Help ID year of ES2

mark99 · Dec 8, 2015

I recently bought an ES2
The former owner said it ‘might’ be a 1955, but he wasn’t sure
How can I tell what year it is?
I will set up a photo site so I can post some photos if need
The serial number is 71032

Thanks

Rohan · Dec 8, 2015

That number, in theory, makes it a 1957.

A few photos will confirm though.
Something that is 50 or more years old can often be a blend of bits, and years, depending on how rich a history it has.
And almost everything can be bolted on or unbolted at the whim of past owners.
Look forward to seeing it.

mark99 · Dec 8, 2015

Thanks, I will try and get photos tomorrow
When I search photos, it looks like the 57, not the 55 in that the oil tank is larger and has the 3 ribs

mark99 · Dec 9, 2015

a few photos:

I do have the primary and tool box cover

texasSlick · Dec 9, 2015

It looks like a good project! Not rough at all, with all major parts! Good luck with it.

Slick

Rohan · Dec 10, 2015

This page of a brochure appeared on fleabay, looks like you...

Armours in UK do replica mufflers and pipes.
Customers either love them or hate them though, depending on whether it fits or not,
if it doesn't fit its your fault !!

I'd be tempted to polish that up, change the pipe and muffler, repair any grazes and ride it.
(and paint that front fender black).
Replica fenders are available from India, but again they can be hit and miss. (?).
If you ride it while restoring it, its not going to spend years in the making.
Folks that have them say they are the best single that Nortons made, the swingarm frame is a good handler,
comfortable, and the engine is strong and torquey. And oil tight, with care....

mark99 · Dec 10, 2015

Thanks, I looked and don't see the brochure, could you give me a link or item number or something? or was it in the past
One thing I am wondering about is the tank, seems like photos of the 57' have knee pads
I have no idea of the mechanical condition of this and it is missing a few essentials
I do have another bike to ride so I am not too worried about that, a 75 Commando, and a few others 'close' to rideable
So on the fit of the exhaust, are you saying they do fit if placed correctly?
In searching I found a couple different places that make or have them, at least the header
And trying to confirm that the muffler is the same as an Atlas

texasSlick · Dec 10, 2015

mark99 said:
And trying to confirm that the muffler is the same as an Atlas

Atlas muffler:

Or, are you asking if original ES2 muffler was same as Atlas? You will have to ask Rohan, the Forum Historian, for that answer.

Slick

mark99 · Dec 10, 2015

Hi, Thanks
I was asking if this year, 1957, ES2 used and Atlas muffler, I do have a couple in a box for my 'in progress' N15CS

Nortoniggy · Dec 10, 2015

I think up to about 1959 the ES2 used a bigger size exhaust pipe of 1 3/4" than the twins used, so silencers were different. After that year they changed to a smaller pipe so they could use the same silencers on singles and twins.

Ian

Rohan · Dec 10, 2015

I think you will find that the singles used a larger diam exhaust pipe than the dommies etc,
so the muffler is listed in the parts book as a different number = not interchangeable.

As to whether your bike has the same style muffler as an Atlas, that is a good question.
Folks have cursed the Norton brochures for showing the non-muffler side of the bike only, so the style of muffler can't be seen.

My feeling is that if it has the AMC type gearbox, as yours has, then it has the cigar shaped muffler.
Nortons would have announced this somewhere, but I have not actually looked into it.
hth.

mark99 · Dec 10, 2015

Thanks for the info

On ebay I found a repo of poster that says 'for 57, 58 and 59'
So my first question is, are those years of ES2 the same (or almost)?

This poster shows the exhaust side and it looks Atlas like
But the oil tank is smaller than the one on my bike
On ebay there is also a repo of the full line brochure for 59 and the ES2 image is the same as the poster
I should mention the bike I bought is sort of a 'garage find', sort of untouched for 40 years, the last license plate tab on it is for 1970
So it makes me feel there is more chance of the parts that are still on it being original, not for sure of course

Rohan · Dec 10, 2015

mark99 said:
So it makes me feel there is more chance of the parts that are still on it being original,

Yup, anything that hasn't been replaced is original for sure :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

johnm · Dec 10, 2015

" On ebay I found a repo of poster that says 'for 57, 58 and 59'
So my first question is, are those years of ES2 the same (or almost)? "

When did it go to featherbed frame? (The bike in your photo does not have a featherbed frame)

Must have been very late?

Looks like a very nice bike. Very uncommon down in NZ.

mark99 · Dec 10, 2015

I actually don't know too much about it, trying to learn about it
The person I bought it from thought it might be a 55, Rohan says 57 based on the serial number
Photos I find of the 57 seem to fit better than 55
I bought some magazines on ebay with ES2 articles, so after I get and read those I might know a bit more

Rohan · Dec 11, 2015

johnm said:
When did it go to featherbed frame? (The bike in your photo does not have a featherbed frame)
Must have been very late?
Looks like a very nice bike. Very uncommon down in NZ.

The ES2 went featherbed for 1959.
They were still wideline for the 1961 model even.

ES2's didn't sell many once the featherbed twins came along, if you read the history books.
Folks who own these swingarm ES2's say they are the best singles Nortons made.
The widelines aren't as comfortable to sit on, and the featherbed handling at high speeds doesn't really come into it.
The slimline ES2s are fairly uncommon too, folks spent the little bit extra and bought the dommies.

Nortoniggy · Dec 11, 2015

This is my '55 ES2 which is pretty original looking. The mudguards are slightly wrong but pretty close to originals.

Yours should like the one in the brochure picture. After '55 there were quite a lot of changes, i.e. The AMC gearbox, the cylinder head to one that encloses the top of the push rod tubes, the oil tank, the toolbox and the seat. They also fitted the full width hub type wheels. The silencer probably changed too.

mark99 · Dec 11, 2015

I wrote to Andover looking for parts and they said:

"The build numbers for Nortons are:
1956 New Year frame number commenced with 666000
1957 commenced 713600
But the despatch/date books jump back and forth, so information to be used as a guideline only.
Looks as though your machine was built late 1956, and possibly first registered in 1957."

Mine does have full width hubs, not 100% sure if they came with the bike
Are there certain features that are different from 56 to 557?

Rohan · Dec 11, 2015

Be careful here, Andover have not given the full story with the year /model ?

In the british factory year, anything built after Sept was considered to be a next years model,
since the factory was generally converted over in the Aug holidays to build the next years model.
Wonder what 'late 1956' means in that context...

Roy Bacon has written a whole slew of books and booklets on Nortons, have to delve into them to see all the specific info.
Late 1956 got the AMC gearbox, and by then they were all full width alloy hubs.
I'd have said yours has to be a 1957 model, but it may only be the muffler style that sets them apart...
The bolt-on chrome tank panels were new for 1957 too ?

mark99 · Dec 11, 2015

I have one of the Roy books, chance of finding it, slim to 0
I just ordered a book on the singles