Fireflake blue again

Thickness of the lettering on Norton decals seems to vary on various brochures ?
More than one supplier - or different batches ?
Or artists efforts....
The 73 ones used thinner letters, it seems.
And was P/N 063179 for Silver 850 'Norton' decal.

And the blue paint in the filler area of Mikes tank ?
Pinstriping seems quite high too, usually followed quite close along the tank/knee area crease line ?

Note that in that brochure you link, page 2, the 850 Blue Roadster says 'in Pacific Blue'.

I have to agree with Mike and Les on this one. The blue paint in the filler area is exactly as my 750 tank is. The decal and stripes I can't say since mine is a 750. However, as the stripes were hand painted they probably varied quite a bit. And when I tried to buy replacement decals for the side covers in '74 the only thing available were the die-cut type as on Mike's tank. My '73 750 came with the one piece decals. The tank decals have survived, but the one-piece side cover decals curled and peeled after about a year. The 850's may have had die-cuts from day one. I have never seen an 850 with the one-piece decal. But then again, I never saw an 850 with fiberglass side covers.

Ron L said:

And when I tried to buy replacement decals for the side covers in '74 the only thing available were the die-cut type as on Mike's tank.

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That part is definitely right.
My 73 850 had the vinyl stickers - which you are calling die-cuts. ?
I bought replacements for it in 1977.
But as the 1973 part number - which I quote above - which had noticeably thinner letters than Mikes tank shows.

Still have some, somewhere - wonder if they measure the same.

Rohan said:

Note that in that brochure you link, page 2, the 850 Blue Roadster says 'in Pacific Blue'.

Click to expand...

I think we've been here before? :wink:
blue-metalflake-850s-again-t13309.html

Anyway, according to the parts books, '73/'74 850 Roadster "Blue" is "Fireflake Royal Blue".

Personally, I wouldn't want to bet my life savings either way on a particular decal or a fibreglass panel being absolutely "right" or "wrong" but I think perhaps this may be a case of finding fault where there may be none?

Personally, I wouldn't want to bet my life savings either way on a particular decal or a fibreglass panel being absolutely "right" or "wrong" but I think perhaps this may be a case of finding fault where there may be none?

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I totally agree Les. We all know that Norton often simply used what part was in the bin at the time.

Maybe.
But if that tank was on a new Commando in the showroom, with that decal and decal placement and pinstripe location, I'd be a little disappointed.

I've an Interstate tank that was taken off a new bike.
Supposedly with a leak - but all I could fault it for was a few paint bubbles. (which have increased over time...)


This is a Mk1A, note decals - and lighter shade of blue (??)

L.A.B. said:

Rohan said:

Note that in that brochure you link, page 2, the 850 Blue Roadster says 'in Pacific Blue'.

Click to expand...

I think we've been here before? :wink:
blue-metalflake-850s-again-t13309.html

Anyway, according to the parts books, '73/'74 850 Roadster "Blue" is "Fireflake Royal Blue".

Personally, I wouldn't want to bet my life savings either way on a particular decal or a fibreglass panel being absolutely "right" or "wrong" but I think perhaps this may be a case of finding fault where there may be none?

Click to expand...

Quite so.
But until that 'consult your dealer for color options' page turns up, we'll probably be there again....

Rohan said:

This is a Mk1A, note decals - and lighter shade of blue (??)

Click to expand...

Or the colour variation could be due to lighting, camera exposure time, type of film or the brochure printing process? :roll:

The 850 Mk.1A parts supplement also gives Roadster 'Blue' as: "FF Royal Blue" :wink:

L.A.B. said:

Or the colour variation could be due to lighting, camera exposure time, type of film or the brochure printing process?

Click to expand...

Or all of the above.
The same brochure has a (much) darker blue Roadster on the cover.

L.A.B. said:

The 850 Mk.1A parts supplement also gives Roadster 'Blue' as: "FF Royal Blue"

Click to expand...

So thats not the answer either. Thanks.

Where are these 'consult your Dealer for color options' pages when you need them....

I know we can all agree on one thing...we all love Nortons. I was the 2nd owner of this bike,
and the sidecover and tank were original as My Uncle Purchased it. I have since put a highrider
tank and metal that has been repainted to be my "shiny" Norton. I also have kept another 1973
Norton 850 Commando that was purchased by my other Uncle the same day from Eddie Hill's Cycle Center
in Wichita Falls Texas in May of 1973. It was Originally Signal Red but has sunfaded into a gold color
and other than a full mechanical I am leaving it as I bought it.

If I get time this next week I will post pictures of both.

Mike

I can resist no longer!

This is my Mk IIA



The paint is House of Kolor F22, and an almost perfect match for the 4 different samples I've seen, although the original Norton flake is a shade finer. Colour-wise I'm more than happy with it.

I've still got Russ's paint chip - and I'll get it in the post back to you just as soon as I can find where my Wife put it.

I've yet to see a photograph which looks like the 'real' colour - a bit like photographing bluebells, apparently :wink:

There's that base paint again:



Andy,
I am not in a hurry over the chip. But it would seem it should be preserved for at least as long as people care about the original blue on a '74 Norton. I only wish now I would have done a color match on the base paint. I assume you had to choose a base paint for your project. An earlier post in this thread commented on black base providing the best result, but this was matching it to fiberglass. As has been discussed, that is a different process and a slightly different look.

So, just some general musings about matching colors. While I was searching for British Racing Green for my current project I read a thread from a Truimph TR4 forum. Apparently Triumph didn't record their paint code either. At a car meet, freshly painted cars lined up to parade past the opened trunk compartment of an original car to see who had gotten closest to the potentially unspoiled original paint. They discovered that bright sun and cloud cover yielded different results as to which car had achieved it. The conclusion was that if you really wanted to get it right, you had to do more than match the colors used but also the chemistry of the paint. This is a little over the top for me. As far as I am concerned it has either never been painted or it has. If it has, then all it really needs to do is capture the right feel. Because once it has been repainted it is no longer "factory". (If that is what you care about).

As for all the different colors of blue referred in Norton literature, I am not surprised a bit. In 1969 Ford had two colors of blue listed for some of its cars. Acapulco Blue and Hula Blue. They are identical paint codes. They may as well have called it Pacific Blue. Or Your Idea of Paradise Blue. Or maybe, What Will Sell The Most Cars Blue.

Russ

I can resist it no longer - I notice that RS Bike Paint Online list fireflake colors for Commandos
http://www.rsbikepaint.com/en-us/shop-p ... 2&26573=on
Fireflake Blue Pacific Shimmer Blue - extra metalflake required. Covering all bases by the sound of it !

Doesn't use a color basecoat, we notice.
Unfortunately they don't show the result either.
Or even what type of paints they are.
And can paints be posted through the mail ?
Anyone here tried their version ?

Yes, I noticed that basecoat blue color on the base of Mikes tank.
Note the silver/flake overspray around the edges underneath - factory, or a later repaint ?

I must say that 72westie's pic of the sidecover (below, again) is the best rendition of 850 fireflake blue I have seen around - that illustrates best the color I recall on a row of 850s new, in a showroom. (went there to buy some dommie parts - "dommie, whats that" ?). makes you want to reach out and feel if the flakes are real.

I'm wondering though if what we have most firmly established here is that Nortons versions of fireflake blue varied, considerably, over time. And probably batch to batch, and even bike to bike, as some have noted. Yes I know we started out with about the same conclusion... !

72westie's pic of 850 fireflake blue - best rendition of the color I can recall seeing...

Rohan said:

I can resist it no longer - I notice that RS Bike Paint Online list fireflake colors for Commandos
http://www.rsbikepaint.com/en-us/shop-p ... 2&26573=on
Fireflake Blue Pacific Shimmer Blue - extra metalflake required. Covering all bases by the sound of it !

I'm wondering though if what we have most firmly established here is that Nortons versions of fireflake blue varied, considerably, over time. And probably batch to batch, and even bike to bike, as some have noted. Yes I know we started out with about the same conclusion... !

Click to expand...

Well, I think I get it now, so what you are saying is that 'Pacific Blue' (which you seemed to think was a different shade to 'Fireflake Royal Blue') but, according to the RS list they are the same colour!

Or is Pacific Shimmer Blue another blue!

I have no idea whats what with all these blues. !
(Did I see sapphire blue mentioned for one of the 750's ?)
Where's that 'consult your Dealer for color options' page when you need it.
A whole set of them sure could be useful here...

I do know I like that version on the sidecover that 72westie showed.

I have just come across a fireflake blue fibreglass roadster tank, It seems that the flake is in a blue tinted gel coat
(it smells like polyester) over a blue that looks very similar to the underside of the steel tank above. Unfortunately it is under several coats of paint and has cracking so it cant really be restored, might be a useful reference to someone though, I might take a holesaw and get a sample out of it since it needs some repairs to the gel coat anyway

Any chance of a pic of the blue gelcoat bits ?

Cheesy said:

I
(it smells like polyester)

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It smells like polyester ?!

Explain a +40 year old polyester smell ?
Compared to what else it might smell like.
Like polish, for example...

Rohan said:

Any chance of a pic of the blue gelcoat bits ?

Cheesy said:

I
(it smells like polyester)

Click to expand...

It smells like polyester ?!

Explain a +40 year old polyester smell ?
Compared to what else it might smell like.
Like polish, for example...

Click to expand...

polyester resin has a very distinct smell when sanding it as opposed to say paint or an epoxy etc

I'll have to read the labels on the cans.
Most glass is polyester ?

Hows that pic going of the blue gelcoat/ flake bits...
The flakes, they are silver (aluminium) ?

Cheers.

Sanding Norton fiber tanks smells exactly like the old polyester fiber glass resin boats which ain't a solvent smell more like sun burnt plastic pungent odor with some grit to it. A lot of boats have metal flake gel coat.