Registration plate info

Hi all,

Hoping to get some help/verification about the UK registration tag that was on my Roadster when I bought it. The short story is that the first owner bought it in the UK, rode it for a spell (presumably to Italy to take in the ISDT in September of '74) and then shipped it to NY, rode it to CA and then sold it to me through a mutual friend. They shipped it back to the east coast to me in PA and it still wore this plate:



I'm trying to pin down where it was purchased and I've done some research but I'm confused about the locality. As I understand it - please correct me if I'm wrong - the "OGO" is the locality code where the first letter is not actually part of the code?? The "911" is the sequence number which went from 1-999. The "M" is the date the plate was issued/purchased?? which translates to 8/1/73 to 7/31/74. Since my 850's production date is 11/73 and the ISDT that year was from 9/9-14/74, that all works out.

So, where does the "OGO" place the original purchase?
Am I correct about the number and date?
Could the PO have sold this plate before he shipped the bike back to the US if he'd wanted to??

Not exactly Commando related but I'd love to find out exactly what the plate is trying to tell me about my old warhorse. thanks.

that no ogo would now be a personalized no. ie worth a few bob
my uk no is NOR10N about $20,000 worth
the first 3 letters used to refer to the owners locality ie town or city but after mid to late 60s that finished.
you could search the D.V.L.A DATA Base to see if anyone has put it on another vehicle

VintAge said:

I'm trying to pin down where it was purchased and I've done some research but I'm confused about the locality. As I understand it - please correct me if I'm wrong - the "OGO" is the locality code where the first letter is not actually part of the code?? The "911" is the sequence number which went from 1-999. The "M" is the date the plate was issued/purchased?? which translates to 8/1/73 to 7/31/74. Since my 850's production date is 11/73 and the ISDT that year was from 9/9-14/74, that all works out.

So, where does the "OGO" place the original purchase?
Am I correct about the number and date?

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Yes, you are spot on. A "GO" registration would have been issued from a SW London office, so the bike was bought from a dealer in that area-probably Elite Motors?

http://www.wolfbane.com/vreg.htm

OGO 820M: post130270.html

http://www.mazda4london.co.uk/elite-motors-history.htm

VintAge said:

Could the PO have sold this plate before he shipped the bike back to the US if he'd wanted to??

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Although it is possible to buy and sell registration numbers in the UK under certain conditions, a vehicle's registration number basically belongs to the vehicle it's issued to, and usually stays with it until it's scrapped (or exported) therefore the registration number is part of its identity. I can't see there would have been any reason-financial or otherwise, for transferring the registration to another vehicle.

Richard Barks said:

that no ogo would now be a personalized no. ie worth a few bob

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OGO 911M wouldn't be worth much as a personal registration, and as the bike was exported the registration should have been cancelled at the time it left the country, and it doesn't exist on the DVLA database.

Richard Barks said:

the first 3 letters used to refer to the owners locality ie town or city

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In the three letter group, only the second and third letters identify the issuing area [Edit: one exception being the Isle of Man = MAN]-which can also be a 'county' area before 1974 as well as 'town' or 'city'.

Richard Barks said:

but after mid to late 60s that finished.

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The area codes continued to be used until the 2001 reg. plate change.

Although Elites were the biggest sellers of Commandos in SW London (something of a "pile'em high and sell 'em cheap" mentality), dealers were free to choose the office that they patronised and that was not always the closest, certainly bearing London traffic in mind.

London SW was at Wimbledon, I believe. I'm pretty sure that Gus Kuhns had SW London plates too.

This registration probably never made it onto the DVLA computer and I don't believe that any London records have survived but the VMCC have some factory records which include records of the first registrations. You could also ask on as many forums as possible as the dealers were issued with blocks of numbers and those each side will probably have been issued to the same shop.

Thank you all; very informative and interesting. Wish I had all the paperwork for mine. Sort of weird, I guess, to be worrying about this 35 years after purchasing the bike but I keep seeing the plate in my workshop lately and thinking about it. Thanks again. I'll continue to try to track it down with this new info!

If you've got heaps of time and nothing better to do, you can search the registration database for numbers close to yours.

The DVLA system requires make to be entered as well. There are systems that don't but they only seem to have recently licensed vehicles on.

OGO 910M was a black 828cc Norton first registered 18/7/1974 but it hasn't been on the road officially since 1/12/1994.

Wots that McCulloch engine looking thing in the background of the numberplate shot ?

I tried to search for information on my old bike that had the British plates on it,

SAH 815, 1952 Triumph TRW

But a "vehicle enquiry" came with no data, should I be looking somewhere else?

Vince

Unclviny said:

SAH 815, 1952 Triumph TRW

But a "vehicle enquiry" came with no data, should I be looking somewhere else?

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How long ago did "SAH 815" (AH = Norfolk county registration - pre-'74) leave the UK?

If a particular registration doesn't show on the DVLA database https://www.taxdisc.direct.gov.uk/EvlPo ... =directgov >Vehicle Enquiry>... then it's unlikely you will find any information anywhere else.

I was trying to figure out when it left in an attempt to piece together the bike's history.

The story I have so far:
After White Helmets service the bike was "civilianized" and sold to an American pilot, at the end of his service he loaded the bike up and flew to San Antonio, Texas and rode the bike home from there.

I suspect that the bike left England in the mid-1950's sometime.

Vince

It might be worth asking the Kithead Trust. it looks as if they hold some Norfolk record cards from 1935 - 1978

http://www.kitheadtrust.org.uk/england_wales2_11.html

I don't understand exactly what they mean by 'not available for public consultation' - Does that mean that they will disclose information or not ? It's worth a try though.

The situation is that the local authorities were instructed to destroy the paper records when everything was centralised on computer. Fortunately, not all of them obeyed, or not completely but it's a lottery as to what's survived.

'SAH' was used up to December 1954. That seems early for demob of a TRW.

Unclviny said:

I suspect that the bike left England in the mid-1950's sometime.

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The DVLA database doesn't go back that far, so a registration number from a vehicle which left the UK before the mid 1970's wouldn't show up.

79x100 said:

'SAH' was used up to December 1954. That seems early for demob of a TRW.

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It is my understanding that this bike went to the White Helmets originally and I am not sure how long they would use a bike before "de-commisioning" it. If you check TRW production numbers there were not any 1952's built but there is a missing range of records between 1951 and 1953 (about 800 bikes) and this bike does not follow any of the parts books exactly.

I am doing a "period correct" restoration of an RAF Dispatch bike based on TRW's of the time and the RAF Dispatch bikes from Blanford Camp.

Vince

79x100 said:

'SAH' was used up to December 1954. That seems early for demob of a TRW.

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It seems odd for a White Helmet TRW to have a Norfolk registration, as the White Helmet display bikes were specially prepared by the factory, and period photos show new 1957 White Helmet TRWs complete with Warwickshire (UE) registration numbers. What is also slightly strange is that the WH bikes had civilian registrations instead of military numbers.

And, for those that may not know who the White Helmets are: http://www.army.mod.uk/signals/display/1302.aspx
http://www.whitehelmets.co.uk/

Rohan said:

Wots that McCulloch engine looking thing in the background of the numberplate shot ?

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Actually it's a vintage 5-port West Bend 5.8ci kart engine, circa 1960. I'm building two of them for one of my vintage go-karts.

79x100 said:

If you've got heaps of time and nothing better to do, you can search the registration database for numbers close to yours.

The DVLA system requires make to be entered as well. There are systems that don't but they only seem to have recently licensed vehicles on.

OGO 910M was a black 828cc Norton first registered 18/7/1974 but it hasn't been on the road officially since 1/12/1994.

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Thanks. My number returns "no info" on the DVLA website but that date for the previous sequential number would be right on the money.

Here is the response I got from the Kithead Trust:

Hello Vince

Regret cannot help you very much.
SAH was issued by Norfolk County Council between December 1954 and February 1955, so there must have been a plate switch at some time if your Triumph is 1952. This could have been either a cherished transfer or an unofficial switch (of which there were many in the 1970s/80s).

We have no Norfolk records here but there is a card index in the possession of the Norfolk Record Office, Central Library, Norwich, NR2 1NJ. They will surely have a website and e-mail details though I don't have them here.
Norfolk will be able to tell you a little about SAH 815 but whether that will prove to be the machine you have, or another, who knows?

Best I can do, I'm afraid.
Regards
Peter Jaques

I am looking for a web address or an email for them but so far I have not had any luck, I will keep looking.
Thanks for the help.

Vince

Unclviny said:

We have no Norfolk records here but there is a card index in the possession of the Norfolk Record Office, Central Library, Norwich, NR2 1NJ.

I am looking for a web address or an email for them but so far I have not had any luck, I will keep looking.

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The Kithead Trust "Central Library" information for Norwich/Norfolk vehicle records could be out of date?

Try:
http://www.theforumnorwich.co.uk/ Millennium Library

http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Leisure_and_c ... urceNodeId

Thanks. My number returns "no info" on the DVLA website but that date for the previous sequential number would be right on the money. quote.. fro VinTage.

I looked up my '77 and when I typed the rego number as "RPK 733R" it said no info. When I removed the space, "RPK733R" it showed 16-6-77 and showed it was a Black Norton that was not re registered in 2008.
This would be the time it was shipped to Australia.
It is and was black, but all the original papers show it was originally Silver.
The first owner painted it black and must have changed the rego information?

Graeme