Alternator Installation
- Thread starter swooshdave
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swooshdave said:
And now you can see why I was questioning the assembly of the alternator. Considering the parts I have you'd wonder too.
Nut OD
Crank OD
Rotor fits nicely on crank, so that's good. Rumor has it that the RGM belt kit comes with a rotor nut so we'll see if it fits better. 8)
Of course the belt kit will space the rotor out correctly.
Good to see you are sticking to imperial no metric nonsense
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If you were to put an oscilloscope lead on a given alternator output wire you would see a single sine wave swinging equally from negative territory to positive territory above and below the 0 volt reference line. In a 1 wire alternator you would see a single sine wave, in a 2 wire alternator you would see two sine waves 180 degrees out of phase (two phase) and in a 3 wire alternator you would see three sine waves 120 degrees out of phase (three phase). The more phases you add the higher the average output current is, as long as you gang the phases and don't set them so that they cancel eachother. The rectifier cuts off the positive alternations (negative ground systems) or the negative alternations (negative ground systems) and the Zenner diode regulates the the maximun system voltage by acting as a variable resistor (resistors can be current limiting when hung bewteen a power source and a ground, or voltage limiting when put inline). Fortunately a number of manufacturers have given us the black box (silver box?) that does both the rectification and voltage regulation.
In the US it is common to refer to 110/120V (one hot) and 220/240V (two hot) systems as single phase and to refer to 208 (three hot) as three phase, it gives the tradsmen a common langauge, but is technically quite incorrect. 110/120 V power is single phase, 220/240 is two phase and 208 is three phase. The point of having these options in a supply setting is to give the consumer choices for lowering current flow, lower current flow translates to lower supply tempatures which means less fire danger, a good thing. Ohm's law E=IR, voltage equals current time resistance; the higher the voltage the lower the current.
These same conventions have carried over to motorcycles and cars. Call it symantics, if you like, but any way you cut it: 1 wire = single phase, 2 wires = two phase and 3 wires = three phase.
RS
In the US it is common to refer to 110/120V (one hot) and 220/240V (two hot) systems as single phase and to refer to 208 (three hot) as three phase, it gives the tradsmen a common langauge, but is technically quite incorrect. 110/120 V power is single phase, 220/240 is two phase and 208 is three phase. The point of having these options in a supply setting is to give the consumer choices for lowering current flow, lower current flow translates to lower supply tempatures which means less fire danger, a good thing. Ohm's law E=IR, voltage equals current time resistance; the higher the voltage the lower the current.
These same conventions have carried over to motorcycles and cars. Call it symantics, if you like, but any way you cut it: 1 wire = single phase, 2 wires = two phase and 3 wires = three phase.
RS
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I stand corrected. I guess.
I still stand by that I have a two wire Sparx so it's either single or two phase, depending on how many drinks I've had as that seems to be the only standard I can trust.
I still stand by that I have a two wire Sparx so it's either single or two phase, depending on how many drinks I've had as that seems to be the only standard I can trust.
batrider
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There is no such thing as a 1 wire alternator. There is a 2 wire alternator which is single phase. The 3 wire can be either 3 phase, or, if an older one, it can also be a single phase with the various windings switched by the lighting switch.
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batrider said:
I only have one question, how do you wire the kill switch on a single wire alternator? :mrgreen:
DogT
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Personally I have never heard of a 1 wire AC circuit. There must be 2 wires for AC to work. There is single phase AC, split phase AC (both single phase and the split phase 180 deg. out of phase with each other with respect to common) and 3 phase which is a Y (star) or delta output with 3 wires and the current at 120 deg. out of phase with each wire. Each requires a separate rectifier circuit to produce DC for a battery charger.
But I am not going to get in the middle of this nor am I the expert.
Dave
69S
But I am not going to get in the middle of this nor am I the expert.
Dave
69S
swooshdave said:
Look at the regulator/rectifier boxes available on the net you will see those with 2 yellow wires for single phase alternators and those with 3 yellow wires for three phase alternators ....http://www.tri-corengland.com/acatalog/Alternators.html
Cheers Paul
DogT said:
Many car sites discuss single wire alternators typically these have the regulatot/rectfier built in to the alternator and are connected to the engine block 'earth'.
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e181/crowncabinetry/gm1wire.jpg
One last point the phrase positive or negative earth I do not actually like I prefer using ground in place of earth...which is technically more accurate.
AC, DC, negative ground, positive ground, it still and always will require at least two conductors. Chassis ground may be one of the conductors, thus making a one wire circuit function. No such thing as a one conductor electrical circuit or device. As for the explanation of 220 volt AC being two phase, that is incorrect. It has two conductors with opposite polarities, but is in phase, hence single phase. Phase is timing, not polarity. With three phase AC there are three conductors with each conductor reaching maximum amplitude 120 degrees apart.
grandpaul said:
I think we are misunderstand ing each other when they talk about a 1 wire alternator they often bundle in the regulator/rectifier circuitry so visibly from the outside the alternator (including reg/rec) has 1 wire to the battery and the other connection by way of vehicle ground.
http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/onewire-threewire2.shtml
grandpaul
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Not so much misunderstanding as mis-stating a "configuration".
Talking about an alternator implies a device with an alternating output. You can't alternate the output through one wire. The alternating output is done on multiple wires INTERNALLY, then rectified to DIRECT CURRENT externally through one wire to the battery.
The alternator "type" is NOT one-wire. It's either single phase or three phase, rectified to DC and output on a single wire FROM THE RECTIFIER CIRCUIT (not the alternator).
Talking about an alternator implies a device with an alternating output. You can't alternate the output through one wire. The alternating output is done on multiple wires INTERNALLY, then rectified to DIRECT CURRENT externally through one wire to the battery.
The alternator "type" is NOT one-wire. It's either single phase or three phase, rectified to DC and output on a single wire FROM THE RECTIFIER CIRCUIT (not the alternator).
next time I need an alternator for someones car that I am repairing :-( yes I do get cajoled into this sometimes) I will ask at the autoshop/parts supplier for an a 'alternator' with an integrated regulator rectifier' - Status
