Ordering Parts For a Norton Dominator.
- Thread starter jsouthard
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Well, I was just directed to some of Ben Gradlers (Erie PA) lies in print on this thread, I dont have Ben's amount of troll freetime, but just to correct one of his lies on this thread (there are many) , and I quote:
"Phil Radford of Fair Spares agrees that Skip Brolund and Ebay Salesman Howard Johnston both are at the least ignorant and at worst outright liars."
beng
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The Nomad I bought was originally in assembled form in Phil's own shop, Howard Johnson is a personal friend of Phil's and Howard sell items on ebay for Phil often. I also know Phil & bought my '50 model 7 from him, he and I have spoken at Norton rallys & on the phone. Basically, Ben Gradler if full of crap .
My Nomad has the 1.75 dia. crank journals & I have temp. assembled the crank with a set of bearings & connecting rods,pistons & barrel, everything spins with no clearance issues. Ben's gripe is that the crank is not shown in his parts list, it wouldnt, it is a 1960 bike that was being phased out, the 1.75 dia. cranks were already engineered at Norton of the next series of bikes, due to the high perf. Nomads breaking cranks. This topic has been beat to death on 2 other forums before this, one of which Ben deleted all his comments, as they were so ridiculous. There are several people from Norton & some factory knowledge of this situation, Ben says there isn't. Thats becuse the englishmen who have this info don't care much for Ben & have made it clear that they dont want him pestering them.
Anyone with a model 77 or a Nomad that needs info, I am happy to help, as I have been fortunate to have accumulated volumes of info on these 2 bikes from autual owners, as well as well as info from a Norton Factory tester. send me a PM, as I dont feel like engaging in Ben's childish rants.
"Phil Radford of Fair Spares agrees that Skip Brolund and Ebay Salesman Howard Johnston both are at the least ignorant and at worst outright liars."
beng
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:01 pm
The Nomad I bought was originally in assembled form in Phil's own shop, Howard Johnson is a personal friend of Phil's and Howard sell items on ebay for Phil often. I also know Phil & bought my '50 model 7 from him, he and I have spoken at Norton rallys & on the phone. Basically, Ben Gradler if full of crap .
My Nomad has the 1.75 dia. crank journals & I have temp. assembled the crank with a set of bearings & connecting rods,pistons & barrel, everything spins with no clearance issues. Ben's gripe is that the crank is not shown in his parts list, it wouldnt, it is a 1960 bike that was being phased out, the 1.75 dia. cranks were already engineered at Norton of the next series of bikes, due to the high perf. Nomads breaking cranks. This topic has been beat to death on 2 other forums before this, one of which Ben deleted all his comments, as they were so ridiculous. There are several people from Norton & some factory knowledge of this situation, Ben says there isn't. Thats becuse the englishmen who have this info don't care much for Ben & have made it clear that they dont want him pestering them.
Anyone with a model 77 or a Nomad that needs info, I am happy to help, as I have been fortunate to have accumulated volumes of info on these 2 bikes from autual owners, as well as well as info from a Norton Factory tester. send me a PM, as I dont feel like engaging in Ben's childish rants.
skipsoldbikes said:
The following states clearly that Norton was capable of producing big journal cranks, even as a one off, if required;
Hello Dunstall story in the Classic bike this month says that when Paul Dunstall went the Bracebridge street Experimental work shop He found a number of Short stroke twins in airspace alloys and Not one nut bolt or screw would fit a production machine , there were crankshafts with 1.75 journals for short stroke 500cc twins and 600twin a 650 twin short stroke motors and he found 600cc Nomad motor with 1.75 journals , and two BRM DOHC liquid cooled 4 cylinder experimental motors along with 2 single cylinder 125cc Dohc motors and there wooden patents, He filled two Ford Thames vans with the experimental part and three race bikes in bits and he had a tailer for the frames etc what happen to this lot we will never know , Paul said there was stuff all over the place it was heart breaking too see ,
Bernhard said:
Be careful with that statement - Anna is quoting later history, so anything could have been done with those parts in the preceding years - and 1.75" journals were (eventually) standard Norton production parts, after all.
Amd Ben has elsewhere noted how 1.6" diam journals were made for the Daytona 500cc engines, by not grinding standard blank parts down as far as they usually were.
Until some proven documentation turns up, this is going to stay at the "he said, they said" stage.
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Rohan said:
If I were a betting man, I would wager that any records (if they existed) were tossed when Norton was forced to move to London.
Since this was now 50+ years ago, even a kid sweeping up at the old works is now pushing - or pulling - 70. I have a hard enough time remembering last week, much less 50 years ago!
The british bike magazines keenly followed technical developments back then - if you can find old copies and thumb through them , there wasn't much that escaped their attention. Or was 'leaked' to them, to get attention - and sales.
Many great engine articles and engine analyses, with superb detail drawings. If they didn't report it, it probably didn't happen.... ?
Many great engine articles and engine analyses, with superb detail drawings. If they didn't report it, it probably didn't happen.... ?
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I know what you mean Rohan, but most of the printed stuff was leaked on purpose. Secret papers sell magazines 
We have seen the pic of the extra thick crank journal that broke, doubt you find that oddity in any magazine article, or in any parts book. The 1.75 journals were a answer to broken cranks on the Nomads, the 88ss & 99ss werent having trouble, so they kept the 1.5 journals, but the writing was on the wall, in 1960 the last Nomads were built & the New Atlas Scramblers were going to be the next big thing off road, so lots of engineering was going on. I am sure Norton wouldnt want a magazine publishing an article about crankshafts breaking. That was about the same time the unified twin was being developed, guess what size the journals were????????????
We have seen the pic of the extra thick crank journal that broke, doubt you find that oddity in any magazine article, or in any parts book. The 1.75 journals were a answer to broken cranks on the Nomads, the 88ss & 99ss werent having trouble, so they kept the 1.5 journals, but the writing was on the wall, in 1960 the last Nomads were built & the New Atlas Scramblers were going to be the next big thing off road, so lots of engineering was going on. I am sure Norton wouldnt want a magazine publishing an article about crankshafts breaking. That was about the same time the unified twin was being developed, guess what size the journals were????????????- Joined
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I curious as to why any gives a rats ass about this 1.75 journal issue? seems like a lot of hot air, and wasted bandwidth is being consumed over a non-issue.
The question posed was about parts sources and resources for the young gentleman who wished to revive an old bit of tired iron, He never asked about the rod dia or crank journal sizes, instead it turned into turd flinging contest over someone who stepped up and offered help.
Quite frankly, what a bunch of wankers, why would anyone want to come on here and ask for help to be subjected to that abuse???
Personally, I am shame less about asking for advice and help, the more i can learn the better,... And most of the time the best resources are people who have some odd behaviors, unorthodox opinions and can be downright strange. As my pal Hal says,,, "Someone into old cars and motorcycles is a little weird? Who Knew?? Go figure!!!"
So, what I do is collect information, sort out the BS from the facts and move forward with the best material,.No one says you have to buy into someones viewpoints 100%
I just dont understand this school girl bullying behavior i see on here so much, grow up, I have seen it on many lists over the years but this is right up there near the top for this sort of thing,.
Check your medications laddys,,, Jeez,
Id like to see more friendly conversations of a technical nature, and being helpful to get this stuff on the road, not these penis waving contests.
The question posed was about parts sources and resources for the young gentleman who wished to revive an old bit of tired iron, He never asked about the rod dia or crank journal sizes, instead it turned into turd flinging contest over someone who stepped up and offered help.
Quite frankly, what a bunch of wankers, why would anyone want to come on here and ask for help to be subjected to that abuse???
Personally, I am shame less about asking for advice and help, the more i can learn the better,... And most of the time the best resources are people who have some odd behaviors, unorthodox opinions and can be downright strange. As my pal Hal says,,, "Someone into old cars and motorcycles is a little weird? Who Knew?? Go figure!!!"
So, what I do is collect information, sort out the BS from the facts and move forward with the best material,.No one says you have to buy into someones viewpoints 100%
I just dont understand this school girl bullying behavior i see on here so much, grow up, I have seen it on many lists over the years but this is right up there near the top for this sort of thing,.
Check your medications laddys,,, Jeez,
Id like to see more friendly conversations of a technical nature, and being helpful to get this stuff on the road, not these penis waving contests.
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Rohan said:
That was in 1962, at Bracebridge St.
skipsoldbikes said:I know what you mean Rohan, but most of the printed stuff was leaked on purpose. Secret papers sell magazines
Every single sentence written above was completely made up by Skip Brolund. This is completely typical of everything he does, he changes history of 50 years ago to support what he does in 2012.
The photograph of the broken 88ss crankshaft is that of one that Heinz Kegler broke in 1980's vintage racing that had done who knows how many racing miles at high rpms for many years. But for Brolund it is some sort of proof for him to back up....what?
If you read the above paragraph, you will get that Skip Brolund does not even know that the first 88ss and 99ss bikes were not sold until a YEAR and a HALF after the last Nomad rolled off the assembly line!
Also, the G15 and N15 scramblers were not built until after 1962, after the Norton factory that built the Nomad was history and an empty building.
Brolund put up on the NOC message board that the crank he got with his Nomad has an 89mm stroke, and if you look at his photos of it on his flickr page it is very plainly just an old Atlas or Commando crank. It is not a Bracebridge street item.
So he wants people to believe that the Nomad was the first 650cc Norton production bike, something no one ever heard of before he got his hands on his pile of parts.
Mr. Brolund who knew little or nothing about Norton Dominators at the time, was duped by Ebay salesman Howard Johnston into buying an Atlas crank. Very simply when he was told he was duped on a public internet forum he was embarrassed about it and began a series of lies about it which continue. He does not care if he misleads people about the history of the Norton Nomad or the Norton factory, as long as he can BS the customers in his business into thinking he is telling the truth and knows what he is talking about.
Yes, the smart and knowledgeable people out there can easily see Brolund's lies and line of BS, I am glad about that. When someone like Brolund is out there posing a danger to those seeking information and to the history of Norton motorcycles, then people need to call it out and offer real information.
Apparently Skip Brolund will make anything up, put words in anyone's mouth, tell any lie and make any claim to protect his business image and ego.
Yes, it is an absolute shame that internet forums which people look to for information have to wade through this sort of thing to find it, it really makes them next to useless in many cases.
I have made the suggestion to the moderators of this forum that they give those who start threads the power to edit them! That means when someone starts a thread and it gets off topic that person had the ability to delete complete posts or even lock selected people out of their thread. That power would immediately clean this and other threads up, and it would clean the entire forum up!
skipsoldbikes said:
Below are actual quotes Skip Brolund made on the BritBike forum, every one a lie. We already know he lied about Mike Bell, but here he claims to have talked to John Hudson, a dead man, and says that the Norton factory records show that Nomads were given large journal cranks because the 88ss and 99ss bikes broke theirs, over a year after the last Nomad rolled off the assembly line. He also tries to tell us that Norton 650 engines had thicker base flanges than Model 99 cylinders to make up the difference in stroke between the two engines, which is absolutely ridiculous. Anyone can look through what Brolund has posted in the past and find arm-fulls of lies, contradictions and misinformation.....
"I do know Norton did make a larger crank diameter in the later Nomads & in some 88ss & 99ss, but I cant find documents to tell me the engine number or year it started."
"What I dont know is what month in 1959, or 1960 the change was made. We know from factory records that the reason the change was made was due to the 88ss & 99ss models breaking cranks, "
"Now the bit that I possibly need your help to clarify.
John Hudson told me that because bigger journals used in the Nomads and weighed a bit more they had to counter-balanced with more weight on the crank web shoulders."
"The crank diameter was also confirmed by Mike Bell, whose fully restored Nomad is on display in the National Motorcycle Museum in England. His is an earlier model with the 21" front wheel (later models used a 19" wheel), but in doing his research, he can confirm the crank dia. on the later Nomad engines. "
"Just a little side note about identifying Norton 600cc cylinders & 650 cylinders: they both have 9 fins, but the 650 has a much thicker base, which is where the cylinder length got added for the extra stroke."
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