wheels for Commando rebuild

I am planning to drop off my hubs at Buchanan's for wheels and spokes in a couple of weeks.
I have decided on Conti Classic Attack tires 19".
I see on Buchanan's web site they have WM 4.5 -2.75" Sun rims the largest rims recommended for these tires.
I was always under the impression that wider was better but I have not seen anyone use these rims on a commando.
My hubs are the madass rear hub and a custom hub made for me by Cognito Moto.
Does anyone have any experience or recomendations for me here.

Funny you should ask.....
I doubt the 2.75 inch rims will fit. I run WM4 2.5 inch x 19 rims with 100/90 Avon AM 26 Roadriders at both ends. Avon recommends the 2.5 inch rims for the 100/90s with 2.75" or 2.15" as acceptable alternatives. The problem with going wider is that you flatten the profile out giving less tread at the edges. Still, it's better than putting too wide a tyre on a skinny rim, as most people do. This leaves you with a large chicken strip of unusable tread. I find the steering super light, yet really stable. An odd combination for sure but, there you are. My rim/tyre combination only just fits in between the swingarm and must be juggled in. At the front, you must use button headed capscrews to hold the guard on, or the tyre just won't fit. The 2.75 inch rim would spread the tyre further, which I'm sure, would be a bit too wide. I have no experience with the Conti Attacks, but I would suggest going with the 2.5 inch rims. I have been through over 20 of the Avon Roadriders and I can't say enough good things about them. They work well on the standard 1.85 inch rims, but on the 2.5 inch rims they are made for, they are outstanding.

You may also have issues rubbing the chainguard if the tire is too wide. 110/90 in the rear is about as wide as you can go.

Unless you have a horrendously expensive amount of additional horsepower, you are wasting what little you Do have on slinging more rubber than you need trying to go any fatter.

I was always under the impression that wider was better
I was, too, for a while. Now I think it's probably better if you spend all yr time on a dragstrip, but if you actually want to turn a corner, it's a different ballgame.
Not to mention the additional weight and the fitment issues pointed out by Fullauto and grandpaul...

Have you actually found one of those Conti Classic Attack 19" rears IN STOCK and for sale anywhere? I had to switch my Buchanan's order to a 18" rim last year at the last minute just before they drilled a 19" rim for me. Those 19" rears that Conti shows on their website still aren't available anywhere that I can find.
Bill

talk to Buchanan, they were quite willing to point out that CNW uses the 18x2.75" as one of their sizes of choice.

the interference is with the chain guard hence CNW has their own chain guard. i think Jim Comstock runs one this wide as well, and i will be going that way on the prodigal son...

pantah_good said:

Have you actually found one of those Conti Classic Attack 19" rears IN STOCK and for sale anywhere? I had to switch my Buchanan's order to a 18" rim last year at the last minute just before they drilled a 19" rim for me. Those 19" rears that Conti shows on their website still aren't available anywhere that I can find.
Bill

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Did you use the conti 110/90-18" rear? How did this fit in your swingarm?

jimwood, I'm a little embarrassed to say I just assumed that the new 110/90-18 Conti would fit. I haven't mounted that tire yet because I haven't finished truing the new rim, which won't happen until the frame gets reassembled as a roller chassis and I can properly mount the new madass rear hub assembly with "half way" trued shouldered Borrani WM3 (2.15) x 18" rim. On a couple vintage race bikes I've set up in the past, I had to shave off a little rubber off the very widest part of the rear tire that was rubbing on the swing arm or chain with a good sharp wood plane. That worked good, but I don't think that will be necessary in this case. The tire measures 4 3/8" wide unmounted, if that helps.
Bill

Well, you just have to decide whether you are doing this for "the looks", or for best handling. if you want the best handling, lightest steering and stable bike, then go for 2.5 inch rims , IN 19 INCH, with Avon Roadrider 100/90 x 19. If you are after looks, ask somebody else.

What is best tyre width probably depends on how you ride your bike. If you take a wide line in corners and use a lot of lean and use a lot of power, wide tyres are probably better. If your bike is used in a way that causes the line to be tight in corners with less lean, narrow tyres are better. With Commandos, I suggest most use nimble handling and tighter lines in corners, so narrow tyres are better. The difference is about horsepower. A Commando can beat a modern bike under the circumstances which suits a Commando's handling. When you see a MotoGP bike in a corner and the rider has his elbow on the ground, that is not necessarily the quickest way around the corner. The problem is it is a balancing act, if the MotoGP bike is best in corners, everywhere else it is probably much more dangerous. If a Commando is over-tyred, you have the disadvantages with none of the advantages. I use a 4 inch rear tyre on my Seeley because even though it tightens it's line in corners, I give it too much stick coming out and I cannot afford a high-side. For a road bike, you would not bother.

When I brought my Norton Commando new over 42 years ago I got all the books, sales posters that came from the factory, one of the books was on tyres and in big bold letters it said the Commando was designed for 19" rims and Dunlop K81s 410x19" back and front, well that was over 42 years now and tyres have come a long way but when I changed to alloy rims 38 years ago I went orginal size in the rims because of what was written in the book, but I ran 410x19 on the back and 350x19 on the front this made the Commando steer into the corners better.
Although I have converted to the Featherbed frame for over 35 years now I am still running the same alloy rims but with matching tyres in Roadriders that I ran in the old K81, I am not a big beliver in going to a 18" wheel on the back of a Commando as really they weren't designed for them, but thats my opinion and a lot of people are happy with going that way, but going a wider tyre on the back of a Commando and it could change the handling for the worst.
I watch a Harley rider leave a shop one day he had such a wide tyre on the back but to get it to turn he had to throw his whole body to the side he was turning to get it to turn, to me that looked dangerous, sport bikes are different they are designed to run wide rear tyres for very high speeds, our old Nortons weren't designed for 300ks speeds.

Ashley

I still run 19" rims on my Roadster, AVON 110 /90 x 19" on the rear and 90/90 x 19" on the front.
Keep the tyre pressures correct makes for light nimble and safe handling bike.
I went to 18 " rims on the race bike front and back purely for a bigger range and type of tyre choice, also in the 18" range there is a bigger choice of compounds , the 19" range is limited in compounds.
Regards Mike

PS skinny tyres heat up quicker, more grip sooner!!!!

I changed from 19 inch wheels to 18s to get better rubber onto my Triton. All it did was stuff the handling so much that it made the bike exhausting to ride. Because of the motor's small capacity compared with others in Allpowers races, I used to ride my ring off. I'd get off the bike after races, completely buggered. However that is a different problem to the one you encounter when you change tyre diameter. If you think about what you do when you use string to line up your front and rear wheels - a 8 inch tyre on the rear and a 5 inch on the front on a modern bike, makes for a substantial misalignment, and you can feel it when you ride the bike. It becomes more stable - harder to turn quickly. If you have 200BHP to play with, that is probably good.

If you want to experience the effect of tyre misalignment, simply turn the rear wheel of your Commando a lot out of alignment. It will probably become stiff in corners.

Fullauto said:

Well, you just have to decide whether you are doing this for "the looks", or for best handling. if you want the best handling, lightest steering and stable bike, then go for 2.5 inch rims , IN 19 INCH, with Avon Roadrider 100/90 x 19. If you are after looks, ask somebody else.

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I have the same setup as Fullauto and love the looks as well as the handling. I think it was Ying who is a member of this forum group mention that Buchanan's has the Borani shouldered aluminum rims in the WM 4 19" size. We met at the Virginia INOA rally last July but I couldn't find his campsite to check them out.
Cheers,
Thomas

I have fitted the WM4 Borrani 19" shouldered rims from Buchanans and run the Avon tires going on the recommendation of Canuck and could not be more pleased.Buchanans used their spokes and built the wheels.
The bike feels better in the mountains and they look great.The polishers they use did a great job also.
YING

YING said:

I have fitted the WM4 Borrani 19" shouldered rims from Buchanans and run the Avon tires going on the recommendation of Canuck and could not be more pleased.Buchanans used their spokes and built the wheels.
The bike feels better in the mountains and they look great.The polishers they use did a great job also.
YING

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Mike,
Could you post some pictures of this setup. I would be very interested on how the rims and wheel look as a package. I am sure others here would as well.
Cheers,
Thomas