rear suspension

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So I am the 'resident troll' ? At least I don't subscribe to the religion that dictates a Norton Commando is beyond improvement.
 
Rohan said:
Can someone even make constructive comments about Commando handling - if they've never ridden one ??
A constant diet of negativity just doesn't go down real well...

I've only ever ridden Commandos with Koni's.
Had a set rebuilt the other day, might be while before get to try them though.
Are the Ikons as good ?
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Yep, Ikons are just as good (so far ). I had a set of Konis on a Trident for 25 years before they needed new seals.
Got Ikons on one Commando, about 3 years old, they were originally made for new Triumph T100, but go straight on,
maybe 1/2 "shorter than originals but no problems .
sam
 
Ikons brought all the tooling from Koni shocks and are the same in every way, I rebuild my 35 year old Konis and got all the parts from Ikons and also brought a new set of Ikons for my project bike and they are the same as my old Konis with the same ajustments but shorter for the Slimline frame.

Ashley
 
acotrel said:
At least I don't subscribe to the religion that dictates a Norton Commando is beyond improvement.
Click to expand...

I agree with this comment. Maybe some of us are trying "too" hard to get the best out of our Commandos. Certainly the handling of a properly set-up Commando can be excellent...the question that eludes is "What is a properly set-up Commando?"

The search for improvement and understanding should not be misinterpreted as "bashing". I've felt that a bit myself the past couple of days and that is far from what I or others have been doing.

I just purchased a set of JS Turcite fork bushings and Aluminum sleeves this morning even though I just rebuilt the forks...in an attempt to improve the suspension. I'm hoping with the Landsdowne Dampers, new tubes, springs and components I will have a pretty decent set-up in the front.

Rear shocks are still a question mark for me...are the Ikons the best? Are there better options? Seems the choices are much less for the rear as they are for the front.
 
There are many rear shocks on the market with diffrent price ranges, I kept with Ikons as I have been so happy with the way my old Konis work and handle and after 33 years on my Norton and a lot of hard riding under them, they have very much proven themself, it wasn't a hard or big job to rebuild them myself and thats the good thing about them they are rebuildable which a lot of shock can't be.

I just ordered a set of Gazzi shockes for my Triumph Thruxton, they were a bit cheaper than the Ikons and are also rebuildable, so be intresting to see how they hold up to my hard riding.

Ashley
 
xbacksideslider said:
kommando said:
Ikon provide all the information, their part number for the Commando shock is 7610-1653, this link takes you to a pdf which provides all the dimensions.

http://www.ikonsuspension.com.au/download/details.pdf
Click to expand...

Kommando, sorry to bother you but I don't see that part number on that page and I'd like to save the information.
Click to expand...



It's right down the list, quite well hidden but it's there.

7610-1653

length 330mm ( 12.99")
travel 51mm ( 2.01")
spring 205-17/24/31
It's a bit hard to tell from that table but it may need a narrow spring to fit a Commando. There's a narrow spring option.
 
Ooooops, thanks Pommie John.

My Konis don't leak but they've lost a lot of their damping.
I imagine I can get a part number off of them.
Those that have done it, same me some time, how do I get the right kit through IKON?
I'd also like to lengthen them, maybe 1/2 inch, do they sell longer replacement shafts too?
 
xbacksideslider said:
Ooooops, thanks Pommie John.

My Konis don't leak but they've lost a lot of their damping.
I imagine I can get a part number off of them.
Those that have done it, same me some time, how do I get the right kit through IKON?
I'd also like to lengthen them, maybe 1/2 inch, do they sell longer replacement shafts too?
Click to expand...


I don't think they sell replacement shafts. I bent a set of shocks ( don't ask, but it hurt quite a lot) and had to get the shafts straightened because there were no replacement available. That was maybe 7 or 8 years ago so maybe you can get them now.
 
i did think the travel was about 50mm, so will work with that for now,
I have just changed the frame so the swinging arm now pivots off the frame, and the isolastics just look after the engine and gearbox, i always had problems with the pivot, it was an old police 850 and had extra clamps when i got it 25 years ago. i have tried everythpng bar welding it up. when it is back together this time we will see....ii
 
kickstart said:
i did think the travel was about 50mm, so will work with that for now,
I have just changed the frame so the swinging arm now pivots off the frame, and the isolastics just look after the engine and gearbox, i always had problems with the pivot, it was an old police 850 and had extra clamps when i got it 25 years ago. i have tried everythpng bar welding it up. when it is back together this time we will see....ii
Click to expand...



Interesting idea but I understood that the reason for including the swinging arm inn the Iso section was to prevent the chain from suffering if the engine/gearbox moved with vibration but the rear wheel didn't.

I'd be interested to see how you get on with chain wear with your set up.
 
acotrel said:
I suggest having a talk to other commando owners and asking about the natural steering tendencies of their bikes, and record spring rates and shocker lengths. I'd try to find a setting which tightens the bike's line slightly when coming out of tight corners gassing it hard. It is an age old habit to accept the manufacturer's original settings and simply ride around bad handling . It happens in historic racing all the time along with incorrect gearing. You can ride a standard bike and love it even though it is a slug. Why would anyone ride a Harley unless they were deluded ?
Doug Macrae rides a racer with mainly commando parts - ask him where his bike tends to go when he relaxes.
Click to expand...

I ride a Harley Davidson XR1200X with Vance and Hines race bits on it and it handles just fine thank you. I would suggest that most of the folks on this list do not race on the street. Average age, money invested in their machines, maturity and common sense. A 40 year old Norton is not a race bike. Race bikes are uncomfortable as heck anyway...if they are competitive.

Put a good set of Hagons on it and enjoy. You want quicker turn-in put slightly longer shocks in the back and an 18in front wheel with sticky rubber. And then you start down the rabbit hole as you now realize the front end is too soft and the brakes aren't good enough, etc. etc. Make it comfortable and reliable then ride it for enjoyment.

Cheers, Frank
 
i used to run Fontana rear shocks, but sold them to a mate who put hem on a Z1000 Rickman. they seem to have disappeared?
does anyone use the Fournals air shocks?
 
I suggest you make it so the handling is always predictable, safe and suits your riding style and the power characteristics of the bike. It is most uncomfortable lying in a hospital bed .
 
acotrel said:
I did not suggest that commandos have bad handling. Rohan has said I have never ridden one and would not know. My comments about rear shocks were general and apply to any bike. In the past I have commented about isolastics, and the fact that a bike which relies on the motor head steady for good handling is not something that I want to ride - I have been hurt enough in my short life. I have not yet seen a thread started on here by others which relates suspension settings to handling. I would have thought that an opportunity for improvement would be welcomed, even by the more self-satisfied conservatives amongst us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOlDGxTN9vI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHVFS8e3cRY
Click to expand...
well if you wouldnt want to ride a bike that depends on its head steady for good handling then surely you would not want to ride a manxman or any other featherbed framed norton as they all rely on a good headsteady to support the headstock regards baz
 
The rear wheel is not coupled almost directly to the headstock yet isolated from the rider's bum and feet on a manx Norton. The head steady is a turnbuckle used to strain the motor in the frame. The swing arm is supported at both sides by plates welded to the frame so the rider has direct feel of the rear contact patch through his hands and backside. Anybody who has ever ridden a pre-unit triumph fast knows what flex feels like. It cannot be tolerated if you want to be safe - It destroys confidence with good reason. Have a ride on a manx sometime, Baz - they inspire a lot of confidence - stable and fairly neutral, wherever you want to send them you set your mind, and wind on the power. If the handling depends on the head steady, you are asking for trouble. I've raced Tritons with the head steady broken and there is no difference in handling , however the frame is likely to crack somewhere due to vibes when the motor can move. The head steady only has to be very flimsy to stop that happening. My Mk3 Seeley has a bit of spring built into the front down tube in one direction to stop cracking, and the head steady has rose joints to allow it to jump slightly without breaking the bolts.
I apologise for having this discussion, I know you guys love and believe in your commandos, and they are probably OK if you keep at them. I just get a bit concerned, it is very unpleasant if a bike suddenly goes out of control for no apparent reason. I've had it happen and escaped only because of my previous experience at crashing. It can end someone's career almost before it has started. When I started racing in 1967, I crashed at the first 5 meetings, and once four times in one day. Knowing what I know now, I'm amazed that I'm still alive - so bloody dangerous. Those drum brakes - JAM THEM ! They are a good way to get dead.
 
kickstart said:
does anyone use the Fournals air shocks?
Click to expand...

I tried one - on a monoshock bike.
Bought it VERY cheap, very well used.
It wouldn't hold air long enough to get a good ride out of it.
Seemed ok for a short run.

They too have disappeared, it will have to be repaired by a shock specialist, not the maker ?
Still tossing up if its worth having done...

rear suspension


P.S. We see that Ohlins have available a pair of shocks suitable for Commando use.
Bit expensive, ($800 ??) - not as much as the Fournales were. ?
 
acotrel said:
Knowing what I know now, I'm amazed that I'm still alive - so bloody dangerous. Those drum brakes - JAM THEM ! They are a good way to get dead.
Click to expand...


You need to find a good cruiser, and learn how to go for a long relaxing ride on the highways and byways.

Not this frantic manic existence you seem to have been living - and advocating here ??
 
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