Best shell bearings (2020)

the King bearings RGM supply are traceable to the original manufacture as the shells are marked with the King branding
the shells others supply white box ( maker unknown ) look at the packaging photos above inner packet clearly states made in UK outer packing made in USA
THIS SHOULD RING ALARM BELLS origin unknown the comment if the re seller does not licence the TM they cannot sell under the makers brand does not wash
all the independent auto parts supplier sell automotive shells using the manufacturers brands they have no licence rights to the manufacturers TM the basic concept of establishing a brand is brand recognition
Vandervell / Glyco / King all market and promote their own brand King bearings are making massive gains in the tuner / hot rod markets by marketing the product under the king brand
the king race spec shells are the go to choice for many high end Euro / jap performance car engine builders as the quality and brand are proven winners

material specs of the white box shells are unknown as is the source no confirmed brand name or material spec is provided by the seller / manufacturer
white box made in the UK or made in the USA ???? packaging says it all the old smoke and mirrors to cover the trail back to an unknown source of supply

i have no issues with products made in Asia some are excellent , manufacturers have access to modern state of the art CNC production facilities
but as is often the case non branded Asia made product is miss sold as made in England OR IN THIS CASE made in both the UK and the USA
confused i am

Frankie17 said:

the comment if the re seller does not licence the TM they cannot sell under the makers brand does not wash

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Sorry but this was company policy for all the OEM companies I dealt with, when another aftermarket company other than our aftermarket wanted to buy product for resale then they could not use the OEM trademark as our own aftermarket outlet had sole rights. So Velocette, AN could buy shells but could not use a OEM trademark, AE could as they were also owned by T&N but Ford could not (not that they would want to).

kommando said:

Sorry but this was company policy for all the OEM companies I dealt with, when another aftermarket company other than our aftermarket wanted to buy product for resale then they could not use the OEM trademark as our own aftermarket outlet had sole rights. So Velocette, AN could buy shells but could not use a OEM trademark, AE could as they were also owned by T&N but Ford could not (not that they would want to).

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Vey strange and antiquated no wonder UK manufacturing is suffering if it were my business and we had serious demand for product not in my current catalogue portfolio but i had capacity to produce
simple channel new business / enquiry`s sales through my own aftermarket division and there would be no issues with branding TM / origin any trade / retail enquiry would then be directed to the customer who had initiated production and was holding the physical stock which is a win win for any manufacturer new business and own branded product in the market

based on the fact these white box shells are sold as made in the UK and made in the USA on the same packaging some one is covering tracks to the source

Frankie17 said:

Vey strange and antiquated no wonder UK manufacturing is suffering

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No, same policy under USA twice, GB and German ownership. You have your own aftermarket brand and if another aftermarket outfit wants to buy they cannot use your own brand.

RGM clearly says they supply Kings.
AN clearly show they sell FAG roller bearings, as do RGM.
But their white box shell bearings are still somewhat of a mystery.

Nortons are not hard on bearings so I don't think strength matters much.
Fitment, consistency and tracability are more important. Hence the brand thus the reputation is quite important when it comes to bearings, IMHO.

BTW, I've seen 50 year old factory original bearings in a 14K mile 750 motor I've torn down to appear as new!
I also find it hard to believe that 50 year old bearings could be better than today's manufacture with modern processes.

PS. I've purchased a lot of shells for car engines from Summit and other sources, and none came in a white box here.

wow that is a backwards approach , the motorcycle shell sets would not be considered a main stream product by current standards a piss in the ocean in terms of real numbers
Company policy very questionable selling to aftermarket competition ? niche product through your own aftermarket sales division would ensure premium margins and most likely payment up front
if i were a potential Vandervell customer making a commitment to purchase production quantity i would insist on a recognised branded product is supplied
otherwise a no brainer go to China and pay considerably less for a white box unbranded set and choose to up sell as made in UK or USA or whatever you can get away with ?

lets put it this way would you walk in to a Rolls Royce showroom pay your money for a brand new highly polished motor and come out with a de badged version painted in dull white

Mahle have no interest in the Vandervell, Glacier or Clevite trademarks, they believe Mahle alone is enough in the aftermarket which makes it even worse as they do not even want anyone else using them so they are sitting in their trademark bank unused.

Frankie17 said:

the King bearings RGM supply are traceable to the original manufacture as the shells are marked with the King branding
the shells others supply white box ( maker unknown ) look at the packaging photos above inner packet clearly states made in UK outer packing made in USA
THIS SHOULD RING ALARM BELLS origin unknown the comment if the re seller does not licence the TM they cannot sell under the makers brand does not wash
all the independent auto parts supplier sell automotive shells using the manufacturers brands they have no licence rights to the manufacturers TM the basic concept of establishing a brand is brand recognition
Vandervell / Glyco / King all market and promote their own brand King bearings are making massive gains in the tuner / hot rod markets by marketing the product under the king brand
the king race spec shells are the go to choice for many high end Euro / jap performance car engine builders as the quality and brand are proven winners

material specs of the white box shells are unknown as is the source no confirmed brand name or material spec is provided by the seller / manufacturer
white box made in the UK or made in the USA ???? packaging says it all the old smoke and mirrors to cover the trail back to an unknown source of supply

i have no issues with products made in Asia some are excellent , manufacturers have access to modern state of the art CNC production facilities
but as is often the case non branded Asia made product is miss sold as made in England OR IN THIS CASE made in both the UK and the USA
confused i am

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Amen.
All except for the CNC part. Having a CNC machine tool DOES NOT guarantee anything other than the ability to make a LOT of parts (good or junk) fast. It needs a team of experienced, talented and motivated craftsmen to make consistent good parts.
I repair CNC machine tools, some of which are Taiwanese. Not even REMOTELY in the same quality league as Japanese, German, Italian, UK, US made stuff.
The chasm between customer expectations & actual quality is VAST!

elefantrider said:

RGM clearly says they supply Kings.
AN clearly show they sell FAG roller bearings, as do RGM.
But their white box shell bearings are still somewhat of a mystery.

Nortons are not hard on bearings so I don't think strength matters much.
Fitment, consistency and tracability are more important. Hence the brand thus the reputation is quite important when it comes to bearings, IMHO.

BTW, I've seen 50 year old factory original bearings in a 14K mile 750 motor I've torn down to appear as new!
I also find it hard to believe that 50 year old bearings could be better than today's manufacture with modern processes.

PS. I've purchased a lot of shells for car engines from Summit and other sources, and none came in a white box here.

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Perhaps @ZFD could comment on the lineage of the rod bearings being supplied? We are interested to know.

or maybe @Madnorton would be able to more quickly confirm brand and country of origin.

To put this topic to rest.

What would I use - I'd have no issue using any shells on the market no matter what country they are being sold in or were made in.
Shells these days are a compromise, but thankfully our old bikes are exempt. End of life now dictates that no lead is to be left in the vehicle, herein lies the issue, shells in a new car are not as good as they could be but so designed to still last the life of the engine. Those making shells for performance motors can use what they like, as they are exempt.
As for life of the shells, remember, the shell is only half the story, the journal is the other half. Some of the top end shells need the journal to be surfaced finished correctly to get the best life from the shell.

Not quite the answer I was hoping for but thanks for responding.

concours said:

View attachment 85449

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I chatted with Tom H. son of John Healey, he said the bearing are Mahle / Clevite made in Iowa. They are put in the white box by Mahle and have their UPC #/ bar code on the white box. The sticker that Coventry puts on the plastic bag says UK made, but they haven't changed it to USA from UK as they used to get the rod bearings from the UK.
Apparently, all white boxes do not mean the same as far as quality goes. You can contact Mahle direct with questions about their products or look at You tube videos for info

Carl H said:

I chatted with Tom H. son of John Healey, he said the bearing are Mahle / Clevite made in Iowa. They are put in the white box by Mahle and have their UPC #/ bar code on the white box. The sticker that Coventry puts on the plastic bag says UK made, but they haven't changed it to USA from UK as they used to get the rod bearings from the UK.
Apparently, all white boxes do not mean the same as far as quality goes. You can contact Mahle direct with questions about their products or look at You tube videos for info

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Exactly why I would not be worried about what ones I would use from various retailers.

Madnorton said:

Exactly why I would not be worried about what ones I would use from various retailers.

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I will repeat my warning, there are batches of Wassell sourced Hepolite branded shells out there with a 1 thou undersize wall thickness. If you buy these then do not get your crank ground to Workshop manual size but supply the rods, shells and bolts torqued to spec to your grinder and get them to grind to measured shell ID plus clearance. Which batches and which engines this affects I cannot be sure of but it is at least on the Triumph 650/750.

Hepolite bearing shells scare me after 2 sets with too much clearance.
I don’t know what I’ll use yet, but Hepolite is very last choice.

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Didn't even know wassel were doing them for Nortons, if they are then they have truly cocked up as it has to be nigh on impossible to make a shell bearing wrong. The manufacturer must have been given the wrong dimensions by wassel.
Considering most bearings for Norton on the market are by Mahle or King, I would happily use either.

Madnorton you are correct Wassell do not make Hepolite commando shells

Kommando is warning you about batches of triumph shells which allegedly do not fit according to TR7 mans post

Frankie17 said:

Madnorton you are correct Wassell do not make Hepolite commando shells

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Not currently but they are expanding the range so at some point they may offer them.

I doubt it, the UK is flooded with cheap shell bearings at the moment, as is the USA. And, yes I know how much they are to manufacture now, and the batch sizes involved and they are not small numbers.
Why Wassel jumped in with Triumph bearings is interesting, there are a lot of Clevite made bearings kicking about for the Triumphs.

I have decided to join this existing thread rather than starting a fresh one that was so similar . I soon will be working on cranks and rods for Norton big twin roadrace engines. Some of these engines will have Nourish billet cranks and a couple will have modified stock cranks. Some journals will still be basically standard while some may have to be ground as much as -.020” and loose some hardness. There will also be a mixture of connecting rods. All that said, decisions will have to be made regarding hard bearing, soft bearing . That is where real insight and experience would be appreciated.

What rod bearings available now are aluminum backed and which are steel backed ? Of the bearings available now, are there any that are no-goes based on quality control or durability ? Has anyone actually compared the surface area to determine the hardness ?

The sharing of past battle experience is appreciated here. If the thread takes a wild turn, I will likely move it a fresh thread title. Thanks Motorheads and Thread Posters.