Grabbing front disc brake

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Fitting new soft pads may help improve things , but the stock Norton pad does suffer from lack of actual friction surface

Really there is not much pad choice available for the stock Calliper Ferodo / EBC and Non Branded Taiwan pads seem to be the only options fitted with a good cast iron disc they can be made to work
But don't forget the Commando brake system is from the 1970`s when disc brake technology was new to motorcycles not current superbike standards

Another thing to check is pad thickness ideally new pads should require the pistons to be pushed fully back and just have clearance between the friction material and rotor
if there is a big void here it may give poor brake feel as pistons have further to travel requiring more fluid movement to apply pressure , worn pads are also less efficient at dissipating heat
than a set of new full thickness pads

If you are looking for better performance a big brake kit is needed with a multi piston type calliper
 
kiwi said:
Fitting new soft pads may help improve things , but the stock Norton pad does suffer from lack of actual friction surface

Really there is not much pad choice available for the stock Calliper Ferodo / EBC and Non Branded Taiwan pads seem to be the only options fitted with a good cast iron disc they can be made to work
But don't forget the Commando brake system is from the 1970`s when disc brake technology was new to motorcycles not current superbike standards

Another thing to check is pad thickness ideally new pads should require the pistons to be pushed fully back and just have clearance between the friction material and rotor
if there is a big void here it may give poor brake feel as pistons have further to travel requiring more fluid movement to apply pressure , worn pads are also less efficient at dissipating heat
than a set of new full thickness pads

If you are looking for better performance a big brake kit is needed with a multi piston type calliper

Thanks Kiwi
I appreciate this info. Brake feel on my MkIII is good and stopping ability is not bad.
But if I change the set up, what calliper and disc combination would you suggest?
pete.v gave me good advice but I would be interested to know your recommendations.
 
Phil

It all depends on your budget and weather you have access to a machine shop

If you are looking for a straight forward bolt on road upgrade kit use either the RGM OR NORVIL 12" floating disc
I think they both use the superior Lockheed Race type Caliper and the increased disc rotor diameter applies better leverage to stop safely on road tyres

if you want to keep costs down source a floating Norton disc rotor ( or make your own disc carrier using a common donor Jap disc rotor of the required diameter ) use a Nissin brake Caliper or similar
then make your own bespoke mounting bracket from billet alloy , if you look at most sports bike front ends late 1990`s era most use either the Nissin or Tokico caliper with bolt on mounting brackets
check your pad fitment guides Honda Kawasaki Yamaha for a common pad fitment as you often get better choice of compounds HH / sintered / Ceramic Etc

I did a similar conversion a few years back picking up a virtually new Nissin 4 pot caliper and master cylinder from an auto jumble for £40.00 / $60.00 US and made my own mounting brackets
for a fraction of the cost
 
kiwi said:
Phil

It all depends on your budget and weather you have access to a machine shop

If you are looking for a straight forward bolt on road upgrade kit use either the RGM OR NORVIL 12" floating disc
I think they both use the superior Lockheed Race type Caliper and the increased disc rotor diameter applies better leverage to stop safely on road tyres

if you want to keep costs down source a floating Norton disc rotor ( or make your own disc carrier using a common donor Jap disc rotor of the required diameter ) use a Nissin brake Caliper or similar
then make your own bespoke mounting bracket from billet alloy , if you look at most sports bike front ends late 1990`s era most use either the Nissin or Tokico caliper with bolt on mounting brackets
check your pad fitment guides Honda Kawasaki Yamaha for a common pad fitment as you often get better choice of compounds HH / sintered / Ceramic Etc

I did a similar conversion a few years back picking up a virtually new Nissin 4 pot caliper and master cylinder from an auto jumble for £40.00 / $60.00 US and made my own mounting brackets
for a fraction of the cost

Thanks again Kiwi for all of this. You should be in bed, some two hours ahead of me or maybe three. I should be too but still working.

I will look into all of this. I can live with my brake but it could be oh so much better. Having bikes with twin discs absolutely spoils you. The BMW R1100GS front brake used to haul that massive hunk of machinery down like nobody's business. That thing fell over once on slippery grass. It nearly required a crane to upright it. Multi hernia material.

As I mentioned, MC is already modified and also brake line is S/S.
pete.v gave me similar advice as yours.

Expense is not a problem. Not after paying $22,000 for the bike landed in Sydney from the USA. Completely re built by Baxters in Iowa. They are currently building my next one. I may ask them for the same brake mods before it leaves the workshop.
 
I will say this, I removed the chrome from my front disc and it is butt ugly,however,with my new Magura 12.7 master cylinder the brakes work very well now.....PhillySkip
 
nnnrh said:
Thank you gents, the inside of my disc does have a rust patch but this is not the part of the disc that grabs. I guess it must be slightly warped. Secondly is there a minimum thickness discs can be ground to. My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????

RE; "My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????[/quote]

sounds like your pistons in the caliper on the motor are sticking on – but I could be wrong
 
Bernhard said:
nnnrh said:
Thank you gents, the inside of my disc does have a rust patch but this is not the part of the disc that grabs. I guess it must be slightly warped. Secondly is there a minimum thickness discs can be ground to. My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????

RE; "My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????

sounds like your pistons in the caliper on the motor are sticking on – but I could be wrong[/quote]

My ex wife drove a Landrover I bought her. Somehow she managed to melt the brakes. Drove with flat tyres when I was away with work for days. Ran it with no water, little oil and frequently ran out of petrol. She would chuck her cigarette butts out the window and they would blow back in the rear window and put burn holes in the rear seat. It was so full of trash you could not even sit in the passenger seat. There were coke bottles everywhere (which rolled out of those idiot sloping front floors) and more ciggy packets than the shop where she bought them.

The boot section was full of unimaginable dog equipment and dog fur replaced the once attractive material seats. I think there were a few dogs running around with cigarette burns too. Too many dogs to mention, who took their turn riding around slobbering all over the fur lined seats. I never actually liked the Landrover very much and mostly stuck with riding my combat when I was home. It was kept immaculately.

I think that car cost me close to $50,000 new.
A few short years later I came back with $8000 from the car auctions.
She said she wanted another one, to start all over again. I just got on the combat and took off in despair.
I just can't remember what happened next. Being the very best time of my life, joy flooded and blanked my memory.

I remember selling my combat with its Lockheed calliper that never helped much. We swapped it to MkIII side to stop the steering left issue, and it did that completely, but still didn't stop. I wanted $8500 for it to cope with the Landrover loss. Way too cheap considering all the goodies that Pete and I had fitted. I put it in the Mittagong bike shop showroom for display and sale.
One Friday night at the Berrima pub a pissy looking chap I had never seen before lurched up to me and said I want that Norton of yours, I've seen it in the shop and they tell me here you are the owner. He thrust a $5 note in my hand and said that's the deposit. I thought he was joking and thought little of it. But next day he rocked up at the shop with a cheque for $8495 and took of on my beautiful hand built combat. It made me cry but it was gone forever. He never understood what a beautiful piece of motorbike he now owned. Nearly a year later on a Friday night I watched it being thrashed to death up and down in front of the Berrima pub, with blokes taking turns to do it. I felt completely sick and had to go home.

I believe the bike now lives in QLD with an owner who loves it and would never sell it. I know because I tracked it down and wanted to buy it back not long ago. I was told, don't bother trying, he'll never part with it. At least it is now in good hands. Probably the best built Commando I have ever owned, went like stink and never leaked any oil. Pete was a brilliant Norton builder.

The front brake never grabbed, not partially or fully, we all know what non upgraded Commando disc brakes can be like. Not Pete's fault. I got what I asked for and could have upgraded it but didn't. I call my MkIII my best Commando ever, not because it's built better than Pete could do, probably not as good. But I really love the MkIII model. The more I think about my front brake, the more I think it is actually pretty good. I wish Pete was here to see the bike, I know he would have pointed out a number of short falls, but overall I think he would be impressed.
 
Just one thing to add. Pete actually came out to the farm before I sold the Norton. He was pretty pragmatic.
He told me if the combat has to go, so be it.

I only saw him one more time. I later learnt he vowed never to return. The ex wife had been so rude to him he wrote her off. I never saw this happen. I was so used to her being incredibly rude to my friends (few ever returned) I thought it was normal. I had known Pete over thirty years due our Norton interest and association. He never told me what he thought of my girlfriend/ then wife. He was far too polite to ever do that. We just discussed Nortons.
 
The combat Pete built me was not really a combat. It was a hybrid like pete.v owns. It had an 850 frame and we swapped the disc to left leg with Lockheed racing calliper. Alloy wheels, better engine breathing system and all sorts of extras and modifications. We fitted a 20T sprocket but later changed that to 19T. It never broke down and went like a rocket. Pete had tricked the motor up beyond combat specs with a hot cam and on the Wombeyan Caves road it went straight to 100mph without blinking. Beyond that the single Mikuni had it breathing hard but top speed was not my concern. What I really loved was riding it around town. The stainless steel hardly baffled peashooters let out a beautiful snarl each time you changed up. People heard it first then saw it. I blasted off everything in sight at the lights and would ride back to the farm with a big grin on my face. Satisfied with yet again another day's killing. It was a BRG (my choice) Roadster and at the Berrima pub it was the envy of every other motorcyclist I knew. It was a deadly machine.

The only trouble I ever had was using that Shell high octane fuel they called Ultramax or something similar. One day it just would not start, which was tiring because you could hardly swing the kick lever down at the best of times with it's extremely high compression. I went to see the local mechanic Paul who later started Southern Highlands Motorcycles and blew the Bowral bike shop (where he had worked before a bad fall out) into the dirt. I have dealt with Paul at SH Motorcycles since its inception. Anyway Paul asked me regarding the no starting, what fuel are you running? When I told him he said get that shit out of it, I'll bet it will start then. So I took off the carbi bowl and yellow gunk looking fuel flowed (slowly) out. I then drained the tank and put fresh fuel in. It started first kick and I was off and running again. The requirement to sell it was tragic but these things happen.
 
While it sounds like you don't care to keep the quasi-original look, I had the chrome Blanchard-ground of of mine 'til it ran true, painted it silver Argent (almost original looking), then carefully lowered the caliper over the disc so as to not scratch the paint from the edge. Once in place, the brake was pumped to bring the pads into contact with the rotor, which promptly removed the paint only where the pads touch. That way, none of the rest of the face will rust.
To help increase the braking force, Ferodo FDB 88P pads were added http://www.ebay.com/itm/NORTON-750-850- ... b0&vxp=mtr and a 12mm master cylinder retrofitted. It's pretty much a two-finger affair at this point.
 
Nater_Potater said:
While it sounds like you don't care to keep the quasi-original look, I had the chrome Blanchard-ground of of mine 'til it ran true, painted it silver Argent (almost original looking), then carefully lowered the caliper over the disc so as to not scratch the paint from the edge. Once in place, the brake was pumped to bring the pads into contact with the rotor, which promptly removed the paint only where the pads touch. That way, none of the rest of the face will rust.
To help increase the braking force, Ferodo FDB 88P pads were added http://www.ebay.com/itm/NORTON-750-850- ... b0&vxp=mtr and a 12mm master cylinder retrofitted. It's pretty much a two-finger affair at this point.

A two fingered affair?
Mine is certainly not that good.
What is the standard MkIII MC mm size? Mine is sleeved down to I don't know what. Don Huff at Baxters is their Commando rebuild guru and will be doing my next. I'll email Don to check out what he takes them down to.
First info I've had re optional pads and will check it out.

Thanks Nathan
 
phil yates said:
Bernhard said:
nnnrh said:
Thank you gents, the inside of my disc does have a rust patch but this is not the part of the disc that grabs. I guess it must be slightly warped. Secondly is there a minimum thickness discs can be ground to. My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????

RE; "My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????

sounds like your pistons in the caliper on the motor are sticking on – but I could be wrong

My ex wife drove a Landrover I bought her. Somehow she managed to melt the brakes. quote]

I take it she didn’t learn to heel & toe the brake & accelerator pedal :?: :shock: :(
 
quote]

RE; "My wives car seems to need new discs every so often as the service people tell me they are too thin for any more grinding????[/quote]

sounds like your pistons in the caliper on the motor are sticking on – but I could be wrong[/quote]

My ex wife drove a Landrover I bought her. Somehow she managed to melt the brakes. quote]

I take it she didn’t learn to heel & toe the brake & accelerator pedal :?: :shock: :([/quote]

Not in the car.
She used to heel and toe me all around the house. Couldn't heel and toe a horse and certainly I never let her practise on my precious combat. But she could kick like a mule on steroids!
 
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