Toddbrook Reservoir dam

Bernhard

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Toddbrook Reservoir dam starting to break up after getting a months’ worth of rain in two hours.

https://www.bing.com/search?q=BBC+toddbrook+reser+dam&src=IE-SearchBox&FORM=IESR3A

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...k-save-crumbling-Toddbrook-Reservoir-dam.html

What I don’t understand is this Dam is 180 years old, and we would not build them like this anymore - moreover the Romans perfected a concrete nearly 2000 years ago made from would you believe volcanic ash called Pozzolana. All these Roman structures are still standing!

https://www.historicmysteries.com/roman-concrete/
 
and as usual with news media, it took 36 hours, till Today Radio show this morning, to interview a dam expert who could talk coherently about dam design etc. Before that, it is endless tabloid drama.....
 
What makes you think the expert knows what he is talking about? It was built 180 years ago when a horse and cart was the norm - anybody who was alive then-is no longer with us. We clearly wouldn’t build a dam with a middle wall of clay shored up with mud either side of it now - it was built during WILLIAM IV era (1830 – 1837)
 
I have just realised that the fast running overflow stream that runs at the side of the dam runs all the way downhill to Macclesfield- it even fills the canal up- before it goes onwards over a metal weir at the side of the canal which is not far from relatives house, as I used to take their dogs round that way for their walkies! If the dam bursts a few industrial estates and houses in Macc are in the line of fire, as heaven knows how far thousands of gallons of water will flow!
 
Dam maintenance is not rocket science.

We went through this too, here in California with the huge waters behind the Oroville Dam which nearly failed.

Media covered for negligence of Ca Dept Water Resources avoiding why and focusing on evacuations.

Lots of coverage of grandstanding politicians and bureaucrats talking about all the help they we’re probiding insead of asking why!

Turned out Dept of Water Resources failed to cut brush and allowed trees to grow on face of the dam and that fact led to a cascade of structural failures

Simple negligence by public “servants.”
 
xbacksideslider said:
Dam maintenance is not rocket science.
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That may be true John but as Bernhard says, it was built over 180 years ago. Clay core, Surrounded by soil/mud and finished with stone. We don’t build them like we used to - and in this case it is a really good idea!
John
 
It lasted this long so the original design wasn’t that bad, was it?

The Oroville Dam I referenced here in CA is also an earthen Dam, one of the largest earthen dams in the world. Idiots responsible for it allowed pretty trees to grow on it. Big error. Known error. They just didn’t want to cut the trees and clear the brush. Thought they knew better than the guys of two generations before who built it. Arrogance and sloth nearly created a disaster and caused a huge capital repair expense
 
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ashman said:
And you know what is even worst they build houses on the other side of the dam wall.
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I would have loved to be sitting next to the people, on my bar stool, who thinks this is a good idea. But you know it has lasted 180 years which is a far better record than some built much later.
John in Texas
 
xbacksideslider said:
It lasted this long so the original design wasn’t that bad, was it?

The Oroville Dam I referenced here in CA is also an earthen Dam, one of the largest earthen dams in the world. Idiots responsible for it allowed pretty trees to grow on it. Big error. Known error. They just didn’t want to cut the trees and clear the brush. Thought they knew better than the guys of two gerstions before who built it. Arrogance and sloth nearly created a disaster and caused a huge capital repair expense
Click to expand...
California and idiots sort of go hand in hand.
John in Texas
 
The dam before the recent high rain fall on one side of the pic and of the missing concrete shield.

Toddbrook Reservoir dam
 
As for houses below dam - during the 1930s, the era of “flood control” and dam building in the US, FDR’s Dept of Interior and US Army Corps of Engineers competed with each other to build dams.

Corruption was huge, especially over exactly where to site the dam.

Stakes for local landowners were titanic and they would pay politicians, political parties, surveyors, engineers, contractors etcetera to make sure that their land was downstream and not upstream of the dam.

Your land could wind up underwater and you only got paid the eminent domain low ball rate and were forced off your land. Or, you could wind up downstream, no need to sell out and move, enjoying the riches of irrigated land and high land values
 
Eljahara said:
That may be true John but as Bernhard says, it was built over 180 years ago. Clay core, Surrounded by soil/mud and finished with stone. We don’t build them like we used to - and in this case it is a really good idea!
John
Click to expand...

A clay core is a good thing, I’d think. Impermeable so long as protected from erosion. That’s why the rock facing was placed 180 years ago. Those engineers knew more then?

From the pics we can see that the dam keepers failed to maintain that facing. Bushes growing out of it cracks not sealed. Water alliowed to get under the facing, thus allowing erosion of the clay core.

Nah, media will cover for inept government and the citizens will be asked for a huge bond issue to pay for a new dam or at big repairs
 
Re; “From the pics we can see that the dam keepers failed to maintain that facing. Bushes growing out of it cracks not sealed. Water allowed to get under the facing, thus allowing erosion of the clay core.”

You are right up- to a point, the centre of the dam is made from clay up to the highest point, but only in the centre- then soil and mud is filled either side of it, as a filler, then topped by stone on the water side, concrete slabs on the slipway. The problem is they claimed to have maintained this slipway, but weeds, etc. has a nasty habit of getting in well- everywhere! There are pics of the slipway from 2016-2017 with weeds growing out of it as there was when the water was overflowing last week. The one month’s rainfall in two hours soon filled it right up to the brim and caught everyone by surprise! It was more water than the dam was designed for, sadly . . . . . .


Dr Mohammed Heidarzadeh, of Brunel University, fears severe damage to the spillway at Whaley Bridge dam could soon cause a massive flood. He said: "Whaley Bridge dam is an embankment dam which is equipped with a concrete toped spillway. Spillways are extremely important because they prevent embankment dams from overtopping. Overtopping of embankment dams is very dangerous because it can cause the dam to be washed away in a few hours and consequently trigger a big flood. Embankment dams are made from soil and so can be washed away rapidly.
 
Yep. Damage enabled by failure to pull weeds and grout cracks.

Easy cheap maintenance

Here in CA the politicians refused to fund adequate maintenance budget despite warnings. Pols wanted to spend elsewhere, “deferring” necessary maintenance. It’s likely that the same applies to Toddbrook
 
After using something like 20 pumps to massively reduce the amount of water in the reservoir all the residents appear to have allowed back home. . . .until the next time?

Many questions are being asked, if you scroll down below you see In one of the pictures, vegetation can be seen growing out of the concrete slabs on the side of the auxiliary spillway that has partially collapsed, before the over flow;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-49220650


List of towns that might, I repeat , might have been affected;

https://metro.co.uk/2019/08/01/list-towns-path-toddbrook-reservoir-dam-faces-collapse-10501885/
 
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