Oiling the swingarm bushing.

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gortnipper said:
I took Comnoz's advice and ran a bead of silicone over the oitside of the Welsh plugs where they join the swingarm, as that is where my leaks had always been greatest.
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I did the same with the silicone but unfortunately I once neglected to pump oil into my swing arm for maybe 2 years
I ride all year round and I had noticed the handling getting worse and could feel play in the swing arm
I was surprised how rusty the pin was on the drive side
The timing side was perfect
 
concours said:
My ‘74 had totally sealed (sic) end caps, no zerk, no through bolt.
I drilled the timing side to accept a 1/8” ID hose (1/4” OD), ran it half way across the spindle. Gravity fed.
Like drilling the bolt, only lazier. No weakening.
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To clarify, I leave the hose in place, but only attach the fill funnel when it’ll be having a repair/maint done, like annually. So, not continually fed, but easily gets oil to both sides.
 
MexicoMike said:
OilLite bushings do not require a steady input of oil. The purpose for which they were designed in the 1930's was for locations where regular oiling was difficult/impossible. IMO the original Norton method is the best way to lube them - with the fitting and something to FORCE some oil in under moderate(!!!) pressure. It's a better way to ensure a bit of oil, which is all that is needed, gets to both bushings
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Read in a discussion between machinists that all is well until it's left too long. And the question then became, "and when is that?" (I paraphrase). I just got to the swingarm overflow center bolt because I had a flat. So then, off with the wheel and undo fender attachments, and off with the horn and -- there it was. Do the bushings go dry, or "not oily enough" like a switch being fliped off? Or does the lubrication dry out in areas? Heck, I have no idea. That center bolt holds nothing in place (on my bike anyway). And the next time I see that center bolt may be the next time I replace the rear tire (just a wee bit lazy). So the constant oiler approach that's under the seat easy to get to and check is quite appealing. Would like to know how big of a reservoir and how fast it went down. Don't know if it was mentioned, but machinists do use oiling cups and reservoirs to extend the time between maintenance and attention.
 
chaztuna said:
Joe,
Certain brands of marine wheel bearing grease are red. These products are designed to protect the wheel bearings on boat trailers, which are regularly submerged in water. So if it is grease, the previous owner at least had the sense to choose a water proof product. Redline's petroleum products are all dyed red, so it could be Redline Synthetic Gear Oil for manual transmissions.

https://www.redlineoil.com/75w140-ns-gl-5-gear-oil

This is an excellent product. If the red lubricant is the above oil, odds are what you added is inferior. Either way, because it's red in color, it has not been in there for 45 years.

Charlie K
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Rubber Grease is red! So is th e Motul 10w40 gearbox oil I just bought for another bike! And so was a big tin of basic oil company branded (Esso?) LM grease I bought decades ago!

You really cannot assume much from colour!

People see a grease nipple they pump grease through it! (I have a 1956 MG that has a grease nipple on the steering rack, it has to be lubed with 140W gear oil! Guess what?)

The only way to be confident what is in there is to remove and replace. In this case the amount of work will required to do that will outweigh the (immediate) benefit.

Check for wear. Monitor regularly. Any sign of wear and you are going to learn a new procedure! Which is: how to get the pin out!
 
Joe Schlaberdowski said:
Read in a discussion between machinists that all is well until it's left too long. And the question then became, "and when is that?" (I paraphrase). I just got to the swingarm overflow center bolt because I had a flat. So then, off with the wheel and undo fender attachments, and off with the horn and -- there it was. Do the bushings go dry, or "not oily enough" like a switch being fliped off? Or does the lubrication dry out in areas?
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According to the routine maintenance instructions in the factory manual section K10, the pivot should be lubricated every 5,000 miles as once recharged with oil the porous Oilite bushes remain self-lubricating and don't need to be constantly fed with oil.

"OILITE
Self-lubricating, highly wear-resistant, ductile, conformable and corrosion resistant."

"Oilite bearings with large interconnected pores vital for the channeling of lubricants to areas between the shaft and bearing. At rest, the capillary action will recover lubricant from the surface and replenish the reservoirs. This porosity feature of Oilite is the most sought-after quality of our bearings."


Joe Schlaberdowski said:
That center bolt holds nothing in place (on my bike anyway).
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Under normal circumstances, the central bolt shouldn't need to be loosened or removed to fill the pivot.
The reason why removing the spindle locating bolt seems to have been necessary in this instance is because the pivot was clogged with what appeared to be some form of grease.

As it states in manual section K10 "alternatively, remove the oil nipple and fill with an oil gun" which is probably a better method because if the nipple hole is at, or above the height of the spindle drilling and oil is pumped in with an oil can until it reaches the level of the hole then not only must the spindle drilling be filled but air can also escape easily.
 
L.A.B. said:
According to the routine maintenance instructions in the factory manual section K10, the pivot should be lubricated every 5,000 miles as once recharged with oil the porous Oilite bushes remain self-lubricating and don't need to be constantly fed with oil.

"OILITE
Self-lubricating, highly wear-resistant, ductile, conformable and corrosion resistant."

"Oilite bearings with large interconnected pores vital for the channeling of lubricants to areas between the shaft and bearing. At rest, the capillary action will recover lubricant from the surface and replenish the reservoirs. This porosity feature of Oilite is the most sought-after quality of our bearings."





Under normal circumstances, the central bolt shouldn't need to be loosened or removed to fill the pivot.
The reason why removing the spindle locating bolt seems to have been necessary in this instance is because the pivot was clogged with what appeared to be some form of grease.

As it states in manual section K10 "alternatively, remove the oil nipple and fill with an oil gun" which is probably a better method because if the nipple hole is at, or above the height of the spindle drilling and oil is pumped in with an oil can until it reaches the level of the hole then not only must the spindle drilling be filled but air can also escape easily.
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Before this discussion I had contacted a Norton shop and was told to loosen that center bolt. Did not know it was for spindle location and not for the escape of pressure when using a hand pump (pumpung 140 wt.) on the zirk. Was told without loosening it I could blow out the seal. No mention of the spindle. But if the bold holds the spindle in place, how would they drill the bolt for an oil feed without weakening it.
 
Joe Schlaberdowski said:
Before this discussion I had contacted a Norton shop and was told to loosen that center bolt. Did not know it was for spindle location and not for the escape of pressure when using a hand pump (pumpung 140 wt.) on the zirk. Was told without loosening it I could blow out the seal.
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According to the factory manual the reason for removing the spindle bolt is to check the cavity is filled as it says: "It is important to check the cavity is filled. The only means of checking this is to remove the spindle locating bolt".

There's no mention of it being done to relieve pressure and I wouldn't necessarily agree that it's "the only means" as slackening the long through-bolt by a few turns I would have thought should achieve the same.

Filling the pivot to full capacity would be far more than the Oilite bushes could absorb so the majority of the oil usually leaks from the pivot and is wasted.

Once again if the nipple is removed and the pivot filled with an oil can then there's practically no chance of a pressure build-up.

Joe Schlaberdowski said:
But if the bold holds the spindle in place, how would they drill the bolt for an oil feed without weakening it.
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I will leave that to others who have done the modification although I doubt that bolt is highly stressed.
 
marshg246 said:
Do you know if there are other bushings in a Commando that are Oilite?
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Sleeve gear bushes:
andover-norton.co.uk

Motorcycle parts and spares for Norton motorbikes - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Andover Norton Motorcycles Parts - Original Andover Norton Parts

Motorcycle parts and spares for Andover Norton motorbikes: Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002.
andover-norton.co.uk

Edit:
Fork top bushes:
andover-norton.co.uk

Motorcycle parts and spares for Norton motorbikes - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Andover Norton Motorcycles Parts - Original Andover Norton Parts

Motorcycle parts and spares for Andover Norton motorbikes: Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002.
andover-norton.co.uk

Gear lever outer cover bush:
andover-norton.co.uk

Motorcycle parts and spares for Norton motorbikes - Genuine Andover Norton Spare Parts - Andover Norton Motorcycles Parts - Original Andover Norton Parts

Motorcycle parts and spares for Andover Norton motorbikes: Andover Norton manufactures and supplies all Genuine Factory Spare Parts for Norton motorcycles built before 2002.
andover-norton.co.uk

Some inner gearchange bushes seem to have been Oilite:
www.ebay.com

Inner Bush Gear Change shift Norton 04-0061 UK MADE Single Bushing | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Inner Bush Gear Change shift Norton 04-0061 UK MADE Single Bushing at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
www.ebay.com
 
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Joe Schlaberdowski said:
Before this discussion I had contacted a Norton shop and was told to loosen that center bolt. Did not know it was for spindle location and not for the escape of pressure when using a hand pump (pumpung 140 wt.) on the zirk. Was told without loosening it I could blow out the seal. No mention of the spindle. But if the bold holds the spindle in place, how would they drill the bolt for an oil feed without weakening it.
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I would expect drilling a hole through the bolt does weaken it
The bolt only locates the pin
Why would you worry about it?
 
Joe , when I first got my Norton before ever touching it with a wrench , I got parts list , owners manual , factory shop repair and maintenance manual , plus a clymer or Haynes manual came with bike , also over these past years Hobot sent me his copy of Factory notes which covers changes made to builds as they were put together for sale all by date and some other articles I have found in various places .... with all 4 of my bikes I have the same / similar list of materials for reference for when I have a problem or service issue .... forums can obviously be very helpful as well ..... suggest you get yourself a factory shop manual you will be glad you did .... I always get the real thing , you know a real printed book , hope this advice is taken in spirit it is offered .....
 
My 2 bikes have gravity fed 90 oil going through that centre bolt on the 850 [ sealed ends ] or through a replacement bolt where the zerk fitting is fitted, on my 750 [ removable ends held in place by a wheel spoke with a nut brazed to one end ]. Both bolts are drilled and have a 3/16 OD copper tube brazed to them with a length of 3/16 ID neoprene hose connected, and joining up with a 30 ml bottle of the 90 oil. Easy. I fill it up maybe twice a year or before a long ride.

As mentioned on page one. Who would bother even loosening that centre bolt to enable oil to be injected in through a grease nipple [ zerk ].
 
kerinorton said:
My 2 bikes have gravity fed 90 oil going through that centre bolt on the 850 [ sealed ends ] or through a replacement bolt where the zerk fitting is fitted, on my 750 [ removable ends held in place by a wheel spoke with a nut brazed to one end ]. Both bolts are drilled and have a 3/16 OD copper tube brazed to them with a length of 3/16 ID neoprene hose connected, and joining up with a 30 ml bottle of the 90 oil. Easy. I fill it up maybe twice a year or before a long ride.
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I appreciate the ease with which you are now able to refill the swinging arm spindle cavity. It makes sense. But, if the oillite bushes only absorb
a finite amount of the oil injected into the cavity (as designed), where is the rest of the oil going that 30 ml of oil it needs to be refilled twice a year?
Not trying to be a smart ass here. Genuinely curious. Does it leak out, or is it" absorbed" and "used"? I'm just seeing a lot of hocus pocus about a
very simple thing, which is just squirt oil into the cavity via the "zerk" fitting until it seems full and then ride. Repeat in 6 months. If this isn't good
enough, then install sealed needle bearings and be done with it.
 
I would like some info on how to lube a Mk3 swing arm please.
Mine has about 13K mileage on it now.

Oiling the swingarm bushing.
 
lazyeye6 said:
I appreciate the ease with which you are now able to refill the swinging arm spindle cavity. It makes sense. But, if the oillite bushes only absorb
a finite amount of the oil injected into the cavity (as designed), where is the rest of the oil going that 30 ml of oil it needs to be refilled twice a year?
Not trying to be a smart ass here. Genuinely curious. Does it leak out, or is it" absorbed" and "used"? I'm just seeing a lot of hocus pocus about a
very simple thing, which is just squirt oil into the cavity via the "zerk" fitting until it seems full and then ride. Repeat in 6 months. If this isn't good
enough, then install sealed needle bearings and be done with it.
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It leaks out , well it does on my one
It's a case of each to their own
It took maybe an hour to drill the bolt connect a pipe and cable tie a resovoir under the seat
I top it up monthly maybe 2 monthly I can't remember
But it takes seconds to top up,I don't put 30 ml in mine I use far less
Best thing for me in not having to bend down to do it
Or put the bike on my ramp
If you don't like the idea don't do it
As said it works for me and I don't want the pin rusting up again, although I have to say the bushes were still fine !
 
The oilite bushes retaining oil, the “sealed” chamber all makes sense right up until the bike leaves the warm, dry building it was built in.
In the real world of motorbikes RIDDEN, moisture inside there is a reality. The steel spindle WILL rust, which in turn gobbles up the bushes. This is why over lubricating (for CORROSION PROTECTION) is prudent, versus what somebody (factory engineers writing the service book) pulled out of their ass as a service interval.
Next time you’re driving your car, observe the water spray around other vehicles wheels. Like a pressure washer.
Deny it if you wish, but 50 years of fixing rusty junk (not YOUR precious baby of course:p) says so.
 
concours said:
The oilite bushes retaining oil, the “sealed” chamber all makes sense right up until the bike leaves the warm, dry building it was built in.
In the real world of motorbikes RIDDEN, moisture inside there is a reality. The steel spindle WILL rust, which in turn gobbles up the bushes. This is why over lubricating (for CORROSION PROTECTION) is prudent, versus what somebody (factory engineers writing the service book) pulled out of their ass as a service interval.
Next time you’re driving your car, observe the water spray around other vehicles wheels. Like a pressure washer.
Deny it if you wish, but 50 years of fixing rusty junk (not YOUR precious baby of course:p) says so.
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After last winter I have decided not use my commando again when there is still salt on the road (I'll use my old Indian Enfield instead)
I'm guessing salty water got in to the swing arm pin and washed it out?
Interestingly the rust was only on the drive side of the pin?
 
p400 said:
I would like some info on how to lube a Mk3 swing arm please.
Mine has about 13K mileage on it now.

View attachment 18958
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Sorry I don't know the factory answer
But if it was mine I'd strip it out and clean and inspect it
I'd reassemble but leave the timing side Welch plug off
I'd lay the bike on its side,fill the chamber with oil and carefully tap the Welch plug in
You'd need to make sure the Welch plug the other end dosent pop out
 
p400 said:
I would like some info on how to lube a Mk3 swing arm please.
Click to expand...

How I did it was to extract the timing side welch plug (5) with a self tapping screw using that to pull out the welch plug, then removed the plug felt (12) as the outer felt (3) was missing!
With the bike on the side stand, filled the spindle drilling, oiled and fitted the timing side felts (new outer felt) and a new welch plug.
 
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