Inside the timing chest of a 961

TonyA · May 3, 2023

Panetone said:
Ollie has designed a complete new tensioner.
Different material, dieferent design.
I have one in my bike for testing and his mileage bikes are on the road to test the parts.
When the material will work, Ollie will go on to design an automatic tensioner.

Hello Guys , I have ordered a TVS 961 cam chain tensioner blocks. I will post when I finally have them in hand. I also ordered a new TVS 961 cam chain at the same time.

TonyA · May 12, 2023

Here they are , TVS 961 Improved Cam Chain tensioner blocks :

Gojuu · May 13, 2023

TonyA said:
Here they are , TVS 961 Improved Cam Chain tensioner blocks :

Inserts to ensure they aren't overtightened.

Who'd have thought.

TonyA · May 14, 2023

Gojuu said:
Inserts to ensure they aren't overtightened.

Who'd have thought.

Now the bolts can be tightened to the specified torque and the polymer won't give in over time. This is just like Stu said but I wasn't sure if he knew Norton did it.

Stephen_Spencer · May 15, 2023

TonyA said:
Now the bolts can be tightened to the specified torque and the polymer won't give in over time. This is just like Stu said but I wasn't sure if he knew Norton did it.

Any difficulty getting the spares Tony? Any questions about legacy Norton purchase or parts compatibility?

TonyA · May 15, 2023

Stephen_Spencer said:
Any difficulty getting the spares Tony? Any questions about legacy Norton purchase or parts compatibility?

No problems or questions from them. It is essentially if the parts won’t hold up Commando production , they will sell you one. They always say these parts fit our current production commando.

Stephen_Spencer · May 15, 2023

TonyA said:
No problems or questions from them. It is essentially if the parts won’t hold up Commando production , they will sell you one. They always say these parts fit our current production commando.

Good news Tony. It will get more interesting when we get to a component/assembly that they have modified. Will we know and will they disclose. My guess is that they may disclose and leave the risk with the purchaser.

nopdog · May 16, 2023

Stephen_Spencer said:
Good news Tony. It will get more interesting when we get to a component/assembly that they have modified. Will we know and will they disclose. My guess is that they may disclose and leave the risk with the purchaser.

Stephen what would be wrong with that?
From a business perspective that was always going to be the case. From a 961 owner’s perspective it’s perfect.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Stephen_Spencer · May 16, 2023

nopdog said:
Stephen what would be wrong with that?
From a business perspective that was always going to be the case. From a 961 owner’s perspective it’s perfect.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Nothing wrong with that nopdog - it’s pretty much how most of us thought it would pan out. It has been discussed on the forum ad-nausium!

Not perfect though - perfect would have been full detailed disclosure of all modified components, so that legacy 961 owners could identify exactly what had changed and how - with supplementary information about whether it would fit to a legacy 961 or not. They had no responsibility to meet that workload of course, so it was never really expected,

This is good news - spares are moving and we’ll work the rest out ourselves, as we’ve always done. Assisted by Sir Stu, CG, Ollie and others of course.

jan nelder · Jul 22, 2023

I am looking at earlier pics to see what end of camshaft looks like: possible modification to add 850 Commando-type ignition drive, coming out to grafted on old points lump. Then we have somewhere to mount the Pazon 270 degree Ignition system!

City Garage · Jul 23, 2023

jan nelder said:
I am looking at earlier pics to see what end of camshaft looks like: possible modification to add 850 Commando-type ignition drive, coming out to grafted on old points lump. Then we have somewhere to mount the Pazon 270 degree Ignition system!

Why would you need to do this? The SCS ECU is capable of being programmed for any timing sequence.

TonyA · Jul 23, 2023

City Garage said:
Why would you need to do this? The SCS ECU is capable of being programmed for any timing sequence.

The SCS Delta 400 is completely programmable , including ignition advance/retard . If I just had access to a tuner that would help me ! I had to go the DynoJet PCV route because of this , And I would much rather have had the Delta 400 tuned and not need the damn DynoJet PCV at all !

BritTwit · Jul 23, 2023

Tony,
Any good tuner can dial in the Delta ecu on a dyno with SXTune software, no?

City Garage · Jul 23, 2023

BritTwit said:
Tony,
Any good tuner can dial in the Delta ecu on a dyno with SXTune software, no?

it's finding the guy. Most of them are not "tuners" they are just remapping with adjustment people

TonyA · Jul 23, 2023

BritTwit said:
Tony,
Any good tuner can dial in the Delta ecu on a dyno with SXTune software, no?

Yes , But where I used to live I couldn't find a dyno shop willing to try ! The best I could do was a shop willing to tune with the Dynojet PCV . What I am trying to say is that I could not find a local shop willing to do it. I have heard said that most shops like to work with what they know .

City Garage · Jul 23, 2023

TonyA said:
Yes , But where I used to live I couldn't find a dyno shop willing to try ! The best I could do was a shop willing to tune with the Dynojet PCV . What I am trying to say is that I could not find a local shop willing to do it. I have heard said that most shops like to work with what they know .

This is all true. Finding someone who will build a fuel curve table is tough. The issue is that it can take hours to perfect it and, even then, more hours to get everything right.

Panetone · Jul 24, 2023

City Garage said:
This is all true. Finding someone who will build a fuel curve table is tough. The issue is that it can take hours to perfect it and, even then, more hours to get everything right.

That´s right.
Ollie was with my bike many hours on his dyno to optimize the mapping, because pouring gasoline in with a wtering can is useless.
He has changed fuel tables, ignition tables, start and warm up tables, correction factors and many more.
The biggest problem is that every 961 needs an own mapfile, because the s...t bikes are all so different.
No matter if OMEX or SC.

Fredvincent · Jul 24, 2023

Panetone said:
That´s right.
Ollie was with my bike many hours on his dyno to optimize the mapping, because pouring gasoline in with a wtering can is useless.
He has changed fuel tables, ignition tables, start and warm up tables, correction factors and many more.
The biggest problem is that every 961 needs an own mapfile, because the s...t bikes are all so different.
No matter if OMEX or SC.

So Ollie can map the OMEX on Euro 4 bikes?

Panetone · Jul 24, 2023

Fredvincent said:
So Ollie can map the OMEX on Euro 4 bikes?

Yes

jan nelder · Jul 25, 2023

City Garage said:
Why would you need to do this? The SCS ECU is capable of being programmed for any timing sequence.

because I am wondering whether I can fit carbs, a Pazon, and get rid of the ECU altogether.

Inside the timing chest of a 961

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