New hydraulic timing chain tensioner.

Jim
you have mail!
JohnT

Here is the instructions for mounting the hydraulic tensioner. Any suggestions to improve the instructions would be welcome. Jim

To install the hydraulic tensioner.

1. Remove the old tensioner and the mounting studs.

2. Be aware that when you remove the zip tie from the new tensioner the plunger
and shoe can fall out. If they do there are several small parts that may fall
out also. It is best to leave the zip tie in place until you are ready to bleed
the tensioner.

3. See that the top run of the timing chain is tight. You may need to rotate the
engine slightly with the kickstarter to make it tight.

4. Hold the tensioner in position to see if there is going to be clearance between
the chain and the engine case just above the dowel. There needs to be at least
.080 to .1 inch between the chain and the aluminum. If there is not enough
clearance then you would want to mask the area and use a dremel type tool to
remove some material there.





5. Before the final installation of the tensioner you will want to remove the zip
tie and immerse the tensioner in oil with the hole up while pumping the plunger
until it gets hard and the air bubbles stop coming out of the hole. Using a
piece of wire or small welding rod you can put it in the hole to open the check
valve and allow the shoe to retract.

6. Now put the new tensioner in place and install the mounting bolts. Make sure
there is clearance between backside of the tensioner and the front of the
intermediate gear. A few thousandth is all that is needed. Just make sure
tightening the tensioner does not clamp the gear in place. If there is no
clearance you can reinstall the thin plate that was behind the original
tensioner to space it out a bit.



7. Now with a .035 to .040 feeler or spark plug gauge between the back of the shoe
and the tensioner body, press the tensioner firmly against the chain and tighten
the bolts. You may need to put the wire in the hole to unseat the chack valve so
the shoe retracts to pinch the feeler gauge. The correct bolt torque is 18 ft lbs.



8. Rotate the engine with the kickstarter to make sure everything clears. Re-install the side cover and go for a ride.

Jim Comstock,

Is that an aluminum body oil pump? Everyone I've seen before has a dark, cast iron appearance.

JimC said:

Jim Comstock,

Is that an aluminum body oil pump? Everyone I've seen before has a dark, cast iron appearance.

Click to expand...

Jim,
It is aluminum. I built it many years ago. It has much closer tolerances than the original pump and therefore makes a lot more oil pressure. Jim

I bet this one doesn’t wet stump at all :?: :shock:

Bernhard said:

I bet this one doesn’t wet stump at all :?: :shock:

Click to expand...

Actually it does, it's just much slower than most but gravity always wins eventually. Jim

comnoz said:

JimC said:

Jim Comstock,

Is that an aluminum body oil pump? Everyone I've seen before has a dark, cast iron appearance.

Click to expand...

Jim,
It is aluminum. I built it many years ago. It has much closer tolerances than the original pump and therefore makes a lot more oil pressure. Jim

Click to expand...

What do you have the pressure relief valve set at? I assume the higher oil pressure is the pressure at lower rpms.

What do you have the pressure relief valve set at? I assume the higher oil pressure is the pressure at lower rpms.[/quote]

I see around 100 psi when the oil is cold and 40 to 50 at hot idle.

When I first installed the pump before removing some shims from the regulator I was seeing 150 psi cold. I actually ran it for several years that way until I ruptured an oil filter housing one day when I started it in 10 degree weather. Jim

I am sure that if a pump like that was available some of us would buy it Jim....

Better get back on that cloning tech I guess..... :roll:

SteveA said:

I am sure that if a pump like that was available some of us would buy it Jim....

Better get back on that cloning tech I guess..... :roll:

Click to expand...

I thought that Jim built that pump to help feed his oil fed cam.
The stock unit was not adequate.
Me thinks.
Thomas
CNN

Better gll:[/quote]

I thought that Jim built that pump to help feed his oil fed cam.
The stock unit was not adequate.
Me thinks.
Thomas
CNN[/quote]

That is what prompted me to build it. After I installed the feed line to the cam my low oil pressure went to no oil pressure.

Looking at the clearances in the original pump it is about as much an oil stirrer as it is a pump -so I made a nice tight one. Jim

Jim,
Your directions seem pretty clear but of course I have a couple of questions. Or more than a couple but I will try to control myself.

How much effect will different weights of oil have on function. Do you have a recommended weight for priming the unit?
Even if it doesn't need adjusted, I would think checking to make sure the unit isn't losing its prime might be called for. Same basic interval as checking the chain?
It is typical when strobing the timing on these bikes that the timing will jump around a little bit, particularly at lower RPM. I have pretty much accepted this as part of the chain driven cam system. (I might be wrong on this) Is it possible this unit will help stabilize that relationship with less chain lash?

As usual thanks for the lesson.

Russ

rvich said:

Jim,
Your directions seem pretty clear but of course I have a couple of questions. Or more than a couple but I will try to control myself.

How much effect will different weights of oil have on function. Do you have a recommended weight for priming the unit?
Even if it doesn't need adjusted, I would think checking to make sure the unit isn't losing its prime might be called for. Same basic interval as checking the chain?
It is typical when strobing the timing on these bikes that the timing will jump around a little bit, particularly at lower RPM. I have pretty much accepted this as part of the chain driven cam system. (I might be wrong on this) Is it possible this unit will help stabilize that relationship with less chain lash?

As usual thanks for the lesson.

Russ

Click to expand...

The oil weight will not have any effect. I primed mine with the same oil I use in the bike.

There should be no need to bleed the unit after the initial bleed. The reservoir hole is at the top and is fed by splash lube in the chaincase. When I inspected the unit in my bike after 1000 miles the tensioner was completely full of oil and the channel cut in the top of the unit to collect the oil was full.

It is common for the timing to jump around a bit when strobing them. It is mostly caused by the end of the camshaft jumping around a few thousanths in its bushing. The ignition rotor sticks out quite a ways from the bushing so play in the bushing is amplified. Of course excess play in the timing chain will cause more timing error but even with a well adjusted chain there will be some error.
When I installed the gear drive on my test bike with a Boyer the spark error was no different than it was with a well adjusted chain. [I was expecting an improvement]

On the new ignition system I have been working on I think I may end up triggering from the crankshaft instead of the cam. The timing stays dead nuts accurate that way. Starting is also easier due to the increased signal from the fast moving crank. Jim

comnoz said:

On the new ignition system I have been working on I think I may end up triggering from the crankshaft instead of the cam. The timing stays dead nuts accurate that way. Starting is also easier due to the increased signal from the fast moving crank. Jim

Click to expand...

This has my attention!

The old Sebring Ignition I have laying around mounts to and runs off the alternator rotor and stator. It works well.

rvich said:

comnoz said:

On the new ignition system I have been working on I think I may end up triggering from the crankshaft instead of the cam. The timing stays dead nuts accurate that way. Starting is also easier due to the increased signal from the fast moving crank. Jim

Click to expand...

This has my attention!

Click to expand...

Steve Maney has a set of hardware to run a Boyer on the crank end.....I am planning to run my ignition on the crank...not finally settled on ignition unit yet, but programmable unit from Ignitec is one option....

comnoz said:

Starting is also easier due to the increased signal from the fast moving crank. Jim

Click to expand...

A digital ignition is triggered or it is not.
A stronger signal won't trigger it any better ?

Or is the signal too weak/below threshold to trigger it sometimes ?
If that was a problem, they would have lowered the threshold in the design ?

Rohan said:

comnoz said:

Starting is also easier due to the increased signal from the fast moving crank. Jim

Click to expand...

A digital ignition is triggered or it is not.
A stronger signal won't trigger it any better ?

Or is the signal too weak/below threshold to trigger it sometimes ?
If that was a problem, they would have lowered the threshold in the design ?

Click to expand...

I will not use a digital pickup on a Norton. Too many bad experiences caused by the shake and bake syndrome and electronic parts.
I use VR sensors and a remote mounted zero crossing detector. Jim

Thanks. Just thought I'd ask....

Have you tried magnetic prox switches? But if you've got it figured out it won't matter.