deeper than it needed to be.

http://www.norvilmotorcycle.co.uk/067621.htm

Actually, the drilling for this pin, in my outrigger plate is a through & through--goes completely through the boss---so the extra length of my pin is flush with the outside surface of the plate. ??????? different plates---design change--??? or modified for some reason by the PO of my MK 3 ?