Tubeless conversion on new Commando 961

lfoggy

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Sep 10, 2023
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Took delivery of a new 2024 Commando 961 CR a few weeks ago, and first thing I did was take the wheels to Central Wheel Components in Birmingham to have them converted to tubeless compatible. The company actually build the wheels for Norton and there's an interesting video about them - link below. About halfway through is a bit about the tubelss conversion and later on a bit about building wheels for the new Norton Commando being manufactured in Solihull. Might be interesting to some owners.
When I picked up the wheels I had a quick factory tour and saw the spokes being made, rims drilled and wheels being assembled and trued. Old fashioned manufacturing....

Got the wheels back today and rode the bike for the first time. Running-in instructions are a bit painful -not to exceed 3500rpm for first 300 miles....



Regards
 
I've been there a few times to collect spokes for Donington Norton.
Great that you've had them reworked to ditch the innertubes though....do you mind if I ask how much they charge a pair?
 
On my 2015 sport, I asked Norton could I make them into tubeless wheels and they said no because the rims weren't the correct profile for tubeless tyres to seal. Have TVS changed the profile of the rims or were Norton telling porkies. I think that £300 is a fair price to pay for peace of mind concerning at the side of the road puncture repair .
 
The spoked rim that the Central Wheel employee was sealing for tubeless running is a safety rim type. As long as the Norton rims are safety rims, then the conversion can safely be done.
A safety rim has a raised semicircular safety bead ( not the tyre bead) about half an inch or so in from the shoulder. This feature prevents the tire bead from accidentally dislodging from the shoulder on impact with a Road hazard such as a pothole. Without the safety bead the tire can move away from the shoulder and almost instantly deflate. This is very dangerous.
A friend has converted his regular chrome Dunlop WM2 non safety rims to tubeless by using the Outex tape system. I haven't been able to convince him that this is a bad idea.
I used the Outex system on the front of the Thruxton R. The Thruxton R has safety rims. The system held air perfectly for about two years then developed a slow leak. Outex has sent me a liquid to install in the wheel in hopes that it will fix the problem. Failing that I will strip out the Outex tape and go back to using a tube.
The system that Central Wheel is using looks a bit heavier than the Outex system and also much more skookum with a greater chance of success.

Glen
 
Difference between WM and MT profile, with MT being so common now I would have thought a 2015 rim would be MT but maybe Norton bought some old stock being cheap.


WM

Tubeless conversion on new Commando 961


Tubeless conversion on new Commando 961


MT

Tubeless conversion on new Commando 961


Tubeless conversion on new Commando 961
 
Fast Eddie said:
Presumably, with these sealed spoked rims, one cannot tighten any spoke nipples ?
Click to expand...
You can still tighten with the Outex system but there is a chance that a leak will be created.
There have been quite a few failures over time with the Outex system. It seems that the action of the spokes and rims out on the road eventually breaks the seal.


Glen
 
I've performed tubeless conversions myself for mountain and road bike (bicycle) wheels and they are generally very reliable. Its done in the same way with a thick sticky tape that covers the spoke holes. You can still adjust the spokes to true the wheels which doesn't seem to disturb the seal. And don't forget bicycle tyres are often inflated to over twice the pressure of motorcycle tyres. If a slow leak does develop, then adding some latex tubeless sealant fixes it. Not sure if the bicycle experience can be directly extrapolated to motorcycles, but it does give me confidence. The guys at Central Wheel Components were also confident in their system which was developed in house.

How often might you have to true up a Norton wheel by adjusting spoke tension? I was assuming (hoping) never !
 
lfoggy said:
I've performed tubeless conversions myself for mountain and road bike (bicycle) wheels and they are generally very reliable. Its done in the same way with a thick sticky tape that covers the spoke holes. You can still adjust the spokes to true the wheels which doesn't seem to disturb the seal. And don't forget bicycle tyres are often inflated to over twice the pressure of motorcycle tyres. If a slow leak does develop, then adding some latex tubeless sealant fixes it. Not sure if the bicycle experience can be directly extrapolated to motorcycles, but it does give me confidence. The guys at Central Wheel Components were also confident in their system which was developed in house.

How often might you have to true up a Norton wheel by adjusting spoke tension? I was assuming (hoping) never !
Click to expand...
Shouldn’t have to ‘true’ the wheel at all IMO. But spokes can / do stretch and become loose, (thud rather than ring when tapped), so some might occasionally need their nipples tweaking (ooh matron) !
 
Fast Eddie said:
Shouldn’t have to ‘true’ the wheel at all IMO. But spokes can / do stretch and become loose, (thud rather than ring when tapped), so some might occasionally need their nipples tweaking (ooh matron) !
Click to expand...
A definite consideration.
Laced wheels are beautiful, but I'm opting for mag/alloy wheels in order to go tubeless.
 
lfoggy said:
I've performed tubeless conversions myself for mountain and road bike (bicycle) wheels and they are generally very reliable. Its done in the same way with a thick sticky tape that covers the spoke holes. You can still adjust the spokes to true the wheels which doesn't seem to disturb the seal. And don't forget bicycle tyres are often inflated to over twice the pressure of motorcycle tyres. If a slow leak does develop, then adding some latex tubeless sealant fixes it. Not sure if the bicycle experience can be directly extrapolated to motorcycles, but it does give me confidence. The guys at Central Wheel Components were also confident in their system which was developed in house.

How often might you have to true up a Norton wheel by adjusting spoke tension? I was assuming (hoping) never
Click to expand...

lfoggy said:
I've performed tubeless conversions myself for mountain and road bike (bicycle) wheels and they are generally very reliable. Its done in the same way with a thick sticky tape that covers the spoke holes. You can still adjust the spokes to true the wheels which doesn't seem to disturb the seal. And don't forget bicycle tyres are often inflated to over twice the pressure of motorcycle tyres. If a slow leak does develop, then adding some latex tubeless sealant fixes it. Not sure if the bicycle experience can be directly extrapolated to motorcycles, but it does give me confidence. The guys at Central Wheel Components were also confident in their system which was developed in house.

How often might you have to true up a Norton wheel by adjusting spoke tension? I was assuming (hoping) never !
Click to expand...
The Central Wheel process looks much more likely to stand up than the Outex tape system.
For a minute, after seeing the video, I was tempted to ship my Thruxton wheels there, then realized that the 2 way shipping would probably cost another 300 or 400 gbp on top of the 300 gbp cost. Sanity returned and probably the tubes will too.


Glen
 
peebee said:
On my 2015 sport, I asked Norton could I make them into tubeless wheels and they said no because the rims weren't the correct profile for tubeless tyres to seal. Have TVS changed the profile of the rims or were Norton telling porkies. I think that £300 is a fair price to pay for peace of mind concerning at the side of the road puncture repair .
Click to expand...

The spoked rims on my 2015 961 Sport are MT, with the safety bead. I suspect Norton were just worried about liability issues if they told you that converting them was ok.

Ken
 
lfoggy said:
BST offer a carbon fibre wheelset for the Norton.
Not an official Norton option but tempting as an extravagant upgrade.
https://www.bikehps.com/acatalog/Norton_961_Commando_BST_Carbon_Fibre_Motorcycle_Wheels.html
Click to expand...
For the non-ABS guys only though I think foggy. Which is a shame, as these beauties really do transform the handling of the 961.

Although if pressed, I’d have to agree that looks wise the wire wheels still take the win! More fitting for the 961 aesthetic IMO. But only if clean of course:oops:!

I’ve kept the wire wheels as, although super-strong, the carbon wheels definitely look susceptible to a serious ding - no fixing that!
 
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Like the idea of tubeless spoked wheels, just fitted some to the car, but again as with cycle wheels is the option of an inner tube with some 'slime' type sealant a good option as it will automatically seal a puncture while moving? Or use an instant sealer/inflator without causing the mess in a tubeless tyre? The only thing I wonder about is if moving away fast does the slime sink to the bottom and cause a temporary imbalance?
 
Clive said:
Like the idea of tubeless spoked wheels, just fitted some to the car, but again as with cycle wheels is the option of an inner tube with some 'slime' type sealant a good option as it will automatically seal a puncture while moving? Or use an instant sealer/inflator without causing the mess in a tubeless tyre? The only thing I wonder about is if moving away fast does the slime sink to the bottom and cause a temporary imbalance?
Click to expand...
Slime is horrid stuff. Don't use it.
 
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