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Purity of design...

Discussion in 'Vincent' started by Fast Eddie, Oct 1, 2019.

  1. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    I have always thought that well built racing motorcycles are about as pure and beautiful as motorcycles get.

    This Egli Vincent Racer by Godet takes that ethos to a whole new level...

    Apparently its a mere 125kg! And at 52rwhp it’s getting close to the best cammy racers.

    I wish I was a good enough rider to justify running one...

    4715E23E-CED9-4735-A85C-5C0D05B36337.jpeg FA19A250-D64E-41CF-BB88-9B3997FB51C4.jpeg 8A3CD9EC-4729-43B7-B1EF-8A372EB48FF6.jpeg
     
    Jerry Doe likes this.
  2. Snotzo

    Snotzo

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2013
    Even better in my opinion was Patrick's Grey Flash replica
     
  3. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Both have a lot of appeal in my eyes. The Grey Flash rep has the benefit of being Lansdowne and Goodwood eligible too.

    A tad on the expensive side tho !
     
  4. desmo

    desmo

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2019
    i have a friend that spcialised in vincents he had 3 rapides at one time ,2 were sold to Ernie page a well known isdt rider
    he made cranks and fixed the many in built faults , loose main bearings , loose timing gear pinions , liners coming loose
    and terrible clutches ,he converted them to suzuki ones
    his opinion was they were way over complicated for there own good

    i was running a short stroke 85 x85 inter norton with titanium rod etc he made for me and on a run home one day i past him at 95 .mph and slowly accelerated away
    from him
    he was truly shocked

    he had a tuned rapide with 32 mm concentrics and a hot cam that could get to 115 mph but we both came to the conclusion they were not that fast unless radically modded
    for quick ones look up john renwicks,workshop on u tube
    he can get them going

    probably be cheaper to get a new godet engine as a worn out one is a money pit
     
  5. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    You might be right about a new Godet engine being cheaper than rebuilding a shagged out original. I had a Rapide that was owned by Bruce Main Smith that had done over 130,000 miles by 1962! Goodness knows how many miles it had done by the time I bought it as a basket case in around 2000 ish, but I do know it was properly worn-bloody-out! I stopped counting how much I sunk into that...

    A new Godet engine is quite a thing. You can specify magnesium cases that are 12kg lighter than alloy (26.4lbs saving is not to be sniffed at), these have been around for a few years now, he modified the design somewhat and some have racked up close to 100,000 miles now.

    Add to that, squished heads, 36mm carbs, 1330cc, 105 cams, optional CR up to 10:1, electronic ign, multiplate clutch, 5 speed box, a proper functional electric start, and a raft of smaller mods and details, and you have quite an engine !

    I don’t know if they sell them separately though?
     
  6. ericg

    ericg

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    It was surely a sick Vincent. Third will get you well past the ton on a good one.
    About in built faults, I'd rather talk about incompetent mechanics. The unusual features of the Vincent are all perfectly sound. Bearings or timing gear spindles comes loose at very high mileage and the Vincent clutch is only terrible if you don't understand it. Suzuki clutch and other Japanese parts on an old British bike are just heresy.
     
    Fast Eddie likes this.
  7. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    A standard old Vincent runs right over a freshly rebuilt 750 Commando. I learned that first hand this summer.
    1/2 throttle on the Vin = full bore on the Commando when passing uphill with headwind.
    That's with the highgeared Vincent loafing at 3500 revs 75 mph, the Norton quite busy at 4500 revs 75 mph.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019 at 1:32 PM
    ericg and Fast Eddie like this.
  8. desmo

    desmo

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2019
    no way its because my inter was very quick ! had a lot of trick bits , he was a recognised as a bit of an authority on them by the owners club
    used to trade under sas engineering
    namely Simon Linford

    i found the riding position very un comfortable too like leaning over a jack hammer

    undoubtedly the servo clutch worked well enough when new but have you tried riding one with a worn one , the japanese clutch is a worthwile mod
    and lives in a chaincase so so rivet counters can bitch about it

    still think they are a bit of a damp firework
     
  9. desmo

    desmo

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2019
    a well prepared 750 commando should be a match for most things on A roads i remember in the 1980s it was announced with great gobs of publicity that Tony Rutter would be coming to a small meeting ie Beveridge park in kirkaldy on the works Ducati pantah
    He was embarrisngly blown into the weeds by the late Jack Gow on a home tuned 750 commando that had been tuned by the late John Leech
    nothing realy trick inside either just put together with much racing knowledge
     
  10. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Once an opinion is formed it is rarely changed.
    Vincents proved themselves decades ago and the speed records are all well documented.
    So is the durability of the bike ( Tony Rose, 100,000 mile test ride, 1952)

    " A fact not a slogan"

    Glen

     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019 at 7:05 AM
    Fast Eddie likes this.
  11. ericg

    ericg

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    Come on! Seriously I'm sure your Inter was quite exceptional but I'm also sure there is absolutely no way it could stay with a Vincent twin unless it's a very sick one.
    I'm building a 90x90 Comet engine at the moment with high comp Omega piston, Mk2 cam and a big carb, I think it should be more realistic to compare this with your Norton single but a twin, no way!
    I've never tried a Vincent with a worn out clutch just because I can't see why on earth I should have to! When something is worn out I just repair it!
    I suppose you 'll repair your Inter engine when it's worn out or will you replace it with a Japanese engine just because it's a worthwhile mod!?
    I own a '68 Commando and a '72 Trident, both are great bikes and I love them but my Norvin twin will cruise all day at higher speed and is far quicker, except from stand still to say 40-50 because of the very tall Black Lightning first gear, above 50 it will leave the Norton and the Triumph for dead.
     
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  12. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Impressive camera work !
     
  13. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    5” speedos are for girls. I prefer this set up...
    6795ABBA-26E6-4847-978B-7D2B3C69E309.jpeg
     
    worntorn likes this.
  14. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    The bike belongs to a US member and is newly restored/rebuilt. He mounted a GoPro on the tank then later, when editing, took a still photo from the video.
    If the mileage on the odometer is miles from rebuild, that's a bit early to run this fast. Later on, the owner might regret having done this early high rpm run. Hard to resist when the power is right there.

    It's best to wait for 1500 miles or so and a couple of oil changes before venturing up to this speed.

    Glen
     
    Fast Eddie likes this.
  15. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Glen, what would your recommended running in programme be?

    When I asked my French mates they shrugged and said “just don’t go crazy...”
     
  16. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    I roughly followed the program that Triumph recommended for the Thruxton.
    No long runs, lots short bursts of moderately hard acceleration without allowing full revs. Avoid sitting at a constant speed ( Motorway).
    I limited rpm to 4000 for the first 500 miles or so, then up in 500 rpm increments every 250 miles or so until you get to your max, which should be 5500+- for a standard Vin, maybe higher with your Egli?

    Glen
     
    Fast Eddie likes this.
  17. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

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    Oct 4, 2013
    Sounds doable, thanks.
     
  18. storm42

    storm42 VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2011
    So is just under 3000rpm considered high rpm for a Vincent?
     
  19. desmo

    desmo

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2019
    the only ones that went well were the tuned ones eg george browns sprinters , or the specialy tuned ones given to the press , all im saying is the fabled vincent is not what its cracked up to be for sure

    good luck with the grey flash john surtees,raced one

    when my mate Ian Wardrope gets his Sid mullarney 4 valve manx engine finished i think it will be unbeatable

    and it will be eligible in classic races too
     
  20. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    That's a Smith's electronic tach set on 4 cylinder setting( reading 50%)
    It's actually running at just under 6000 rpm which , in my view is way too high on a fresh engine.

    Glen
     

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