I Think I am Ruined

Over the past few days we have had some awesome riding weather here in North Texas. I have made the most of it taking a bike out almost every day. The Norton is ready to go but I have been taking the easy way and riding the Moto Guzzi. It has electric start.

The Norton starts fine on first or at least the second kick. The last time I had it out I was on my way back and actually quite close to the house when, on a down hill run, the Norton flamed out. It acted like the idle was low and then just stopped. I tried to bump it off but ran out of momentum. I coasted to a stop. Put the bike on the stand and kicked until I thought I would get sick. I kicked and kicked with no relight. Then I pulled the choke on just a bit (I have never had to use the choke on a Norton) and it fired up. So now I have been taking the easy way out and riding the Guzzi.

The bike seems to idle higher when hot. It is running reworked Amal 932s with a Pazon Electronic Ignition. I have not set the ignition thinking that Debby knew her stuff but I do want to check everything with a degree wheel since the primary side timing marks tend to be inaccurate.

It just kind of kills my enjoyment of the ride since I have a dodgy knee and kicking aggravates the heck out of it.

Sorry , absent minded with fingers , didn’t realize I had touched the like then didn’t know how to remove … I’m sure once carbs and cleaned , balanced ,& timing confirmed you will be enjoying the Norton again , on the nice ride days ….

If it was starting good (one or two kicks) the ignition side of things shouldn't be the problem....Then stopped applied choke and started again.......fuel restriction issue

Im sure if you pull a few whellies & drop a few burnouts , to show it WHO's BOSS , It'll behave itself again .

ACTUALLY , unless youve rewired it , theres a thousand devious traps in store . A BASIC set ups best .

But sounds like maybe air leaks or gook in the induction assy's .

timing with a strobe will be good enough using existing scale.

It's never a good thing to have your confidence in a bike undermined by a random failure like this.
My first port of call has always been to check the pilot jets are clear, as they can get blocked so easily.

B+Bogus said:

It's never a good thing to have your confidence in a bike undermined by a random failure like this.
My first port of call has always been to check the pilot jets are clear, as they can get blocked so easily.

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Your ignition contacts are in trouble . Replace . Clean up all wires too.

Torontonian said:

Your ignition contacts are in trouble . Replace . Clean up all wires too.

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No points (ignition contacts)....he has a Pazon.

Old or aging gas....

B+Bogus said:

It's never a good thing to have your confidence in a bike undermined by a random failure like this.
My first port of call has always been to check the pilot jets are clear, as they can get blocked so easily.

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If the pilot jets are plugged up then it wouldn't idle? The carb balance has been checked. Debby did tell me that she always had trouble with it restarting after a long ride. I like the idea of checking for an air leak. That would make sense if I had to apply choke to get it to light.

Tank not breathing? Vacuum lock? Fuel flow to carbs? Clogged shutoffs?

Big_Jim59 said:

Then I pulled the choke on just a bit (I have never had to use the choke on a Norton) and it fired up.

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Please explain what you mean. The first 90% of the rotation adds no choke. If you really went from choke full open to closing it a little, you did nothing and it is a coincidence that it started.

I've had several flame outs while going downhill. Typically with y hiRider 9 Litre tank with less than 1/2 a full tank. Maybe four or five times and once with the Roadster tank with less fuel. Fuel slosh away from tank ports obviously.

If hot start problems or higher idle when hot are happening, i'd suspect carbs are getting warm/hot and leading to fuel vapours percolating up the fuel lines. I run clear fuel filters and can see this effect when hot and idling at a stop light. If similar is happening in float bowl, fuel metering at idle circuits will most likely be going leaner, increasing rpms. Next time bike is hot and stopped more than a minute, try feeling float bowls for heat. Should not be much more than luke warm.
Try running a thicker insulator (there are thin and thick ones available on line) between manifolds and head.

Tornado said:

I've had several flame outs while going downhill. Typically with y hiRider 9 Litre tank with less than 1/2 a full tank. Maybe four or five times and once with the Roadster tank with less fuel. Fuel slosh away from tank ports obviously.

If hot start problems or higher idle when hot are happening, i'd suspect carbs are getting warm/hot and leading to fuel vapours percolating up the fuel lines. I run clear fuel filters and can see this effect when hot and idling at a stop light. If similar is happening in float bowl, fuel metering at idle circuits will most likely be going leaner, increasing rpms. Next time bike is hot and stopped more than a minute, try feeling float bowls for heat. Should not be much more than luke warm.
Try running a thicker insulator (there are thin and thick ones available on line) between manifolds and head.

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This sounds reasonable. I think it's running the thin insulators. I will check it out.

OK, so I looked closely at the carbs tonight. There is no traditional phenolic block between the head and the carburetor manifold. There is what looks like a black rubber gasket that is maybe .10" thick and there seems to be a smear of hardened gasket sealer around it. I see no gasket between the carb and the manifold. I need to take it for a long ride and feel the carbs for excessive heat.

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Big_Jim59 said:

OK, so I looked closely at the carbs tonight. There is no traditional phenolic block between the head and the carburetor manifold. There is what looks like a black rubber gasket that is maybe .10" thick and there seems to be a smear of hardened gasket sealer around it. I see no gasket between the carb and the manifold. I need to take it for a long ride and feel the carbs for excessive heat.

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Between the carb and manifold, there should only be an o-ring. Having the heat insulator between the manifold and head is important.

I have ordered two new phenolic insulators and will replace whatever is on there now with the proper item. Even if it doesn't fix the hard restart issue it can't hurt to install the part that was designed to fit there. I am sure it is very important or the cost conscious factory would have used a cheaper alternative.