New Owner of '68 Commando

I supose you COULD use That One for makeing a CHOPPER . 8) :lol:

Spine metal is as thick a paper match book cover or light metal gas tank. Me pellet rife can shoot through a side and ding the other. Educational view. Solid mounted engine in standard frame fracture above the rear iso frame tube. I don't understand the drop shipping hurting them I thought they were all shipped in crates with wheels off and crate crushing injury needed to impart impact into cycle frame. I'd suspect unused distortion from the heating so much of under side of thin mild tube while top remained cool. Its pretty straight forward to mimic the lasting corrected frames, not the scab on slab side brace style.

In the UK, they were delivered off the back of a truck/lorry ?

There is a pic somewhere of a whole row of Commandos all lined up on the back, roped down.
Not sure how far away you had to be to get them crated.... ?

Hm maybe only the later Brit bikes were crated as there is a sunk cargo ship off coast of Saudi that divers visit with dozens of bikes BSA's mostly, still strapped down on tires or fallen over each other on deck not boxed at all. Shades of the Super Constellation loosing its tail section over ocean mystery, until one fell apart on the run way.

Wartime was different for overseas deliveries ?- crating materials would have been in short supply ?

Perhaps you need to check your 'facts' before posting too. ?
It wasn't a Super Constellation, don't give them a bad name.
It was a Comet - and it failed in a vibration tank.
And was a square hatch cut in the roof - for some sort of equipment.
Nowadays almost all cuts are oval, even window and door edges...

Rohan said:

In the UK, they were delivered off the back of a truck/lorry ?

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Home market bikes were probably delivered already assembled, so likely they would have been rolled down a ramp or plank.

Rohan said:

Not sure how far away you had to be to get them crated.... ?

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Presumably, far enough away that a certain part of the journey involved being stacked in the hold of a cargo ship (and various warehouses?) so basically, anywhere outside the UK mainland.

Wasn't the story that that plank was fairly short. ?
So they had a fairly lumpy landing...

Rohan said:

Wasn't the story that that plank was fairly short. ?
So they had a fairly lumpy landing...

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I think that must have been a different Norton plank story? :wink:

Thats the story about the Fastbacks breaking/cracking their steering heads on delivery ??

How many other stories like this are there about ???

Whilst at Andover, NV received a Royal Enfield Bullet 500, from India. The request was for it to be repacked and returned to RE India, to demonstrate packing techniques.
Initially the box appeared to be big enough to contain two bikes, certainly the box was well made with several long lengths of 4" x 4" teak! The various panels (sides, ends, top) were I think screwed together, presumably for re-use. The sides, top etc appeared to be made from quite thick plywood. The packing was dismantled, to reveal the RE Bullet, standing on its centre stand, lashed down to the bottom panel. The bike looked as if it could be filled with petrol and ridden away, no dismantling had taken place. The thing that entertained us though was that the bike looked as if it had been assembled and then painted. It was painted in a sort of Air Force pale blue/grey, on the headlamp glass and tyres overspray could be seen where the mask didn't quite fit, all the switchgear, seat(!), wiring everything was a pale blue/grey!

In the early 70s I lived just around the corner from Park Road Motorcycles in Southampton who were Norton agents, all of 27 miles from Andover. I have vague memories of new bikes being delivered wrapped in corrugated cardboard and heavy gauge polythene sheet. I also have a mental image of a bike in a packing case, being unpacked in the street, so what's what I'm not sure.
cheers
wakeup

Rohan said:

Thats the story about the Fastbacks breaking/cracking their steering heads on delivery ??

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But that was apparently caused by the crates being pushed off the backs of trucks in the US, nothing to do with any "plank" as far as I know?

Rohan said:

How many other stories like this are there about ???

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Norton plank stories?

As Steve pointed out, they don't have front wheels fitted while in the crates.
(Or forks ?).

How are they going to be damaged in the crates ?

Rohan said:

As Steve pointed out, they don't have front wheels fitted while in the crates.
(Or forks ?).

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I'm sure the forks would have still been fitted.

Rohan said:

How are they going to be damaged in the crates ?

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I thought jimbo had already explained?

jimbo said:

Rohan said:

........
Wasn't there some discussion initially that it was caused by rough unloading from the transport,
when delivering new bikes to Dealers.
Then more of them started breaking....

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Yes Frame breakage was blamed on poor transport, I have documents suggesting the bikes were held down by the tank mounts which was the real problem(or one of them) , the bracket was welded across the down tubes( bad practice really) and when the bikes were cinched down to that bracket the welds cracked. With the down tubes compromised the main tube couldn't cope.

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What with that, and the shock from the crate being allowed to drop anything up to 6 ft (Sprayson text) especially if pushed off "forks first" it isn't going to do the bike much good seeing how close the forks are to the end of the crate in the photo above.

I very much doubt anything was dead dropped 6 feet to the pavement.
Could one end be lowered to the ground then the 'lorry moved forward,maybe,to the point of bending the cradle who would know.
A jolt is not going to start a crack (stress riser) unless there was a easy to see sign of tube collapse which would be plain to see.

The picture up the page shows vibration or harmonic induced cracking no different to those seen on some Kawasaki triples when the engine mounts were run loose.
Given isolatics, harmonics would be a factor,it was hardly likely to crack like that in the first 100 miles.
Note also the top tube crack running inline with the toe of the weld.

More fables perhaps,I notice one major US parts retailer (Walnecks) mentioning barrel shaped rollers.
You know the ones with no load bearing capacity ie a barrel element in a flat outer race track.

The featherbed frame / headstock problems were said to be bumps and gutter related....

Were all Nortons crated like that. ?

The only bike I've seen uncrated (not Norton) had the forks packed in separately,
along with the front wheel packed down the side.
Makes for a much shorter crate.

Time Warp said:

I very much doubt anything was dead dropped 6 feet to the pavement.

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I see no reason to disbelieve the words of Ken Sprayson although I wouldn't have thought it would be a dead drop, more likely the crates would have been pushed to the point where they overbalanced and toppled to the ground.

Rohan said:

Where all Nortons crated like that. ?

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I don't know, but every crated Commando I've seen pictures of, has had the forks in place.

Here's another:

If that was the sole cause, you'd expect to hear of a few bikes arriving with visible damage already, out of the crate ??

And bikes not been crated never suffering the problem ??

L.A.B. said:

Time Warp said:

I very much doubt anything was dead dropped 6 feet to the pavement.

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I see no reason to disbelieve the words of Ken Sprayson although I wouldn't have thought it would be a dead drop, more likely the crates would have been pushed to the point where they overbalanced and toppled to the ground.

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Given the picture of the crated Norton (which is similar to any crated bike) it wold be hard to get direct impact to the head stock area (no front wheel)
It was also noted by Renolds that it was not weld composition related nor weld spec yet both fracture points (3 in total) start at weld toe points.

If the frame was that brittle that it could be compromised by a low impact (ie running into a brick wall at some 2 mph would most likely bend the fork stanchions before bending the top tube and front tubes on a duplex frame) then the tube material would be a factor,also ruled out by Renolds.
Its simply a poor design and failed in use for what ever reason.
Where is the US court case of the day for compensation by Norton UK ?
Who payed for the recalls

Given the Commando was the only design using isolatics and that frame lay out had been used previously then it may very well come back to a simple case of a new design (isolatic engine mounting) not working with a frame design that worked fine prior to that addition.