Alloy rim for a P11 rear hub?

I want to put a WM4 18" 40-hole shouldered alloy rim on the rear of my '67 P11 and use the stock hub. I am not putting together a restoration, so not looking at a WM3 18 in stainless.

So, of the handful of people here that have put shouldered alloy rims of any width on a stock P11 rear hub that uses the straight pull spokes, whose rim did you use, where did you get it, and was the dimple pattern 1:1 or 3:1? If I can make a 1:1 pattern work, all is well, because the Excel WM4 18 40-hole comes 1:1 from Buchanan. Buchanan says my stock rim is a 3:1. I sent them pics.

Forget about it. If I could delete the post, I would.

Turns out there was some miscommunication and all Buchanan wanted to let me know was that the dimple pattern was different, not that it would be an issue lacing up the hub. They thought I might be concerned (an issue) that the dimple pattern would not match the original wheel dimple pattern.

Rims to suit "true" Matchless F/W ( :: full width) hubs have a 1:1 dimpling pattern.

- Knut

I just checked and yes, the front rim MB.42 WM2-19 is 1:1 for the little Matchless front hub.

The rear rim that I was talking about above has the odd 3:1 dimpling pattern. Markings on it are MC 194 on one side of the rim and WM3-18 on the other side. I had picked up a 1:1 WM4-18 40 hole rim for it cheap on ebay, but it was drilled wrong for the P11 rear hub. I could lace it up on one side, but the other side was drilled backwards for the P11 rear hub. It would have worked on a many other pre-Commando small rear hubs with the hook spokes though.

mdt-son said:

All "true" Matchless F/W hubs have a 1:1 dimpling pattern.

- Knut

Click to expand...

What is F/W mean in your context?

If it means Front Wheel, I'm not talking about or doing the front hub/rim. I'm talking about the rear hub and rim. My front hub is a "true" Matchless hub as is the rear. However, the front rim laced to my "true" Matchless hub is in the bed of my '65 El Camino and not on the bike anymore. My front hub is now a Ceriani type 230mm 4LS brake hub. Rim on front is a Morad 1.85 18 36TS.

I am sorry. The sentence lacked logic, now mended.

-Knut

mdt-son said:

I am sorry. The sentence lacked logic, now mended.

-Knut

Click to expand...

Thanks. No need for the sorry. It was my misunderstanding of F/W. Plus the "true" through me. The sentence had plenty of logic for a forum.

Are the P11 skimmed Matchless hubs considered "untrue"

Ended up with an Excel dimpled rim from Buchanan Spokes. I was not paying attention to the part number quoted when I asked about a shouldered Excel rim. The quote was for the standard dimpled WM4 rim and that is what showed up. At first, I kicked myself around for being a dumb ass, but decided I liked the older style smooth easy to clean Excel rim more than the popular shouldered rim every other Norton out there has on it, so now I'm ordering another standard dimple Excel rim to replace the MORAD on front. Expensive mistake, but the bike will look more like a dirt bike from the late 60's with the exception of a big lump of a 4LS brake on front.

Not sure if anyone gives a hoot, but here goes anyway:

Below is what I noted using what I'm going to call a standard dimple pattern rim like that of the Excell rim instead of an offset dimple pattern like the original rim that came on the P11.

What happens with the full width rear hub is the outer spokes being pulled in toward the center of the rim by the standard dimple pattern are under enough tension where the spokes cross to put a curve in the spoke when tightened and the rim is centered over the hub and between the arms on the swing arm. With the offset dimple pattern further away from the center the outer spokes are not under that kind of side tension when crossed and tightened up. It could be a recipe for disaster. I did ask Buchanan if the difference in the dimple pattern would be a problem lacing up the rim, and they said it would not be a problem lacing up the rim. What I didn't ask is if it was safe. I guess I'll find out eventually. Not pushing in turns hard and just riding around like an old man, it seems fine. When I get out this summer on some of the faster sweepers things might change. Whoo-hoo

Rim dimple pattern examples

Original P11 rear rim dimple pattern. Note the greater dimple offset for the outer spokes every 5th dimple.


Akront rim standard dimple pattern. This rim shows a standard dimple pattern, but happens to be drilled wrong for the P11 hub. It has the same dimple pattern as the Excell rim I ended up using.

I like the looks of the Excel rim. Just curious if you considered rims from CWC.

Longtimegone said:

I like the looks of the Excel rim. Just curious if you considered rims from CWC.

Click to expand...

Where were you when I needed you?

Never ran across them in my search for a rim.

Thanks

Chopped some material off the rear fender to make taking the rear wheel off easier.

Not your granny's P11.

I went with repro Akront style shouldered rims which I got from an Italian seller on eBay. The hubs I am using are Japanese, but they are off of early 1970's Japanese bikes and IMO don't look out of place unless you happen to be pretty familiar with early '70's Japanese bikes. I just couldn't bring myself to pay the huge amounts of money people want for OEM wheels and wheel parts.

Like you, I went with Buchanan, I have used lots of their products over the years and always been satisfied with them. I'm going with more of an off-road look than you did; Starting with a frame and crankcase (see my avatar) I feel gives me a lot of freedom, though I am sympathetic to any who come after me and I am not planning to do any cutting on the frame.

I do not buy from CWC, too many shortcuts in specs so its never OEM even if they say it is and quality is variable.

Junglebiker said:

I went with repro Akront style shouldered rims which I got from an Italian seller on eBay. The hubs I am using are Japanese, but they are off of early 1970's Japanese bikes and IMO don't look out of place unless you happen to be pretty familiar with early '70's Japanese bikes. I just couldn't bring myself to pay the huge amounts of money people want for OEM wheels and wheel parts.

Like you, I went with Buchanan, I have used lots of their products over the years and always been satisfied with them. I'm going with more of an off-road look than you did; Starting with a frame and crankcase (see my avatar) I feel gives me a lot of freedom, though I am sympathetic to any who come after me and I am not planning to do any cutting on the frame.

Click to expand...

Sounds good.

I would prefer my wheels matched, but screw it for now. I'll take care of it later... maybe