Electrical power distribution
- Thread starter Roadrash
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Me likey the pc-8 fuse panel.
rpatton said:Is this what you meant? It looks pretty disorganized, but it's kinda like one's desk. Looks like a rat's nest to anybody else but you.Roadrash said:
I like the idea of cutting down on the wires and connectors on the frame. If I was going to do it again I'd get one of the better fuse blocks and use gasketed connectors. There's some heat shrink tubing at DigiKey that has a rubber-like pliability along with a heat activated adhesive. Much better than the stuff at the electronics store. Modern connections with gaskets are nice too. All this stuff is pricy and you don't even get to show it off. Also, i'd get correct color coded wires for the sake of posterity. If you never ride in the rain most of that stuff is probably not necessary.(After getting tailgated a few days ago that was the closest I've ever seen, I'd like to fix up a solenoid activated pressurized spray of artificial skunk essence.)
http://www.fuzeblocks.com/
http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/main.html
I think that's amazing looking. Shows how rushed I was to get the bike started. Those look like good supplier links, thanks, I wish Google had pointed me to them when I was stringing my wiring together. Oh well, winter is coming and I can get a lot (re)done by April.
I notice you have a couple relays stuffed in there. What merits a relay switch?
Did you etch that circuit board with all the eyelet connections yourself or is it off the shelf?
Here's an idea for your tail gaiters, just mount another one behind you and use one of those fancy relays to fire it :
Paul,Roadrash said:
When I started wiring my bike I wound up with exactly the same situation you did as far as needing a single source for a good ground. The circuit board was all I had sitting around. All you really would need is just an insulated post for ground. It might be better that running a ground to the headlight shell and going from there because maybe there's a chance it could arc across the steering head bearings, maybe not. That and an insulated switched source for power cleans up a lot of the extraneous wiring. Here's a good article by Tony Foale on relays. Check out his other M/C stuff. His books on motorcycle design are like texts on the subject, Vic Willoughby was his mentor. Now Mr. Foale's a big shot at a Segway.
http://www.tonyfoale.com/Articles/Ignition/Sidebar.htm
http://www.tonyfoale.com/Main.htm
That picture of the well armed bike reminds me of a thread on BritIron about 15 years ago. It was about motorcycle safety in traffic. Motorcycle cops and 1%'ers rarely ever get cut off or 'lefthand turned' into. One guy chimed in that he couldn't remember the last time anything happened to him since he put the scabbard on his forks. It was for his cane but still, the effect was useful.
beng said:
The British fuses of old use the blow rating in our manuals. The American fuses at AutoZone are continuous ratings.
35amp blow equals 17 amp continuous. Get the 15-20amp at AutoZone. Check out L.A.B.'s post on an earlier thread. A picture is worth a thousand words..
posting.php?mode=quote&f=1&t=16498&p=203511#pr203511
L.A.B. said:The original handbook "35A" fuse recommendation refers to the old Lucas system of rating fuses by the 'blow' amps.Mike T said:
Modern fuses are numbered using the continuous rating, so 35A blow = 17A continuous. Unless you use the old Lucas style 1.25"/30mm glass 35A fuses which are still available, then the nearest modern equivalent is either 15A or 20A.
http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/V ... /fuses.php
Said before but I agree your stuff looks very well done rpatton. And roadrash if you saw what my 73 wiring in my headlight looks like you would think yours clean! po did some funky stuff!!! Since all you guys seem to know a lot of this type of stuff, I found a left hand switch cluster from a modern Ducati I want to use that has all the right switches like turn signal etc but one says " mode "!!!! I might need to use that to turn my brights on, does anyone know if the " mode " function on a modern switch can be used to do that?? The Duck guys can't tell me! ( sorry! Don't mean to hyjack your thread roadrash but Im doing the same thing you are)!
texasSlick
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For anyone contemplating a complete re-wire job, here are some tips and suggestions:
1) make a schematic first. Follow Bengs advice regarding routing....try to be as efficient in wire use and inter-connections as possible. It is easier to change a wire with a pencil eraser than with a side cutter.
2) use wire gauge appropriate for the amps of the circuit. overkill leads to excessive bulk in a hurry. Wire ampacity depends on many things but stick to the schedule below and you will not have any meltdowns. All gauges noted are AWG
10 ga. 30 amps
12. 20
14. 15
16. 12
18. 10
20. 7.5
22. 5
24. 3
3) try to stay with conventional wire colors, especially for hot and ground.
4) a wire number or color remains the same if its function does not change. For ex. ground is ground everywhere and should be the same number or color everywhere. A wire number or color does not change passing thru an inactive component such as a bullet interconnect or junction block.
5) buying a spool of wire with a trace color can be expensive and aggravating if you need only 2 feet. You can stay with primary colors by marking the terminal ends of the wire with a contrasting color ring of electrical tape. For example, you can have green only, green w/ white tape, green w/ yellow tape, etc
6) use crimp on terminals where possible. use an internal lock washer to bite thru paint or lock screw connections.
7) I have never found wire markers or tape that would not flag over time. Flagging is a marker un-raveling and sticking out off the wire like a flag in the breeze. The only absolutely positive way I know to prevent flagging is to place a sleeve of transparent heat shrink tubing over the marker and shrink it down. Cut your sleeves with a paper shear or exacto knife and use a gauge to get the length consistent. Cutting with side cutters will give you random lengths and off square cuts. Am I too picky? I know you want to be proud of your work.....we say here in Texas "make it look soes you meant it to be thet way!" .
8) (there is a smiley face here I can't get rid of...i guess eight) makes one) the best way to make a complete harness is to first make a nail board. The time spent will be paid back when you built it and will result in a professionally looking product. Use a string to estimate the length of branch break-outs, allowing for bends and curves. Give yourself plenty of wire to make final terminations.
9) when you are ready to bundle up the harness, you can use either electrical tape or heat shrink tubing. If you opt for tubing, first electrical tape up the break-outs about 2 inches each side, as the tubing can only reach to the branch. If you use tape only, use a short sleeve of heat shrink tubing to prevent the tape ends from flagging.
10) remember.....someone on this forum wrote "patience is the best tool in your tool box". Probably the most poignant words written herein, and ever to be written. Keep repeating it when you feel the urge to rush.
Good luck. Send us pics
Slick
1) make a schematic first. Follow Bengs advice regarding routing....try to be as efficient in wire use and inter-connections as possible. It is easier to change a wire with a pencil eraser than with a side cutter.
2) use wire gauge appropriate for the amps of the circuit. overkill leads to excessive bulk in a hurry. Wire ampacity depends on many things but stick to the schedule below and you will not have any meltdowns. All gauges noted are AWG
10 ga. 30 amps
12. 20
14. 15
16. 12
18. 10
20. 7.5
22. 5
24. 3
3) try to stay with conventional wire colors, especially for hot and ground.
4) a wire number or color remains the same if its function does not change. For ex. ground is ground everywhere and should be the same number or color everywhere. A wire number or color does not change passing thru an inactive component such as a bullet interconnect or junction block.
5) buying a spool of wire with a trace color can be expensive and aggravating if you need only 2 feet. You can stay with primary colors by marking the terminal ends of the wire with a contrasting color ring of electrical tape. For example, you can have green only, green w/ white tape, green w/ yellow tape, etc
6) use crimp on terminals where possible. use an internal lock washer to bite thru paint or lock screw connections.
7) I have never found wire markers or tape that would not flag over time. Flagging is a marker un-raveling and sticking out off the wire like a flag in the breeze. The only absolutely positive way I know to prevent flagging is to place a sleeve of transparent heat shrink tubing over the marker and shrink it down. Cut your sleeves with a paper shear or exacto knife and use a gauge to get the length consistent. Cutting with side cutters will give you random lengths and off square cuts. Am I too picky? I know you want to be proud of your work.....we say here in Texas "make it look soes you meant it to be thet way!" .
8) (there is a smiley face here I can't get rid of...i guess eight) makes one) the best way to make a complete harness is to first make a nail board. The time spent will be paid back when you built it and will result in a professionally looking product. Use a string to estimate the length of branch break-outs, allowing for bends and curves. Give yourself plenty of wire to make final terminations.
9) when you are ready to bundle up the harness, you can use either electrical tape or heat shrink tubing. If you opt for tubing, first electrical tape up the break-outs about 2 inches each side, as the tubing can only reach to the branch. If you use tape only, use a short sleeve of heat shrink tubing to prevent the tape ends from flagging.
10) remember.....someone on this forum wrote "patience is the best tool in your tool box". Probably the most poignant words written herein, and ever to be written. Keep repeating it when you feel the urge to rush.
Good luck. Send us pics
Slick
bwolfie said:I went down a different road. I used a motogadget Munit. All the functions are actuated by a ground signal. So all my switch wires are small. The unit has digital fuses and built in relays. There are several built in programmable features to boot.
Electrical BLING! And not inexpensive. $350 usd + shipping, but WTF, motorsports are expensive.
A simple observation is that you have distributed your electrical from your battery box instead of (like I have begun) from within the headlight compartment. I guess your way leads to a larger cluster of wires under the tank but is nicely organized and accessible.
Many options. My learning curve is still steep, and that's fun to me.
Now that I know the bike will run, I can take my time, research and do a proper electrical system this winter.
Thanks for the input
There are actually few wires under the tank.
Two Small bundles from the switch gear, another modest bundle from the headlight and the 2 coil wires.
I had another wiring system installed, but it pissed me off with it's lack of manufacturer support.
The M-Unit can be found for $310 shipped on ebay.
Pricy, I know, but man is it nice.
Two Small bundles from the switch gear, another modest bundle from the headlight and the 2 coil wires.
I had another wiring system installed, but it pissed me off with it's lack of manufacturer support.
The M-Unit can be found for $310 shipped on ebay.
Pricy, I know, but man is it nice.
Brent, That m-unit is awfully nice. I downloaded the owners manual. It took a hour to take in the features. All of the circuits' switching is done with relays, so they are all clean, fused current. The shape of the Lucas handlebar switches, ignition switch, the fuse connection, and all of the fractured bullet connections have no effect on the flow of current to it's destination. If I was starting from scratch I'd get one for all those extra features, including the solid state motion alarm, solid state turn signal blinker for LED's, ect.,ect.bwolfie said:
It's a bit overwhelming with features. and on top of it you can add on keyless entry.
http://motogadget.com/en/electrics/rfid ... hloss.html
http://motogadget.com/en/electrics/rfid ... hloss.html
I sort of have keyless entry on my 850. The key is rusted in there so bad that I'm pretty sure that the lock or the key would not survive the operation of the key-ectomy, it stays in there. I turn off the oil valve/safety switch. At least they're not going to get to ride it away and maybe they'll just get tried out and give up.bwolfie said:
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Yep its bad practice to remove key all the time and key fob flap in wind and vibration also speeds decay. Fork lock more theft effective than ignition lock and that ain't saying much nor clam worries if bike left on side of road with you off on a rescue search. Its a hobby to hack keyless security systems nowadays and can just picture remote start warm up on a Commando :lol: Theft is just another part of risk taking to ride a light desirable motorcycle. Poor Micheil Taglarii in NYC city says crack heads steal his plugs out parked bike to make expedient crack pipes with, ugh.
I'm almost afraid to show this. I think I'm going to call it an "ugly bug" power distributor.
I've been looking since this original post for something slick that will fit in the headlight for power distribution. With on real luck.
So I soldered up this horrid looking 14ga thing the other night. It has 14 connections. One for the main power supply with a separate 20 amp fuse and 13 connections for lights and accessories.
My question to smarter people here is do you foresee any problems? It solves my needs. Tested for good continuity and no voltage drops.
I've been looking since this original post for something slick that will fit in the headlight for power distribution. With on real luck.
So I soldered up this horrid looking 14ga thing the other night. It has 14 connections. One for the main power supply with a separate 20 amp fuse and 13 connections for lights and accessories.
My question to smarter people here is do you foresee any problems? It solves my needs. Tested for good continuity and no voltage drops.
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