1 finger hydraulic clutch conversion + lots more

Always nice to see engine work from a talented and curious mind. Never could get on with bobbers and surely not choppers but to each his own.
 
I like SRM stuff - but they're a bit remiss with that hydraulic clutch kit. They make no mention of other parts needed (suitable master cylinder/lever, hose from master cylinder to gearbox - neither of which they sell) for this to work.
Cheers
 
from the norton search, ran across this gem that i think is still out there

Hydraulic clutch replaces cable | Norton Owners Club

www.nortonownersclub.org www.nortonownersclub.org

hydraulic foldable clutch levers master cylinder for motorcycles

www.ebay.com

HYDRAULIC CLUTCH LEVER MASTER CYLINDER PIT BIKE U MX U LV12 | eBay

Complete with ASV style 'unbreakable' folding clutch lever. (You will need to remove your left hand grip for installation.). They are superior to Cables! Now you can add one to your bike! ~CNC ALUMINUM HYDRAULIC~FOLDABLE~.
www.ebay.com


also new to me
comnoz

Post in thread 'Hydraulic clutch fitted.'

swooshdave said:
I'm going to agree with the crazy cat lady, a properly set up Norton clutch is a one finger party of fun. Get the stack height right and you'll never look at a hydraulic clutch again.

I see people who put hydraulic clutches on the same as people who put Mukunis on. :?
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I will have to let you ride my bike next time I see you.
And I don't have a single Mikuni.....

By the way, there were 3 different springs used over the years. If you have the light spring used on the early Commandos then a clutch can be pretty light feeling with a cable. If you have the heavy spring as used on the...
  • Like
 
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Yep, I have yet to install one of those $25 e-bay ones that I have on the shelf.

...and a Norvil head steady...

...and a thousand dollars worth of other farkles for several other bikes...

Maybe this year.
 
In all my 50+ years of owning my Norton and 2 older Triumph's and the 2 modern Triumph's I have never had problems with a one finger clutch pull on all my bikes but how many do only use one finger, but in my younger days went through a few clutch cables before I started to put grease on the lever end, haven't broken a cable since.

Ashley
 
apparently, there were 3 diff springs (comnoz posted) used over the years, earliers being lighter
 
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Onder said:
Always nice to see engine work from a talented and curious mind. Never could get on with bobbers and surely not choppers but to each his own.
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I like all genres so long as they are classic British. Besides that streetfighter from my youtube channel I have 2 A65, 2 other Triumph and 1 Norton streetfighters. I tore 2 belts out of the primary on that thing pictured and went back to chain. It has a Norton crank, 6.3 rods and a Routt 79mm block. 5 speed and 2 x 38mm Mikunis and it idles. Cams are a bit silly on a 650 but fine on an 888cc. Starting can be a bear and at 73 and dickie knee everything is a challenge. Still curious and still building stupid shit. Out of bits of course. Never used a matching bike for fun builds but I am not a polisher. Not against using modernish forks, wheels and brakes to upgrade a classic ride. The clutch does work good and is a slave off an 80s Honda. Getting a master to provide good lift can be a trick.
 
When you discover the Secret to Sufficient Lift, peddle it to Trident owners and you will retire wealthy!
 
Onder said:
When you discover the Secret to Sufficient Lift, peddle it to Trident owners and you will retire wealthy!
Click to expand...
Years ago I fitted an LP Williams hydraulic clutch to a mates T160. The kit came with a 10mm Magura m/c, which if I remember correctly gave 0.028" lift, which proved just adequate. I worked out that the 11mm version would have given around 0.033", which would have been better.
 
Matchless said:
Years ago I fitted an LP Williams hydraulic clutch to a mates T160. The kit came with a 10mm Magura m/c, which if I remember correctly gave 0.028" lift, which proved just adequate. I worked out that the 11mm version would have given around 0.033", which would have been better.
Click to expand...
I wonder how much heavier the lever pull would be going from 10 to 11mm
I've been considering a hydraulic clutch conversion for my BSA r3 as a last resort
But I haven't stripped it apart yet to check everything
 
baz said:
I wonder how much heavier the lever pull would be going from 10 to 11mm
I've been considering a hydraulic clutch conversion for my BSA r3 as a last resort
But I haven't stripped it apart yet to check everything
Click to expand...
I have a cheapie hydraulic pull mech $15 fitted to a twin Triumph and it works fairly well. I tried the same type on a Triple and it blew the seal. Easier to fit to Twin than Triple. Bore the threaded cable boss and tap to required metric. They have plenty of threaded pull rod length to make work. They stand about 3" off the cable boss. More funk than function though.
 
baz said:
I wonder how much heavier the lever pull would be going from 10 to 11mm
I've been considering a hydraulic clutch conversion for my BSA r3 as a last resort
But I haven't stripped it apart yet to check everything
Click to expand...
I doubt it would be much harder. To my way of thinking, hydraulic clutches are in the main, just bling. With a lift mechanism in good nick & a Featherlight cable, most bikes are fine. The exception to that would be where, as on Trident/Rocket 3 clutches, the standard amount of lift can become borderline, as the engine heats up. The hydraulic arrangement would keep the free play to zero, unlike a cable set up.
 
Matchless said:
I doubt it would be much harder. To my way of thinking, hydraulic clutches are in the main, just bling. With a lift mechanism in good nick & a Featherlight cable, most bikes are fine. The exception to that would be where, as on Trident/Rocket 3 clutches, the standard amount of lift can become borderline, as the engine heats up. The hydraulic arrangement would keep the free play to zero, unlike a cable set up.
Click to expand...
I've not delved any further than doing the actuator mod that revolves it around 15° to gain a bit more lift and I have played with cable routing and different clutch lever pivot points
But the clutch on the r3 is a lot heavier than my t160
I have read that the borg beck clutch in a mini has around 40 thou lift and a tipple around 22thou
 
I put a 1/1/8" clutch lever on my T160 and had it on for years due to clearance issues when the engine got hot, and in about 2013 I reduced the level of the fingers on the clutch basket to get the diaphragm nearer to being flat using the 0.624" from finger ends to friction plate. This gets the spring flatter as is the procedure on a Norton Commando clutch. It was never a stiff or heavy clutch, it was acceptable but it was a slightly long reach for my fingers.

There is a bloke in the TR3OC who has got a good reputation for making the clutches better and instead of machining the clutch basket fingers, uses a thicker clutch plate 0.292" instead of the standard 0.262" and he knows the issues with these Borg and Beck clutches and is a good machinist to get everything square.

I decided to send him my clutch and it came back definitely better and would work on the standard lever. I also fitted an LP Willians hydraulic clutch with its 9.5mm master cylinder and the clutch on my T160 is comparable with the clutch on my 2024 BMW R1300GS. That is, a beautifully light clutch with great feel which is what the hydraulic clutch gives. No cable friction. Also the reach is quite low and it never loses clearance when everything gets hot, although it never did after I fitted the 1 1/8" lever.

It makes the bike feel "modern" in that department. As I recall, the bloke who does the clutches, Keith B, gets the clutches to clear between 0.018" and 0,022" typically. I keep reading about how bad the clutches are, and I know they often are and that the problems are not easy to remedy, but now after doing the above, my T160 clutch is very good without the hydraulic system and "modern" with it, so it can be done, but it costs about £300ish for the clutch machining which includes a new thicker plate and about £500 for the hydraulic clutch. I have had this setup for about two years and well over 6,000 miles.

Also, I have very recently fitted a Bonneville centre stand as described by Les (LAB) in an earlier T160 centre stand thread, and it is now easy to put on the centre stand! I will write up a bit on this in the appropriate thread in the next week or so.
 
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Having dicked with these stupid clutches for years I have come to believe that many are simply not to spec and they will never work. 35 thou to clearance is not unusual. Seems to me a lot of the problem is the cover. If you put them on a lathe and spin them they are usually out. If you skim them true they do not stay that way. As they are a pressing riveted to the
centre you can rest assured many were iffy. Made in Coventry spares has considered making the cover but so far nothing has appeared. They do offer the other parts of the clutch made to better standards.
 
Reggie said:
I put a 1/1/8" clutch lever on my T160 and had it on for years due to clearance issues when the engine got hot, and in about 2013 I reduced the level of the fingers on the clutch basket to get the diaphragm nearer to being flat using the 0.624" from finger ends to friction plate. This gets the spring flatter as is the procedure on a Norton Commando clutch. It was never a stiff or heavy clutch, it was acceptable but it was a slightly long reach for my fingers.

There is a bloke in the TR3OC who has got a good reputation for making the clutches better and instead of machining the clutch basket fingers, uses a thicker clutch plate 0.292" instead of the standard 0.262" and he knows the issues with these Borg and Beck clutches and is a good machinist to get everything square.

I decided to send him my clutch and it came back definitely better and would work on the standard lever. I also fitted an LP Willians hydraulic clutch with its 9.5mm master cylinder and the clutch on my T160 is comparable with the clutch on my 2024 BMW R1300GS. That is, a beautifully light clutch with great feel which is what the hydraulic clutch gives. No cable friction. Also the reach is quite low and it never loses clearance when everything gets hot, although it never did after I fitted the 1 1/8" lever.

It makes the bike feel "modern" in that department. As I recall, the bloke who does the clutches, Keith B, gets the clutches to clear between 0.018" and 0,022" typically. I keep reading about how bad the clutches are, and I know they often are and that the problems are not easy to remedy, but now after doing the above, my T160 clutch is very good without the hydraulic system and "modern" with it, so it can be done, but it costs about £300ish for the clutch machining which includes a new thicker plate and about £500 for the hydraulic clutch. I have had this setup for about two years and well over 6,000 miles.

Also, I have very recently fitted a Bonneville centre stand as described by Les (LAB) in an earlier T160 centre stand thread, and it is now easy to put on the centre stand! I will write up a bit on this in the appropriate thread in the next week or so.
Click to expand...
My t160 was set up by LP Williams some years ago and remains very good, it has magura levers fitted it's a bit heavier than say a commando but the r3 is a lot heavier and will need to be sorted to make it more usable
 
I put on the 1 1/8 lever. It helped but increased the pull weight. Also dug out the pockets of the lift mechanism to gain even more travel. And again
increased the pull weight. Added a heavy duty Venhill cable. New increased thickness plate.
So why is there no joy? Because the cover has to be dead nuts true and seems to me that the cover distorts. If you lose a few thou at the lever, the cable stretches a tiny bit, the lift mechanism is not perfect, added up you
end up with a shortfall. Yes, add in heat growth.
In a car you have a lot more travel and you are using your whole leg not
just fingers.
 
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