The V4 situation

Fast Eddie

Fast Eddie

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There are 15 (yes FIFTEEN) V4SVs for sale on Autotrader currently.

One has been for sale for almost a year.

The cheapest is £33k (1 mile on it).

They just don’t seem to be selling, even at prices massively below list.

I’m thinking TVS must have got their fingers burned with these.

Good future investments or throwing your money away? Which way y’all think they’ll go ??
 
Fast Eddie said:
There are 15 (yes FIFTEEN) V4SVs for sale on Autotrader currently.

One has been for sale for almost a year.

The cheapest is £33k (1 mile on it).

They just don’t seem to be selling, even at prices massively below list.

I’m thinking TVS must have got their fingers burned with these.

Good future investments or throwing your money away? Which way y’all think they’ll go ??
Click to expand...
Suspect those bikes were bought as an investment anyway, turned out to be a poor one. The modern Hesketh perhaps.
 
Personally, I see the V4ss as an investment bike over the v4sv. It's the original, it's the one with all the company controversy surrounding it.
 
I can see the 15 total but not all of the bikes. They appear to have PDI mileage only. Bought as an investment, but what prompted them to sell - at the same time? New Norton bikes? Can’t see them releasing another super sports bike - even if that were the case these people would’nt know.

Are you guys seeing 15 individual bike advertisements? Are they all PDI mileage only? Something must tie them together - where is our Auto-trader-super-sleuth?
 
15 separate bikes.

2 private sales, 13 dealers.

Some clearly new. Most pre owned / registered. Most almost zero miles, the highest mileage being one of the private sales at 266.

Not all marketed at the same time, at least one has been on the market for 3 weeks short of a year.

Nothing specific tying them together apart from the fact that many of the first built were for those who had deposits down on SS’s or returned their SS’s for the infamous ‘deal’ and that many of these people had ‘moved on’ and simply sort to sell their SV’s as soon as they’d collected them.

Nevertheless, I’m surprised at the apparently stagnant market. And intrigued as to what the collective thinks this means for the future? Will prices continue to fall? Are these bikes destined to become white elephants? Or will their status and value increase?

If they fall much further they’ll almost be affordable …
 
With around 15 interest rate rises in last few years it is still a recession ? , well must be for some , when those V4 bikes were ordered money was cheap , in recession the leisure & pleasure toys do take a hit , boats , cars & bikes , think the classic British bike market has taker a hit as there customer base is well “ getting even older still or popping their clogs “ the Japanese classic bikes of the 1970,s are now asking top money for those two strokes & the Z1 has never been so dear , New Norton appear to be struggling selling any bikes in large numbers with all the “ quality/warranty “ back up , so private sellers are finding it tough ( more pressure from the wife) “ thought u said you wouldn’t loose money on that bike ? “ any time for a ride
 
Like many things the value or costs of classic bikes fluctuates.
I own a 1990 Honda GB 500 . They were only marketed here in the USA for one year and many went unsold in dealerships at the retail price of over $ 4k . Then they became a collector’s item and prices soared to more than double the original price. I had always wanted one and when I found one in mint condition a few years ago I bit the bullet and bought it . Within a couple years I was offered considerably more than what I paid but then as now I have no interest in selling it . Now the market has gone soft I would be lucky to get what I paid. One would need a very accurate crystal ball to forecast what the V4 May do in terms of selling prices. If they do become valuable at some point it is likely that they will also depreciate at some point thereafter.
 
If I were in the UK with 2nd hand (investor jettisoned) V4SV’s up for grabs at that price (or lower) I’d snap one up! What a beautifully crafted, unique, stunning looking machine that is - and a Norton, for those for which that still matters. More than enough performance than ya could ever use on the road (or the track for us mere mortals)!

Something hand crafted and rare, the like of which we might not see again from Norton. Or, just the latest Ducati/Aprilia superbike? One that might likely be a keeper, versus the latest offering from the big boys likely to be replaced by next years higher performing model.

I know what I’d choose. My only reservation would be size. It looks quite diminutive and I’m 6ft+ 95 kg. I’d definitely need to try one on for size. Well, a guy can dream can’t he!

IMG_0494.jpeg
 
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Stephen_Spencer said:
If I were in the UK with 2nd hand (investor jettisoned) V4SV’s up for grabs at that price (or lower) I’d snap one up! What a beautifully crafted, unique, stunning looking machine that is - and a Norton, for those for which that still matters. More than enough performance than ya could ever use on the road (or the track for us mere mortals)!

Something hand crafted and rare, the like of which we might not see again from Norton. Or, just the latest Ducati/Aprilia superbike? One that might likely be a keeper, versus the latest offering from the big boys likely to be replaced by next years higher performing model.

I know what I’d choose. My only reservation would be size. It looks quite diminutive and I’m 6ft+ 95 kg. I’d definitely need to try one on for size. Well, a guy can dream can’t he!

View attachment 115789
Click to expand...
Indeed, very tempting, and getting more tempting as prices continue to fall it seems.

But one big reason for hesitance is our old friend… the parts issue.

As discussed elsewhere, TVS have form now in the topic of legacy parts supply. The V4 is so unique and special, the entire engine / frame, bodywork all being unique. So, there is a big concern that TVS will fail to ensure long term parts supply, and the volumes are way too low to be of any interest to aftermarket suppliers.

But I guess that such concerns are at least in part why demand, and thus prices, are falling in the first place ?
 
Fast Eddie said:
Indeed, very tempting, and getting more tempting as prices continue to fall it seems.

But one big reason for hesitance is our old friend… the parts issue.

As discussed elsewhere, TVS have form now in the topic of legacy parts supply. The V4 is so unique and special, the entire engine / frame, bodywork all being unique. So, there is a big concern that TVS will fail to ensure long term parts supply, and the volumes are way too low to be of any interest to aftermarket suppliers.

But I guess that such concerns are at least in part why demand, and thus prices, are falling in the first place ?
Click to expand...
There’s no indication of parts supply issues for Solihull bikes FE. As we know, these bikes would have the remaining warranty period and Norton are legally obligated to provide parts for an extended ownership period (10-15Yrs?). Even if the very worst were to occur and Norton Birmingham were to fail, that obligation would remain with TVS.

Tardy (at best) legacy parts supply, through a relatively new dealer network, for a group of red headed step children being a different issue I feel.

I hazard that your fears be misplaced sire, and ye should rush out and purchase a thoroughly British V4SV post haste - so we can all follow vicariously of course!😄👍
 
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BLIGHTYBRIT/SF said:
With around 15 interest rate rises in last few years it is still a recession ? , well must be for some , when those V4 bikes were ordered money was cheap , in recession the leisure & pleasure toys do take a hit , boats , cars & bikes , think the classic British bike market has taker a hit as there customer base is well “ getting even older still or popping their clogs “ the Japanese classic bikes of the 1970,s are now asking top money for those two strokes & the Z1 has never been so dear , New Norton appear to be struggling selling any bikes in large numbers with all the “ quality/warranty “ back up , so private sellers are finding it tough ( more pressure from the wife) “ thought u said you wouldn’t loose money on that bike ? “ any time for a ride
Click to expand...
Timing to enter the premium/luxury motorcycle market is not great it seems, to say the least:rolleyes:! Although contrary information about luxury bikes is confusing.

IMG_0497.jpeg


IMG_0498.jpeg

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Stephen_Spencer said:
There’s no indication of parts supply issues for Solihull bikes FE. As we know, these bikes would have the remaining warranty period and Norton are legally obligated to provide parts for an extended ownership period (10-15Yrs?). Even if the very worst were to occur and Norton Birmingham were to fail, that obligation would remain with TVS.

Tardy (at best) legacy parts supply, through a relatively new dealer network, for a group of red headed step children being a different issue I feel.

I hazard that your fears be misplaced sire, and ye should rush out and purchase a thoroughly British V4SV post haste - so we can all follow vicariously of course!😄👍
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Well, we wouldn’t expect anything other than the optimistic viewpoint from you would we now ?!?

I’m not sure what the legal obligation to supply parts is to be honest and it’s difficult to ascertain. The clearest article I could find says this:

“It depends on the popularity of the car, the part, and the source of the part.

Modern cars are assembled rather than built. The car maker itself produces their own body panels and engines, but frequently not much more. Most other components are sourced from third party suppliers. The car maker orders enough for production and service network support. They are obligated only to support your car with parts long enough to get you through your warranty period. There is no law requiring parts to be available for 7 years, 10 years, whatever”.

So, the perceived level of risk with regards to buying something like a V4SV really does come down to one’s own perception.

I do know that there is a huge gap between ‘legally providing parts’ and parts actually being available, lots of ‘exotic’ brands suffer this with cars / bikes out of service for prolonged periods awaiting parts even whilst still under warranty.

Use is a factor too I guess. Parts supply wouldn’t be much of a concern to someone only riding gently on 5-6 Sundays per year, whereas someone using it for track days would likely use more mechanical parts and possibly body parts too!

To me at least, if considering something like this as a genuine ‘keeper’ parts supply is most definitely a factor to consider. Whether or not that constitutes a risk high enough to impact the buying decision is down to personal perspective.
 
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Fast Eddie said:
Well, we wouldn’t expect anything other than the optimistic viewpoint from you would we now ?!?

I’m not sure what the legal obligation to supply parts is to be honest and it’s difficult to ascertain. The clearest article I could find says this:

“It depends on the popularity of the car, the part, and the source of the part.

Modern cars are assembled rather than built. The car maker itself produces their own body panels and engines, but frequently not much more. Most other components are sourced from third party suppliers. The car maker orders enough for production and service network support. They are obligated only to support your car with parts long enough to get you through your warranty period. There is no law requiring parts to be available for 7 years, 10 years, whatever”.

So, the perceived level of risk with regards to buying something like a V4SV really does come down to one’s own perception.

I do know that there is a huge gap between ‘legally providing parts’ and parts actually being available, lots of ‘exotic’ brands suffer this with cars / bikes out of service for prolonged periods awaiting parts even whilst still under warranty.

Use is a factor too I guess. Parts supply wouldn’t be much of a concern to someone only riding gently on 5-6 Sundays per year, whereas someone using it for track days would likely use more mechanical parts and probably body parts too!

To me at least, if considering something like this as a genuine ‘keeper’ parts supply is most definitely a factor to consider. Whether or not that constitutes a risk high enough to impact the buying decision is down to personal perspective.
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Deep down I think we both know that the ‘optimism - pessimism scale’ on this forum is broken FE, maybe beyond repair, and certainly well beyond the warranty period🤣!

If you don’t trust Norton Birmingham backed by TVS (a larger manufacrurer than Yamaha) then you definitely shouldn’t buy one.
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
My only reservation would be size. It looks quite diminutive and I’m 6ft+ 95 kg. I’d definitely need to try one on for size. Well, a guy can dream can’t he!
Click to expand...

I wouldn’t let that stop you, I’m the same 6ft and 95kg, and although I’ve never ridden one, I have sat on them and the ergonomics felt fine to me.

It certainly felt much more humane than the 961 cafe racer. So it’d practically be a Gold Wing for you….!
 
The purchase of a modern Norton for me would mean having sufficient spare cash that I’d be easily able to shrug my shoulders at any prospective lack of spares and customer service that may or may not arise, to such a pitch that if it became a boat anchor or a piece of artwork in my living room I couldn’t care less.
 
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