sortin out the center stand

I'm trying to figure out why the centerstand on my 850 won't actually lift the rear wheel clear of the ground. The PO had welded a piece of 5/16" rod to the bottom of each foot to lift the bike higher...and it still didn't clear the ground with the stock wheels/tires. The piece of rod also made the bike very difficult to move onto the stand because the foot would roll to the point where the rod was across the foot and then there was an abrupt step which required substantial effort to get the bike up. The stand is the original 850 stand and though the bushings/holes are a slightly worn, it is not enough to matter. So, I'm wondering if there are different extended lengths on rear shocks that may be allowing the swing arm to drop lower than the originals did. I have Hagon's on the bike.

I removed the PO's piece of rod from the bottom of the stand and tried putting some shim material on the part of the CS that butts up against the engine plate to "stop" the stand, figuring that would raise the bike. It did but in order to get the rear wheel to clear, the shim has to be so thik that the stand cannot rotate "over-center" and therefore won't "lock" in place.

I considered buying a new CS from OB but the stands looks exactly like my stand and I don't want to pay 200 bucks to have exactly what I already have.

Any ideas?

How long are your shocks?

If the shocks are original length, possibly the stops on the center stand are worn so that the stand goes too far passed the fulcrum point. I had to add some weld to the stops on mine last winter to correct this.

"How long are your shocks?"

13" They are the Hagons sold by OB (and others) as the replacement for the original Girlings. I ASSUME the original Girlings were the same length but I don't know that.

Mike - I had the same problem when I first got my 850. if the shocks are standard length, then maybe the stand has been messed with by the PO (cut and re-welded and maybe shortened?). No harm to measure your stand from the centre of the pivot to the foot and ask Old Britts to do the same, then compare.

Are your front forks topping out? There should be some sag in the springs. When I got my Commando first, one of the stanchions was binding slightly in the top bush and would remain topped out when on the stand, causing the rear tyre to touch the ground. Press down on the handlebars when the bike is on the stand and see if it stays in that position.

One other minor thing that did not help with mine was that the pivot holes were worn oval in the cradle. Wiggle the stand when retracted and you will judge if there is enough play to cause the rear to sink down more than it should. I had to make spacers that were a press fit in the cradle and a tight sliding fit for the bolts so that the stand had no play.

Dave

we have a first, a second, and can I add a third to the likely hood of worn oblong stand privot supposed holes.

Like the other guys, I had to have metal welded back to mine to restore the lift.


But then, I got tired of the whole thing, took it off, and bought a Pit Bull rear stand.

I spent today building a tread down Commando type centre stand for the Series C Vincent. With all of the head scratching to get the Norton stand geometry onto the other bike, I realized that my Norton stand is like yours, going a little too far over centre. This makes for extra effort when pushing it off the stand. Other than that there is no real harm in having the wheel lightly contact the pavement. Much more than light contact could create a stability problem, however.
If you do decide to build things up so that the stop point is closer to the "over centre" point, be careful not to go too far in that direction. I had this new stand setup that way before doing some fettling. It was effortless to park, but a gentle bump from the rear was enough to roll the bike off the stand.
After a few trips to the grinder to remove material from the stop got it about right.
For some reason it is much easier to park than the Commando. Just step down on the lever and it's parked. Could be that it is further back and has less weight on it.
I might look at the Commando stand to see if there is an obvious way to improve it. Overall it looks like a good design.
It certainly beats the stock Vincent stands, they are simply awful!
Glen

I recently put a new stand on my 850 , the old one broke in half , same problem as yours so a new one wont solve your problem .
I had to weld the RH stop back on as the factory had only tacked it in place [ forgot to fully weld it ]
While I was at it I added pieces of cut pipe to the bottom , mainly to make it more stable on dirt , but it does raise it a little and nice and round , easy to lift .

" I don't want to pay 200 bucks to have exactly what I already have. " try a ( full ) Beer Crate . possibly get four for $ 200 . and discrad the mainstand .
This way it wont scrape & bang around . If you ever get a puncture , procureing a beer crate ( full ) will guarantee copious offers of assitance .

On the odds , youre unlikely to get four punctures , so starting with one for at home , youll be well ahead , financially . :? 8)

Neat bit of fabrication, Glen.

I do think it's good to have some clearance, even just a few mm, between the tyre and the ground so that you can rotate the wheel to lube and tension the chain and to periodically check all the moving parts. I guess you could live with it if you put the stand down on a piece of ply when you're at home.

Lot of good info, guys. The stand's pivot holes are oblong plus the stand is way over-centering. THis morning I'm taking the stand over to my friend's shop and we're going to weld a bit of material into the worn end of the holes and then ream them to the proper size. We'll also weld some material onto the tabs on the CS that stop the stand from rotating when they hit the motor frame. If it ends up being too much, I'll just grind that down to where the stand over-centers a satisfactory amount, but not too much. If that doesn't do it, the suggestion re a piece of pipe on the bottom should do the job!

As was pointed out, I do want at least a tiny bit of clearance from the ground so the tire can spin.

I thought about the pit bull stand and gave it serious consideration but I like the fact that with the CS, I can remove the wheel. Plus, if I can get the center stand to work for essentially no cost, I'd be a really happy Norton guy!

I ground the stop on the new stand for the Vincent so that the tire is about an inch off the floor. The existing stand on the Commando allows the wheel to lightly contact the floor, but the wheel can still be turned with one hand while the other hand sprays on the chain lube. If things wear much more, it will definitely be time to get the welder out and build up the stops.
I put removeable bushings in the new stand and made up a couple of extra sets. Will I be able to find them when the first set gets worn? :mrgreen:

Glen

We welded the bushing holes and re-drilled them to the correct size, added 1/4" of metal to the "feet" of the stand (attached one end of a piece of 1/4 stock, heated it red and tapped it to fit the same rounded configuration as the foot, then welded the other end.) AND added 1/8" to the stops. Put it back on the bike...still won't clear the ground! My friend left for two weeks early this AM so I don't have any access to do a bit more welding on the stops.

I can turn the wheel with the bike on the stand but it's an effort. Oh well, at least the bike is much easier to get up on the stand than it was before. A bit more material on the stops will do the job. Or, as others have suggested, a piece of plywood under the stand...1/4" would be sufficient.

Even with all that work it only just allows wheel to turn. Frustrating. What condition are your Isolastics in? Could they be so soft or distorted that they are contributing? Just an idle thought.

I renewed all the iso parts (rubbers and sleeves) two years ago so I don't think that's part of the issue. Frankly, what it looks like to me is the the stops on the center stand were originally welded n the wrong position, so that the CS overcentered too far even from new. I don't know how that could actually happen since I assume all the CS's were made in a jig of some sort. But tHere is really very little wear on the CS stops or the frame where the stops/frame contact so I don't think wear in that area is the problem. Since the PO had put a 5/8" piece of rod across the bottom of each foot, it was obviously a problem for a long time.

mike996 said:

We welded the bushing holes and re-drilled them to the correct size, added 1/4" of metal to the "feet" of the stand (attached one end of a piece of 1/4 stock, heated it red and tapped it to fit the same rounded configuration as the foot, then welded the other end.) AND added 1/8" to the stops. Put it back on the bike...still won't clear the ground! My friend left for two weeks early this AM so I don't have any access to do a bit more welding on the stops.

I can turn the wheel with the bike on the stand but it's an effort. Oh well, at least the bike is much easier to get up on the stand than it was before. A bit more material on the stops will do the job. Or, as others have suggested, a piece of plywood under the stand...1/4" would be sufficient.

Click to expand...

Don't give up just yet! I know it's a long shot, but did you measure your stand and ask Old Britts to measure theirs? Or maybe someone here with a loose 850 stand could measure theirs. If they are the same length, then at least you know to look elsewhere.

Just checked my 74. The center stand in very good shape, shows
10 inches from center of the eye to the ground straight down.
The pad on the foot seems slighty worn where it sits .

Mine CS shows the same dimensions. I just added another 1/16" to the "stop" and now the wheel clears the ground by MAYBE 1/4"...but that's enough. I have no idea why the difference exists - I added 1/4" to the bottom of he foot and about the same to the "stop" where the stand butts up against the frame. Now it does not overcenter, is easy to put on the stand, but is still "locked" well enough when on the CS to be safe.

Hi,

I have the same problem on mine and it seems to be a general issue. When I got the bike there was clearance at the rear wheel. But then I mounted new shocks (NJB) and the clearance decreases.
After mounting a new tire, no more clearance. The shocks are a bit longer than the original, even though they are 13" long. The stops are ok, but there is a little play at the holes.
I have to admit that I kickstart the bike on the center stand. That may be a reason for getting play at the holes. A new stand would resolve the problem. But I don't worry about it,
because I suppose a new stand would wear out from kickstarting after a while too. I think that the rear wheel contacting the ground will stop wearing out the holes while kickstarting.
When I need to turn on the wheel for greasing the chain, I put a wooden plank under the CS.

Ralf

mike996 said:

Mine CS shows the same dimensions. I just added another 1/16" to the "stop" and now the wheel clears the ground by MAYBE 1/4"...but that's enough. I have no idea why the difference exists - I added 1/4" to the bottom of he foot and about the same to the "stop" where the stand butts up against the frame. Now it does not overcenter, is easy to put on the stand, but is still "locked" well enough when on the CS to be safe.

Click to expand...

Good to hear you sorted it - persistence paid off