Camshaft sprocket nut won't budge!

Thanks to everyone for your kind words, took a risque and it worked. Now on to splitting the cases.Cheers :wink:

And there we have it! The pounding with the manual impact driver was not a good idea and resulted in creating a slight distortion to the edge of the scrolling. It dragged a bit on the bush so I took a piece of 1000 grit and some oil and rubbed it out, spins freely now.The camshaft looks quite nice. PHEW

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WHAT is that HORRIBLKE Black Stuff in the Bottom of the Cases . :shock:
o.k. its been sitting for two decades .
Shows the sensability of dismantling and cleaning .
Wonder how long it wouldve gone ' as was ' and WHAT the INSIDES would be like had it had done so . Likely scoured out the works , if not a Big Bang .

Nice Going . Timing Chain SCRAP ? ?

Matt Spencer said:

WHAT is that HORRIBLKE Black Stuff in the Bottom of the Cases . :shock:
o.k. its been sitting for two decades .
Shows the sensability of dismantling and cleaning .
Wonder how long it wouldve gone ' as was ' and WHAT the INSIDES would be like had it had done so . Likely scoured out the works , if not a Big Bang .

Nice Going . Timing Chain SCRAP ? ?

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Yes the timing chain and tensioner are both well worn. Just a bit of sludge, less than I expected. Cheers, Dennis

I would have used a rattle wrench.

Enjoying someone else 's nasty Norton tasks while comfy in my chair. One little note of caution, magic marker on plastic bag, such as which side of head parts came from R or L, can easy smudge off, so paper label inside or masking tape keep it readable after some grimy mechanic handling. On other forums it was a motto to always clean the sludge trap, but I see that Nortons can't really collect much to affect balance factor nor clog the large oil holes so I'd skip that delaying part and risk of not getting the fasteners to stay as tightly fixed as it is now. Dynamic balancing is worth while but crank don't need opening for that.

Why would you go to time trouble an expense of rebuilding an engine that you have stripped completely to put the crank back in with sludge and god knows what inside the trap???? Especially if you don't know the history (a new project you restoring).
Sooner or later the sludge trap will need to be emptied or it will fill an restrict supply or let stuff through its intended to trap. So clean it while you have the chance.

Thanks for asking for my critical reasoning on Commando sludge trap. I too was pressured - fooled by the often repeated motto on NOC-UK and Brit Iron lists "Clean the Sludge Trap". But I'm not a newbie no more and realize that advice simply doesn't apply in Commando but is vital advice on lesser brands like Triumphs which can collect enough to clog up and throw off BF. Cdo sludge traps can only build up to a 1/16"-1/8" layer by the sling force outward but after that sludge particles just get carried along and out the safely over-sized journal holes so no chance of clogging nor throwing BF off detectably. I've opened 4 cranks so far, two well used virgin ones and then both of those 1000 to 8000 later d/t some other non crank related reason, to find almost as much sludge as decades of both un-filtered and filtered use. I did run into the down side of disturbing the factory fasteners well retained by lock tabs and even staking to later find their torque had backed off - even with red lockite and breaking jaw off end wrench hi torque. In Ms Peel I assumed the 11,000+ rpm event shook em loose but in plain Jane Trixie Combat I rarely reached redline in lower gears and only rod bolt let go made me take a second look. I'd read stories of those fitting oil filters and regular Mobil One oil changes not finding any sludge yet I found almost as much in Peel with oil filter and over freq. oil changes of 1000 miles or so [before I learned better] and same with Trixie after few 100 miles rod bolt blow up at coasting minimal throttle level road 50 mph loads. So yes unthinking assumption is we should all take apart everything every year or less on our engines but I now know its more risky in crank and nothing to gain as will soon fill up again as oil filers can only filter passage clogging particals but not hardly any of the size that makes friction and sludge deposits in oil tank, cases or crank. So your call to to get that deep experience but don't fool yourself you've done a good thing that matters a whitworth and highly suggest another look in a year or so later to see if hobot is full of it or not like your crank will be, then report to list so one of us can eat their sludge hat in public. I'm thinking to tack weld next crank fasteners and had Peel completely welded cheeks to crank but did leave access ports to plug in journal ends but doubt I'll ever touch em.

OTOH I've seen them so full of metal paste that it had to be drilled out of there. This was a '71 running like there was nothing wrong at all with it. Get a new set of bolts and have a look see anyway.

OTOH I've seen them so full of metal paste that it had to be drilled out of there.

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Batrider please clarify what you meant to convey here. So Full implies trap clogged up to block flow to rods and throw BF off. All the sludge I've seen in there was quite stable & immune to any solvent, so only scrapping could remove it, so stable in fact that I realized there was no risk it'd break loose to bother anything. To me just finding the tough metal paste layer inside is now a non issue. I've analyzed it to find 90% was metal dust 60% magnetic/40% non magnetic with some 10% polymerized-cooked hydrocarbon glue.

I would like to know if anyone reporting the vital need to clean sludge trap has been back in to see the results of such extra attention and what they found on fasteners retaining clamp force. I've got to reseal Trixie engine soon but will leave crank alone this time w/o a worry there.

My 850 crank needed a regrind after something damaged the RH big end (along time ago) taking the white metal off shells and scouring crank. But sludge trap did its job of catching any dangerous size particles as RH side was perfect. As the flywheel must be removed to do the job properly then I had no choice but to split it. I would not suggest you take a good engine apart just to clean it but if its apart then clean it if you don't want to split crank then force solvent an compressed air through it.
I must admit I didn't do my own crank but sent it to Mick Hemmings as he knows what he's doing an like you Hobot I didn't like the idea of what happens if it comes undone.

Good looking avitar ther NORBECER.
Now is that Clint Eastwood trying to look like Jim Carrey, Jim Carrey tying to look like Jack Nicholson or Jack Nicholson trying to look like Clint Eastwood?

pete.v said:

Good looking avitar ther NORBECER.
Now is that Clint Eastwood trying to look like Jim Carrey, Jim Carrey tying to look like Jack Nicholson or Jack Nicholson trying to look like Clint Eastwood?

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Just a 57 year old grandfather with his prescription shades. The bikes keep me young at heart!

Thanks everyone for the discussion on the possible effects of sludge build up. Was planning to leave the crank and conrods well enough alone since the sludge in the case has 22,000 miles and I found it to be minimal, the conrods move freely on the big ends with no play. The crank case was split before with the evidence of two different bearings, one FAG NU306E ( the face of the housing on this one was a bit pitted) and the other simply marked HD with faded numbers NU306E . The pistons are +20 so at what mileage the work was done , your guess is as good as mine.
Cheers, Dennis

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Now is that Clint Eastwood trying to look like Jim Carrey, Jim Carrey tying to look like Jack Nicholson or Jack Nicholson trying to look like Clint Eastwood?

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yeah but is it the sheet eating grin or the eyes that give us that impression.