Mike Hailwood 1978

I suggest that anyone who comes up and competes at interrnational level is a member of a very talented group. I just question how it happens. If a guy rides motocross then goes almost directly to a 245bhp monster without going through a slower road race crash and burn stage , surely he must be a candidate for a wooden overcoat ? I suggest the process which Hailwood, Surtees and the rest of us went through years ago, cannot be simply by-passed without consequences. Meeting someone like Jeremy Burgess must be a very big help ?

acotrel said:

I suggest that anyone who comes up and competes at interrnational level is a member of a very talented group. I just question how it happens. If a guy rides motocross then goes almost directly to a 245bhp monster without going through a slower road race crash and burn stage , surely he must be a candidate for a wooden overcoat ? I suggest the process which Hailwood, Surtees and the rest of us went through years ago, cannot be simply by-passed without consequences. Meeting someone like Jeremy Burgess must be a very big help ?

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What you talking about ?

Almost all the folks in current MotoGP have come through the (old) 125 GP and 250 GP classes.
Name one who hasn't ?? or from the equivalent Superbikes and lower classes.
(A lot who didn't make it in MotoGP or the old GP500's went back to Superbikes...)

Shortly be a few stepping up from the Moto2 and even Moto3 classes.
Some young guns to watch....

How very refreshing to see elite racers on skinny tires that don't need to hang their junk out in the air stream.

In Australia these days the 125 and 250 GP classes are defunct, and the young guys start out either on 600cc or 1000cc superbikes. There is a new Moto3 type class coming, and a couple of guys have bought the spec bike. It looks as thought it won't be a constructor's class where you could use an MX motor and an old RS125 frame. So if you want a competitive ride, you are looking at either the 600cc bike with a doubling of the price to cover the race kit, or the $24,000 Moto3 spec bike and a big budget. Where are the MotoGP riders going to come from ?

acotrel said:

In Australia these days the 125 and 250 GP classes are defunct, and the young guys start out either on 600cc or 1000cc superbikes. There is a new Moto3 type class coming, and a couple of guys have bought the spec bike. It looks as thought it won't be a constructor's class where you could use an MX motor and an old RS125 frame. So if you want a competitive ride, you are looking at either the 600cc bike with a doubling of the price to cover the race kit, or the $24,000 Moto3 spec bike and a big budget. Where are the MotoGP riders going to come from ?

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RE; Where are the MotoGP riders going to come from ?

From the Italians and the Spaniards as seems to be happening right now, because they alone appear to have national championships or similar, in the smaller classes of racing

GRM 450 said:

CS is a one off talent in my opinion, no matter how much he is criticised by people less talented.

Graeme

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Stoner succeeded in mastering the Ducati, a feat others failed to achieve, won Ducati's only grand prix world championship and backed that up by winning for Honda in 2011. He is some rider. A few quotes from the BBC MotoGP website:

Roberts: "He will go down as one of the best ever. Along with Dani Pedrosa and Jorge Lorenzo he has helped raise the level in MotoGP higher than it has ever been before.
"I think a large part of that has come from Casey raising the bar and, in particular, showing the rest that Valentino Rossi could be beaten."

Emmett: "Clearly he is one of the greatest motorcycle racers of all time, but for me he is possibly the one whose raw talent has made the biggest difference."

Spalding: "He is one of the all-time greats, up there with Mike Hailwood and Freddie Spencer for being able to ride a bike that is not set up perfectly way beyond the point that mere mortals say is the limit."

Aco - thanks for posting that footage of Surtees racing in Australia - nice find and great to watch. Still the only man to have won both Grand Prix and Formula One world championships, and a gentleman.

A friend of mine (John Maher) was in those races at Amaroo. He said that Surtees had stood up on the footpegs during one race leaned down and looked back between his legs. As a rider, Surtees is amazingly smooth and competent. I know Casey Stoner is great, and we are all proud of him, however s ome of those old TT riders had come up through really hard racing over decades. 'You can't put an old head on young shoulders', if you've ever raced against anyone like Surtees or even any other aged international rider , you find out they have more moves than a cat. I had to laugh at one young guy we have racing here in Australia. His name is Keith Campbell, and he is the nephew of the rider who was in Europe in the fifties ( Geoff Duke is also his uncle). Young Keith is superb in historic racing. One day he, and his father George were both on bikes on a circuit. Keith was amazed when his father blitzed him.

acotrel said:

Where are the MotoGP riders going to come from ?

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Same place Stoner, Lorenzo, Pedrosa, etc etc have come from.
As someone already said, the Superbike and GrandPrix riding schools in England and Spain.

Wasn't it mentioned that Wayne Gardners son(s) are in Spain, doing precisely that...

If the GP keeps getting numbed down like it seems to be year after year and getting closer the SBK new riders may come from superbike and production racing?
It's a sad thing that money and TV time is/seems to be, the most important thing for the promoters of GP and SBK.
There must be some talented riders that never get a chance due to where they live, lack of $ and sponsorship.

I suggest the moving from Motocross to an R6 is big financial and capability jump. A while back we had two stroke 250 and 350 production racers. These days we don't have that type of racing. A very few years ago we lost Liam Mcgee at Mallala - fell off a superbike in a straight line, and slid a couple of hundred metres into a guard rail. The cause was said to be the 'qualifier tyre' on the rear of his bike. I believe that progress towards the top should be slower than that. I watched that Fastest 2011 video, and it almost turned me off racing. I don't race much these days, but I still ride OK, and still know how to survive.
Interesting about Wayne Gardner. I watched a video where he had his first ride on a manx. After he pulled up, his eyes were watering, and he said ' I never knew what they were riding'. You can be just as dead falling off a 52bhp manx as off a 250bhp Honda, and with the Honda, the crash might actually be less likely to happen ?