Commando Frame Paint?

I'm sanding a MK3 frame right now to repaint, and noticed something interesting. I've painted quite a few older Commando frames, and the paint job on this one is very different from them. I found the paint on the older frames (1971-1973, mostly) to be reasonably durable, with good film thickness and hardness, with high gloss, and with clean metal underneath. By contrast, the MK3 paint is thin, soft, sands easily, and has lots of rust spots underneath. It's original, and hasn't been repainted, so it must have come from the factory that way. I re-painted one other MK3 years ago, but don't recall whether it had similar poor quality. Does anyone know if there was a change in the factory process towards the end of Commando production? Were the frames that Norton sourced from outside (Italy, Reynolds) delivered bare or painted?

I was planning to just clean up the frame enough to re-paint with my usual Rustoleum gloss black, feather edging the chips and scratches, but not removing good paint. But with all the rust showing underneath, I think I'll have to strip it completely so I can remove the rust. Might be overkill, but sometimes I just can't help myself.

Has anyone tried POR-15 (base plus top coat) as a chassis paint?

Ken

Ken this belongs in MKThree special section as such an odd ball nothing much applies to real Commandos : )
Personally I'd just sand down the original slip shod paint leaving the low spots as body filler and rattle can and clear coat over. To get the patent leather sheen needs melted plastic coating or lots of rubbing compound then polish paste power buffing. Over the years the more striking frames for me to view were not black.

lcrken said:

I've had great luck with using plain old Rustoleum gloss black on frames. It takes a couple coats, with 15 minutes or so in between to avoid runs, and it does take 24 hours to cure, but it's really durable, and easy to touch up.

Ken

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Gloss black Rust-Oleum works great. I used to make the stuff but it takes FOREVER to cure.
If you can wait it out its good stuff.

hobot said:

Might want to check a few others frame still in factory finish if that's what ya trying to match. I think factory used Black Stove enamel.

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Earlier Nortons used stoved enamel on the frame, guards and all the fixtures and fittings.
But I've not seen it mentioned that Commandos used it.
I understood they were sprayed with some sort of enamel paint ?

850 frames don't look like they were stoved enamel.
No drip remnants either...

I shot all my frames with PPG DCC9300. Good hard paint, touches up nicely with Dupli-color Universal Black if you do manage to nick it.

I used the same paint on all the ancillaries, frame, swing arm, Chain guard (pre-commando bikes) battery tray, etc. Even holds up nicely on the cylinder barrel, for those years where it's black.

Ken, do you know a good stripper in the area? Paint stripper that is. Media blast or chemical dip.

BillT said:

I shot all my frames with PPG DCC9300. Good hard paint, touches up nicely with Dupli-color Universal Black if you do manage to nick it.

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What was the cost and minimum quantity you can buy of paint and reducer. Concept is really expensive here.
What primer did you use? I think that is going to be a touch too glossy, got any pics?

elefantrider said:

Ken, do you know a good stripper in the area? Paint stripper that is. Media blast or chemical dip.

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Not at the moment. I'm checking out the Ventura area this week. There used to be a really good place there that did everything from sand to soda blasting, and at a reasonable price, but I'll have to see if they are still in business. If I find someone good, I'll let you know. If that doesn't work out, it's sandpaper and muscle power. Nothing against doing that, but it's hard work for an old guy. I have a sandblaster, and I've done frames with it, but it leaves the surface a little rougher. With the extra sanding required to get a smoother finish, I'm not sure sandblasting really saves me much effort, and it is messy to do. And my soda blaster is not really large enough for something like a frame.

Ken

Motorcycles are messy to handle so suggest a poisonous solvent so mostly just scrap and wire brush off then finish by light sanding. Brake fluid acetone works pretty good but the methylcholide thick liquid from building supply works even better. Make it any color ya like long as black eh.

Any powder coating business can remove paint pretty easily. Ya might have to leave the impression that you'll be back for powder though...

Tested 3 more paints today.

1. Rustoleum Black Engine Enamel:
Looks the exact same as regular Rustoleum and too glossy to me.

2. VHT Black Engine Enamel
Looks good. A little less glossy than the above. Dries faster. Seems harder.
Looks better than the VHT Roll Bar paint.

3.Duplicolor Low Gloss Black Engine Enamel
Too flat..... and doesn't look good.

The Engine Enamels say they are resistant to gas and oil, but I have yet to test that.

I used Rustoleum regular (not eng enamel) gloss black on the frame in 2006. Still looks as good as a new Commando looked and hasn't chipped, cracked, been damaged by gas, etc. If you want a show finish, that's one thing but if you just want the bike to look like a new Norton did, rattle cans will do the job just fine on the frame.

If I can avoid stripping the entire frame, I will. That is why I am looking for a close match so I can try blending the worn down tubes and hoop with the original paint on the main tubes and head area. Painting the main tube and back brace with a can does not look like fun. VHT seems to dry faster than Rustoleum, so that might be easier to paint.

I will price Concept this week but with primer and reducer, I think I am looking at $150-200 in materials. Has been a while since I used my paint gun but I know it will go down a lot better than with a spray can. If I use the mixer paint, i'd be looking at a full professional strip.........so probably another $100-150???

I started stripping my MK3 did not find any rust spots. I then Soda blasted to save time, which I learnt from Youtube.

I have now had my frame Powdercoated Gloss Black with a Clear top coat, very pleased with the result.

I went this way rather than spraying because it was cheaper if you consider multiple layers of paint and sanding in between coats it is time consuming.
It also provided me with a durable heat resistant surface which rattle cans cannot give you.

If you check with Powdercoater on which day certain Colours are programmed in you can achieve a 1 Day turnaround.
The variety of colours and finishes will not disappoint.

Because they prefer to do large batches your frame can go in with the Gloss Black Pool Fencing for instance, my Powdercoater charged me a Slab/Box of Beer because I did not interrupt his schedule..
Take in the day before and pick up the next.

What you do have to consider is the Frames Earthing points being Paint free, this I did not do. Silly boy.

Which comes to reason this post got my attention.

Where are the Earthing Points?
I think I am right in believing there some?


Ian

When compared to buying expense paints like PPG Concept, powder coating is the cheapest way.

20 years ago I dropped off every black metal part except the frame and center stand at a powdercoater and he did them for $125. I could not hand him the money fast enough.

Ive found Rustoleum to tend to peel off. Used the old red primer which may
have been a mistake.

Based on my tests this week, I am not a fan of Rustoleum. Dries slow and chips easy. VHT Engine or Roll Bar paint was better in both these areas.

elefantrider said:

Based on my tests this week, I am not a fan of Rustoleum. Dries slow and chips easy. VHT Engine or Roll Bar paint was better in both these areas.

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Well, based on my "test" of Rustoleum actually being on my Norton frame for nearly 9 years and not yet needing a touchup or respray…I can't agree.

Frankly, just about any paint will do well with good prep work. Whether you like a particular color/gloss level of a particular paint is a different issue. But I think what happens commonly with rattle can painting is that folks don't do the prep work that they would do with spray-gun application so naturally the finish cannot hope to be as durable.

I'm sure powder coating can be good, but it seems to be very dependant on the guy pulling the trigger.

Every powder coating I have ever had done has been WAY too thick. To the point where dimensional integrity is lost.

which is just a posh way of saying that stuff didn't fit!

I have never liked powder coating for anything but lawn furniture! Its way too much hassle re bolts/fittings, electrical connections via the frame, etc.