Hello from Norton UK

Sorry to tell you this but Norton who made bikes which competed successfully around the Isle of Man and every other circuit is dead.

The corpse was mashed up into NVT as though by combining three previously great brands a new one would magically appear with no investment, development or forward thinking.

Norton is just a name. No more than that. As motorcyclists with a sense of history we have respect for the history of the name and would not want it to be debased like the AJS name. Great little bikes but worthy of the AJS name? We want really great bikes so people will respect them carrying the Norton name.

To achieve this we need a modern company with money and commitment to the brand - I really hope that TVS can achieve that as it's the best chance we have. Just be grateful that the Norton badge is not on the side of some cheaply made low-tech scooter. It could so very easily have happened and if TVS fail it would almost certainly happen.

We have great bikes with the 961. Yes they need work to keep them running but as a community we can do that.

So if we can get some spares from TVS then it's a bonus. A bad attitude towards New New Norton is as much use as shouting at the rain clouds to stop the rain.; it achieves nothing and to continue the analogy time is better spent finding an umbrella.
 
Clive said:
Sorry to tell you this but Norton who made bikes which competed successfully around the Isle of Man and every other circuit is dead.

The corpse was mashed up into NVT as though by combining three previously great brands a new one would magically appear with no investment, development or forward thinking.

Norton is just a name. No more than that. As motorcyclists with a sense of history we have respect for the history of the name and would not want it to be debased like the AJS name. Great little bikes but worthy of the AJS name? We want really great bikes so people will respect them carrying the Norton name.

To achieve this we need a modern company with money and commitment to the brand - I really hope that TVS can achieve that as it's the best chance we have. Just be grateful that the Norton badge is not on the side of some cheaply made low-tech scooter. It could so very easily have happened and if TVS fail it would almost certainly happen.

We have great bikes with the 961. Yes they need work to keep them running but as a community we can do that.

So if we can get some spares from TVS then it's a bonus. A bad attitude towards New New Norton is as much use as shouting at the rain clouds to stop the rain.; it achieves nothing and to continue the analogy time is better spent finding an umbrella.
Click to expand...
Agreed, except I think the name, badge and history can carry on with some real meaning as long as Birminghan Norton (BN) succeed, with appropriate model choices and potentially race again. Particularly if they carry on with the UK based manufacture.

Now I know some will view that as rose tinted bullshit because of the (very) slow start. But why? SG might have been a crook but he saw the obvious value of the history and in racing Norton. He could so very easily have succeeded in this very competitive industry if he had ‘played with a straight bat’ and surrounded himself with the right people. So if SG could have succeeded on a comparative shoestring, who knows what BN (backed by TVS) can do - if public opinion doesn’t bury them before they‘re born.

TVS are well aware of the value of the history angle and will (eventually) lean on it as heavily as possible. Not sure they can do that if they leap straight into EV’s though. Much of that link to history would be lost with the leap in technology. As such I don’t think they will abandon ICE for some time to come.

The main reason the 961 is so special IMO is the modern slant on the heritage aesthetic and the use of the original configuration (air cooled, push rod, parralel twin). Looks like a Norton, sounds like a Norton, feels like a Norton. They clearly intend to continue this with the new 961, whatever that ends up looking like. I for one hope that they succeed.

Put down rose tinted glasses, pick up tea, gaze at beautiful 961 and wait for it to stop raining:rolleyes:!
 
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Well Stephen, you have an actual cause…

Previous conversations about people ‘being negative’ have been a bit subjective IMHO as it usually amounted to simple frustration and usually ended, at worst, in people falling out of love and selling their Norton.

But now we have a genuine negative champion, calling on Norton enthusiasts to bring down Norton !

Oh well, it takes all sorts I guess.
 
For me, the biggest problem for an EV with Norton on the 'tank' is fundamentally it's still an EV, and at my age that's a strange step to contemplate. Just sitting on a Zero at the local dealers felt 'wrong', as fingers groped for the clutch lever (and it did feel a tad 'top heavy').

But hopefully that's just the 'fossil' talking, those younger or more adventurous won't be so reticent.
(And it leaves their left hand free to play with the phone :-) )
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
The main reason the 961 is so special IMO is the modern slant on the heritage aesthetic and the use of the original configuration (air cooled, push rod, parralel twin). Looks like a Norton, sounds like a Norton, feels like a Norton. They clearly intend to continue this with the new 961, whatever that ends up looking like. I for one hope that they succeed.
Click to expand...
So special to who?
The very few who have one? Or the even fewer who have one that’s trouble free and don’t need spare parts?

If the 961 is so special, why hasn’t TVS made them and sold them like hot cakes?
It’s only been 3 years since TVS took over.
 
The problem with going Motorcycle EV is where is the differentiation, the electric motors are electric motors without all the ICE variation and the rest is bought in, wheels. tyres, Brembo brakes, Ohlin's suspension and all the electrics. The only thing left is the frame which is then hidden by the fairing.
 
I think the report of the end of ICE vehicle is greatly exaggerated.
This winter is show many just how important fossil fuels still are, and how woefully inadequate "clean" energy solutions are able to take over the job.
Battery powered vehicles are a stop gap solution at best. EVs are not going to be an actual solution until hydrogen fuel cells are ready for general deployment in EVs. This will eliminate the need for all the toxic materials in batteries, and disposal of the nasty materials in land fills. The reason many EV bikes feel top heavy is because of the large batteries required to get even an acceptable range from a charge.

Motorcycle manufacturers will use standard electric motors in their EVs true, until engineers and scientists are able to innovate and develop more efficient and more powerful designs. Then each manufacturer will have their own unique power units, which will be equivalent to their own unique ICE designs. We just can't see this now because most companies use standard EV motors, but that will change. Auto and motorcycle companies will always be pushing for an advantage over their competitors.

Also, with EVs and hydrogen fuel cells, manufacturers will be free to experiment with other chassis concepts, like hub steering designs, possibly something Yamaha has experimented with, driving the front wheel hydraulically, two wheel drive motorcycles. We can't see these possibilities because many of us are wedded to the designs of the past that we are familiar with. Engineers will be pushing the envelope of what is possible.
 
Voodooo said:
So special to who?
The very few who have one? Or the even fewer who have one that’s trouble free and don’t need spare parts?
If the 961 is so special, why hasn’t TVS made them and sold them like hot cakes?
It’s only been 3 years since TVS took over.
Click to expand...

So special to who? You bought two!! ;)

961 for VooDoo.jpg
 
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BritTwit said:
I think the report of the end of ICE vehicle is greatly exaggerated.
This winter is show many just how important fossil fuels still are, and how woefully inadequate "clean" energy solutions are able to take over the job.
Battery powered vehicles are a stop gap solution at best. EVs are not going to be an actual solution until hydrogen fuel cells are ready for general deployment in EVs. This will eliminate the need for all the toxic materials in batteries, and disposal of the nasty materials in land fills. The reason many EV bikes feel top heavy is because of the large batteries required to get even an acceptable range from a charge.

Motorcycle manufacturers will use standard electric motors in their EVs true, until engineers and scientists are able to innovate and develop more efficient and more powerful designs. Then each manufacturer will have their own unique power units, which will be equivalent to their own unique ICE designs. We just can't see this now because most companies use standard EV motors, but that will change. Auto and motorcycle companies will always be pushing for an advantage over their competitors.

Also, with EVs and hydrogen fuel cells, manufacturers will be free to experiment with other chassis concepts, like hub steering designs, possibly something Yamaha has experimented with, driving the front wheel hydraulically, two wheel drive motorcycles. We can't see these possibilities because many of us are wedded to the designs of the past that we are familiar with. Engineers will be pushing the envelope of what is possible.
Click to expand...
Have to agree BT. I don’t doubt that Norton has intent to develop EV bikes and that may already have commenced, but that’s not gonna be where they start production. It doesn’t harm the bottom line talking EV of course; I’m sure there’s government funding for such endeavours.
 
BritTwit said:
I think the report of the end of ICE vehicle is greatly exaggerated.
This winter is show many just how important fossil fuels still are, and how woefully inadequate "clean" energy solutions are able to take over the job.
Battery powered vehicles are a stop gap solution at best. EVs are not going to be an actual solution until hydrogen fuel cells are ready for general deployment in EVs. This will eliminate the need for all the toxic materials in batteries, and disposal of the nasty materials in land fills. The reason many EV bikes feel top heavy is because of the large batteries required to get even an acceptable range from a charge.

Motorcycle manufacturers will use standard electric motors in their EVs true, until engineers and scientists are able to innovate and develop more efficient and more powerful designs. Then each manufacturer will have their own unique power units, which will be equivalent to their own unique ICE designs. We just can't see this now because most companies use standard EV motors, but that will change. Auto and motorcycle companies will always be pushing for an advantage over their competitors.

Also, with EVs and hydrogen fuel cells, manufacturers will be free to experiment with other chassis concepts, like hub steering designs, possibly something Yamaha has experimented with, driving the front wheel hydraulically, two wheel drive motorcycles. We can't see these possibilities because many of us are wedded to the designs of the past that we are familiar with. Engineers will be pushing the envelope of what is possible.
Click to expand...
Has this already been posted or did I just miss it?

www.techradar.com

TVS-owned Norton unveils electric motorcycle project - All details here

Thanks to significant investment from UK govt
www.techradar.com www.techradar.com
 
Gojuu said:
@Stephen_Spencer is this like some instagram photoshop filter thing, where in reality your bike really isn't thaaaaaat clean?
Click to expand...
No Gj, it was actually quite dirty that day - it’s usually much cleaner than that:oops:! The aim is to dazzle and distract other road users to get out of my way! Plus, you know, cleaning Norton = drinking beer. Win, win!
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
No Gj, it was actually quite dirty that day - it’s usually much cleaner than that:oops:! The aim is to dazzle and distract other road users to get out of my way! Plus, you know, cleaning Norton = drinking beer. Win, win!
Click to expand...
You photoshopped in the background too didn't you? This is actually a photo of a CFMoto isn't it?
 
Of course a well-used bike is a thing of real beauty and respect for the owner. Same principle behind Fender's 'Relic' distressed guitar range. Do Norton need someone to pre-age bikes for them so they can charge more? ;)
1664521242279.png
 
Voodooo said:
Correct I bought two. But less than 3000 were made in total and sold world wide.
Why haven’t more sold and why is TVS procrastinating on spreading the news?
Not to mention, lacking in producing them if the 961 is so special?
Click to expand...
703DDDC0-C3FE-412A-B0E2-41BE4129578D.jpeg


Ah Voodoo my friend, just an idea - maybe stop hard boiling yer eggs and smashin em with a lump hammer! It may not be doing your stress levels any good and it’s certainly a waste of eggs!

The payout for patience is imminent IMO! I can feel it in my waters - well, after a few beers anyway!:D
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
View attachment 99800

Ah Voodoo my friend, just an idea - maybe stop hard boiling yer eggs and smashin em with a lump hammer! It may not be doing your stress levels any good and it’s certainly a waste of eggs!

The payout for patience is imminent IMO! I can feel it in my waters - well, after a few beers anyway!:D
Click to expand...
SS, I eat 9 unfertilized, free range eggs a day. Scrambled. Delicately whipped without milk.
Picked from my own chickens.

I don’t eat fertilized eggs, therefore I get the chicken after it hatches. And that same chicken will provide me with more eggs. Then later in it’s life, meat.

Many great accomplishments have been achieved in a man’s life in far less time then 3 years.

I have a feeling that come the NEC show, TVS will give it a new meaning.
NEC. Not Even Close to producing a motorcycle.
 
Clive said:
Of course a well-used bike is a thing of real beauty and respect for the owner. Same principle behind Fender's 'Relic' distressed guitar range. Do Norton need someone to pre-age bikes for them so they can charge more? ;)
View attachment 99801
Click to expand...
If Jimi Hendrix rode a 961 it would be collectable like 63 strat. You need the immortals to use worn out instruments before they are popular with the general public. SRV
 
Clive said:
Of course a well-used bike is a thing of real beauty and respect for the owner. Same principle behind Fender's 'Relic' distressed guitar range. Do Norton need someone to pre-age bikes for them so they can charge more? ;)
View attachment 99801
Click to expand...
Sorry Clive, think that's not the best analogy.
Relic'd instruments are bought by poseurs trying to kid the rest of the world they've got history...
They are not 'well used'
 

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