Mk3 outer gearbox cover

Is there a knack to refitting the outer gearbox cover to a Mk3? Does the crossover shaft have to be timed like my T160?
The manual seems to show the ratchet plate and the pawl carrier assembly shaft in place on the inner cover when the outer cover is offered up. However the parts book shows the pawl carrier assembly as a one piece part. What’s the truth of the matter? Any help greatly appreciated.

That illustration is wrong :-(
I seem to remember it is a bitch trying to hold everything in place in the outer cover as you offer it up.. Lots of colourful language
It's trying to locate the pin on the ratchet plate into the knuckle ball that's the pain, you should be 'timed' before you get to this stage, the crossover shaft is in two pieces and the gear lever can be repositioned, so nothing to worry there...
A finger through the inspection cover may be needed (along with about 15 more!!)

Zep1975 said:

Is there a knack to refitting the outer gearbox cover to a Mk3? Does the crossover shaft have to be timed like my T160?
The manual seems to show the ratchet plate and the pawl carrier assembly shaft in place on the inner cover when the outer cover is offered up. However the parts book shows the pawl carrier assembly as a one piece part. What’s the truth of the matter? Any help greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

Figure D08 in the Workshop manual shows the pawl carrier assembly installed in the outer [not inner] cover. Figure D06 shows the gear change ratchet plate mounted to the outboard side of the inner cover.
Charlie
PS I just sent you a private message [aka conversation]

EstuaryBoy said:

That illustration is wrong :-(
I seem to remember it is a bitch trying to hold everything in place in the outer cover as you offer it up.. Lots of colourful language
It's trying to locate the pin on the ratchet plate into the knuckle ball that's the pain, you should be 'timed' before you get to this stage, the crossover shaft is in two pieces and the gear lever can be repositioned, so nothing to worry there...
A finger through the inspection cover may be needed (along with about 15 more!!)

Click to expand...

What illustration is wrong? Are you referring to the Workshop manual or the parts catalog? Please clarify and quote the figure, if it's the workshop manual.
Charlie
PS I just sent you a private message [aka conversation]

Zep1975 said:

Is there a knack to refitting the outer gearbox cover to a Mk3? Does the crossover shaft have to be timed like my T160?
The manual seems to show the ratchet plate and the pawl carrier assembly shaft in place on the inner cover when the outer cover is offered up. However the parts book shows the pawl carrier assembly as a one piece part. What’s the truth of the matter? Any help greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

The "timing" is done during installation of the inner cover to the case. It involves correctly mating the gear change quadrant to the cam-plate assembly.

chaztuna said:

The "timing" is done during installation of the inner cover to the case. It involves correctly mating the gear change quadrant to the cam-plate assembly.

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Figure D8 does show the pawl carrier assembly in place on the outer cover but it is minus the shaft. The shaft is shown already in place holding the ratchet plate in position on the inner cover. That’s the discrepancy I was asking about in my original post.
Figure D6 is just showing the cable pull and not relevant here. I should have mentioned the diagram I was referring to (D8) in my original post.

Zep1975 said:

Is there a knack to refitting the outer gearbox cover to a Mk3? Does the crossover shaft have to be timed like my T160?
The manual seems to show the ratchet plate and the pawl carrier assembly shaft in place on the inner cover when the outer cover is offered up. However the parts book shows the pawl carrier assembly as a one piece part. What’s the truth of the matter? Any help greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

Re The 'Workshop Manual'.. Both D6 and D8 show the Ratchet Plate (part-no: 06.5212) already installed on the gearbox inner cover. If I remember correctly, as it is supported by the pawl carrier shaft (part-no: 06.5216) it has to be assembled to this in the OUTER cover, before all is positioned (with skill and derring do!) and fed onto the gearbox/inner cover assembly....
It IS a few years since I've done this job, so errors of memory may have crept in, part numbers quoted are from the current Andover website...

Zep1975 said:

Is there a knack to refitting the outer gearbox cover to a Mk3? Does the crossover shaft have to be timed like my T160?
The manual seems to show the ratchet plate and the pawl carrier assembly shaft in place on the inner cover when the outer cover is offered up. However the parts book shows the pawl carrier assembly as a one piece part. What’s the truth of the matter? Any help greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

Crossover shaft is no big deal. Just position the shift pedal where it normally rides and slid the splined shafts together in the coupling.

If you have small fingers, then it can be done through the inspection cover when offering it all up, no big deal. Then you can sort the cross over shaft later.

Madnorton said:

If you have small fingers, then it can be done through the inspection cover when offering it all up, no big deal. Then you can sort the cross over shaft later.

Click to expand...

OK, I just pulled my gearbox parts out of my solvent cleaning tank. I'm 6'4" so I definitely don't have small fingers. I have long fingers, which I think are even better for holding the ratchet plate. I found it quite easy to do. Last time I overhauled a Mk III gearbox was 36 years ago. I don't remember having any real difficulty re-installing the outer cover. I believe that I used a 1/2" diameter bolt with the threaded section cut off. I inserted the oil coated shank of the modified bolt through the cross over shaft bushing/oil seal in the front of the inner cover. [Properly sized round aluminum or wood stock would work just as well] I mounted the ratchet plate over that bolt. That way, the ratchet plate appears just as in figures D6 & D8. I then installed the outer cover. The pawl carrier shaft will push the bolt [temporary axle for the ratchet plate] out of the inner cover. I believe either method works well.
Estuary Boy is correct that Norton's tech document department simply copy and pasted the old instructions into the new manual.
One thing that is not mentioned in the instructions in Section D12 regards protecting the cross shaft oil seal and kick starter oil seal from the splines on the pawl shaft and the kick starter shafts. There should be a note to place thin plastic over the splines to protect the oil seals. I cut two corners out of a sandwich sized plastic baggie. Insert the corner sections over the two shafts. Coat the plastic with oil. Once the outer cover is in place, you can pull the plastic off the two shafts. This extra step should also be added to the instructions for reinstalling the outer gearbox cover on earlier model Nortons.

I use a dab of grease on the drilled roller to keep it from rotating in the actuator arm, that's what usually cases the headaches.