19 Vs 18 Wheels (2015)

kommando · Mar 20, 2020

Polished aluminium rims will corrode unless protected with wax followed by regular repolishing and waxing, anodised aluminium rims do not corrode but will never be a bright finish.

gortnipper · Mar 20, 2020

I have Excel WM3 rims which are within the tolerances for my tires.

I also have a comnoz headseady and NYN kegler clamps.

On a budget I would do those two and stick to stock rims for bang for buck.

Replacing worn ISOs cant be underestimated.

Lansdowne dampers also make a huge difference.

WM4s arent a silver bullet.

Bernhard · Mar 20, 2020

Fullauto said:
Try it. You will become a believer. Tell me how not using a rim width suitable for the tyre is not a good thing>

+1.
Follow the tyre company's recommendations, they know when the fitment of a tyre onto the wrong rim will distort the tyre out of profile.

Fullauto · Mar 20, 2020

gortnipper said:
I have Excel WM3 rims which are within the tolerances for my tires.

I also have a comnoz headseady and NYN kegler clamps.

On a budget I would do those two and stick to stock rims for bang for buck.

Replacing ISOs cant be underestimated.

Lansdowne dampers also make a huge difference.

WM4s arent a silver bullet.

I beg to differ. I too have one of Jim's headsteadies which has been trouble free for 60,000 miles, which is more than I can say for the opposition's offerings. I too have the Landsdowne conversion as well as IKON rear shocks all well proven over many miles. All have been done at different times and all have contributed to the overall effect. However, the greatest single thing that contributed most was the addition of 2.5 inch x 19 rims. I can't believe how fitting the recommended rims for the tyres can be met by such resistance from those who haven't tried it. Why don't one of the disbelievers contact Avon and actually ask them what they think?

gortnipper · Mar 20, 2020

I have Excel WM3 rims which are within the recommendations for my tires.

I also have IKONs.

Your WM4 soapbox is duly noted.

gortnipper · Mar 20, 2020

Oh, I also have one of your CNC heads. Awesome piece of work that formed the foundation of my engine rebuild.

But it does not stand alone...

Fullauto · Mar 20, 2020

Fast Eddie · Mar 20, 2020

I am also a fan of ‘correct’ sized rims. However, I did mine at the same time as a host of other jobs so cannot make any claims about their specific contribution to the handling.

I do believe that Lansdowne dampers have their limitations though, in hot weather and track use their performance dropped off a cliff. I believe their design caused the fork oil to overheat and breakdown, but that is only a hypothesis. Whatever the cause, they just stopped damping.

Good quality shock absorbers will transform handling. Or perhaps another way of looking at it is that poor quality shocks will destroy what would otherwise have been good handling!

My answer to having to polish alloy rims is don’t. I used Scotchbrite and went for the ‘brushed alloy look’...

cliffa · Mar 20, 2020

MichaelB said:
That is a very Cool and Noble gesture Sir.
Please keep us in the loop and show the final bike.
Looking forward to this.

+1 on that, very noble. Please keep the updates & pics coming !

Cheers,

cliffa.

cliffa · Mar 20, 2020

Fast Eddie said:
I do believe that Lansdowne dampers have their limitations though, in hot weather and track use their performance dropped off a cliff.

My answer to having to polish alloy rims is don’t. I used Scotchbrite and went for the ‘brushed alloy look’...

Good job you managed to flog them to some mug, who being called Cliff, fitted the bill exactly

But seriously, for normal road use the Lansdownes are still a BIG improvement over standard.

I used to have rims just like that on my Mshed

Fast Eddie · Mar 20, 2020

Didn’t I put that in the advert ?!

Seriously though, I only had issue on very hot days (by UK standards) and on the track. I never experienced any such issues on the road.

And thinking about it a bit more, lots of racers do use them. Maybe it was my choice of oil that was at fault?

cliffa · Mar 20, 2020

tricatcent said:
I have WM3 18 on the rear and WM2-18 on the front. I have RD 400 aluminum cast wheels. Someone gave me those wheels and I didn't realize the front was 18 until I tried to put a 19 tire on it! I use Avon tires, 120/80 18 rear, 90/90 18 front, the bike handles great by any standard. I think the 19 front might have given a bit more ground clearance though. That might give you an idea about how good the handling is. I am planning on eventually raising the front of the bike a bit with the longer internal tubes and extra springs.

Have you, or could you post some pictures of your bike please? I'd like to see what RD400 wheels look like on a Commando.

Cheers,

cliffa.

cliffa · Mar 20, 2020

Fast Eddie said:
Didn’t I put that in the advert ?!

Seriously though, I only had issue on very hot days (by UK standards) and on the track. I never experienced any such issues on the road.

And thinking about it a bit more, lots of racers do use them. Maybe it was my choice of oil that was at fault?

"Didn’t I put that in the advert" Yes, you were 100% honest about them.

By the way, did you Scotchbrite the rims before they were mounted? I really like that look as well, but it's difficult to get close to the nipples without leaving a mark on them too.

Cheers,

cliffa.

acotrel · Mar 20, 2020

Fast Eddie said:
Didn’t I put that in the advert ?!

Seriously though, I only had issue on very hot days (by UK standards) and on the track. I never experienced any such issues on the road.

And thinking about it a bit more, lots of racers do use them. Maybe it was my choice of oil that was at fault?

When you race in hot weather, the track temperature affects the amount of heat in your tyres. The air temperature also affects the way your motor performs. Very cold mornings are much better than hot days.

Fast Eddie · Mar 20, 2020

cliffa said:
did you Scotchbrite the rims before they were mounted? I really like that look as well, but it's difficult to get close to the nipples without leaving a mark on them too.

In situ. It was one of those jobs that was much worse when thinking about it than actually doing it.

I used WD 40 and Scotchbrite pads cut up into rectangles, it was quite straightforward. Made almost enjoyable with the CD player going and a few beers on hand...!

If I’d had the brains to think about it before having the wheels built, I’d have gone for anodised I reckon.

cliffa · Mar 20, 2020

Fast Eddie said:
In situ. It was one of those jobs that was much worse when thinking about it than actually doing it.

I used WD 40 and Scotchbrite pads cut up into rectangles, it was quite straightforward. Made almost enjoyable with the CD player going and a few beers on hand...!

It's funny you should say that. As I get older I think much more about the stuff I want to do. Is it right? will i screw it up? what will other people think etc? When I was younger I'd just steam in ( and admittedly often f#ck it up) but I had no second thoughts.

mwedd · Mar 20, 2020

Fullauto said:
Don't worry about the dirt, I wash it every nine months whether it needs it or not.

Thank you for the pics! I would rather ride on those than pizza cutters any day!

gortnipper said:
WM3...WM4...18"...19'... there are a whole bunch of other things that will make a bigger difference to your handling than these rim sizes with the same tires.

When I first bought my V-Max, all I wanted to do was hp mods but my V-Max riding buddies told me the best mod I could ever do was ditch the bias-ply for radials.. I didn't believe them and did all my hp mods and about busted my ass a couple times before finally putting radials on. It was the best thing I ever did to that bike, I'm no racer but you'll rarely see chicken strips on the sides of my tires.

Craig · Mar 20, 2020

4 years past I got Don Pender (Madass) to lace up my hubs to a set of his original stock size alloy rims with SS spokes etc. , proved to be the finishing touch for me anyway , even with the Dunlop TT's the bike handles better than ever , this after new (Norvil) vernier style iso's ,new black chrome Hagon shocks, original JRB front fork damper upgrade and a D.Taylor head-steady .... I tend to procrastinate on getting the Norton out , when I do, I almost always end up having to stop for gas or return home for a re-fill with my special blend .... each upgrade could feel improvement the new wheels with tires were the most noticeable other than getting spring tension correct on the head-steady ... the Norton lives in heated shed , I polish rims every fall after last ride , that's it for rim up keep , so far so good ...

acotrel · Mar 22, 2020

Fullauto said:
I beg to differ. I too have one of Jim's headsteadies which has been trouble free for 60,000 miles, which is more than I can say for the opposition's offerings. I too have the Landsdowne conversion as well as IKON rear shocks all well proven over many miles. All have been done at different times and all have contributed to the overall effect. However, the greatest single thing that contributed most was the addition of 2.5 inch x 19 rims. I can't believe how fitting the recommended rims for the tyres can be met by such resistance from those who haven't tried it. Why don't one of the disbelievers contact Avon and actually ask them what they think?

Many people look at modern bikes and probably believe that what is on them must be better. A Triton with a Manx frame and 19 inch skinny tyres usually handles much better than the same bike with slightly fatter tyres and better rubber. Some bikes can be ridden faster with 19 inch wheels than with 18 inch. Some of the difference is about angle of lean and ground clearance, another factor is the different trail. A fat tyre on the back forces the alignment of the wheels to be disadvantageous when the bike is turning. If you line a pair of 19 inch wheels up with a string line, when the bike is leaning over in a corner, the sides of the tyres are in line. With a fat tyre, they are not and you will feel it, even if not consciously.
I loop the string around the back of the rear tyre and the front of the front tyre then space it out with a couple of matchboxes placed on the rim at the back of the rear tyre. Turn the front wheel straight, then align the back wheel. When I adjust the rear chain, I usually count the number of turns on the adjusters to keep the wheel in alignment. However on my Seeley, the threads on the two adjusters are different.

acotrel · Mar 22, 2020

With a road bike, the circumstances in which you are riding are always changing. When you race, you repeat the same circumstances many times, so you notice differences in handling much more. If you took your road bike onto a tight race circuit and sorted the handling, it would probably be much better on public roads. Except it might change line a bit too easily.