Chinese Norton 650s?

'The biggest thing to my mind with our 650 twin will be throttle response. I want a bike that’s really light and really small, that can ride around the outside of everything on a track day and then clear off down the straights as well. We need something that operates really well on the edge of the tire and with a small throttle input, and we’ve worked so hard on our TT race bike to get that control that we’re looking forward to feeding this development back into the new 1200 V4 and 650 twin customer projects as well.”

If it is really light and handles well, why would you ride it around the outside in corners, rather than make it turn quicker and more upright, so you can get on the gas earlier ?
 
Well Garner is not a racer first of all, so he wouldn’t be aware of proper race tactics/techniques.
He was just implying that the bike will be so maneuverable and quick that it will just simply be able to go around anything slower that is in its way.
If he really still intends to build a supercharged 650 twin this could be worth waiting for; Lightweight, maneuverable, over 100 HP, hopefully a better EFI system that the 961 has, attractive styling…..
God only knows what the price tag would be for such a Norton.
He’s piqued my interest though.
 
Im pretty sure that entire concept as well as current styling of the Norton 961 came from the mind of an American Farrier/ backyard mechanic , so is it British or American?
Does it matter?

Glen
 
worntorn said:
Im pretty sure that entire concept as well as current styling of the Norton 961 came from the mind of an American Farrier/ backyard mechanic , so is it British or American?
Does it matter?

Glen
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For others who are not members of forums like this one, probably not.
 
I just read on MotorcycleDaily.com that "Yesterday Triumph Motorcycles UK and Bajaj Auto India announced a "global partnership" to develop "mid-capacity" motorcycles drawing on the strengths of both entities." Gotta face it, "the good ol' days are dead and gone" (John Hartford).
Charlie
 
I don't care about the American influence in the 961 Norton. The best engineered motorcycle I ever owned was a WD Indian Scout. It was actually very good, even if it did nothing. And the metallurgy was not to be sneezed at. I think many of the early Fords also had decent alloy steel components. I think a close look at the Chinese stuff might find them lacking in that department. I cannot see them putting the intellectual effort into getting the detail right.
 
cehenard said:
I just read on MotorcycleDaily.com that "Yesterday Triumph Motorcycles UK and Bajaj Auto India announced a "global partnership" to develop "mid-capacity" motorcycles drawing on the strengths of both entities." Gotta face it, "the good ol' days are dead and gone" (John Hartford).
Charlie
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What amazes me is that nobody has tried building an Aermacchi-type road racer with the 125cc Chinese pit bike motors. The amount of hot-up bits you can get for them is astounding. Takegawa even supply DOHC 4-valve heads for them and 6 speed gear-boxes. In the old days an MV Bialbero 125 was a pretty slick bike.
 
acotrel said:
What amazes me is that nobody has tried building an Aermacchi-type road racer with the 125cc Chinese pit bike motors. The amount of hot-up bits you can get for them is astounding. Takegawa even supply DOHC 4-valve heads for them and 6 speed gear-boxes. In the old days an MV Bialbero 125 was a pretty slick bike.
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"To see the need, is to hear the call"
 
texasSlick said:
Bernhard said:
"The engine is designed to be cheap and mass-produced, with use only in the Asian region or perhaps South America… This engine and bike are not coming to Europe.”

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2017 ... db3d709c57
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Sounds to me like one of the 3 classic lies ..... the check is in the mail, the dog ate my homework, and there is nothing to worry about, I've had a vasectomy.

Slick
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The 650 engine design appears to be thoroughly modern, with unremarkable looking, DOHC, watercooled, twin like the BMW F800.
Let's hope the new bike's chassis and body work produce a more inspired presence.

Chinese Norton 650s?
Hosted on Fotki

Chinese Norton 650s?
Hosted on Fotki
 
Comparing the two motors, the Norton head (from head gasket joint upwards) is significantly less tall and bulky compared to the BMW. Wonder why this is?
 
Anyone else notice that the red backdrop to the signing had the old style Norton logo, not the new trade marked version. :roll:
 
Fast Eddie said:
Comparing the two motors, the Norton head (from head gasket joint upwards) is significantly less tall and bulky compared to the BMW. Wonder why this is?
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May have something to do with the engine frame mounts.
The mounts for the F800 are on the sides of the head.
The Norton engine has the mounts built into the cylinder block below the head.
The Beemer head probably requires stronger structure in the head to provide a stout mounting point for the frame.
 
The ISO9000 definition of QUALITY is 'fit for purpose', - that covers a lot of crap - Both the older mini and a Roller are quality products. 'Attention to detail' is the factor which is missing in the definition. When I was young a lot of the kids bought Commandos. Some of us thought they did that because their fathers said 'Nortons are good bikes'. A lot has to do with racing heritage and development. If the Chinese engine is a copy, the question should possibly be - 'where did the BMW engine come from and how was it developed ? '
 
Modern engine designs have a lot to do with their integration as stressed members of a composite superstructure. If a chassis is designed with it's own structural integrity, or mostly it's own, the engine need not be so massive as to perform structural duties.

Personally, I prefer the chassis not to be dependent, or AS dependent on the engine for rigidity, This frees the engine from potential mechanical impairment at the far reaches of it's structural envelope.
 
acotrel said:
'where did the BMW engine come from and how was it developed ? '
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That was a discussion for heated debate when the forerunner of the F800, the BMW F650 was first introduced.
The engine looked a lot like a Rotax 650 unit.
BMW claimed it was a BMW design that was simply manufactured for them by Rotax.
However, the design and tech of the motor looked very Rotax-ian.
 
BritTwit said:
BMW claimed it was a BMW design that was simply manufactured for them by Rotax.
However, the design and tech of the motor looked very Rotax-ian.
Click to expand...
Original modern Triumph modular triples and fours were based on Kawasaki designs.

Apparently, anything is anything you want it to be.
 
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