New Norton shop in soho london

Hi Britwit. Feel free to ramble as much as you want. I wasn't pointing the finger at you. Just my own observations as there seems to be so much negative comments around what seems to be Norton going from strength to strength. I don't care who they sell to as long as the company continues. Not over committing as has been suggested by some, nor do they appear short of money as I don't think the shops either in London and Barcelona will have been cheap to rent, kit out etc. I know that they have a tie up with Pepe Jeans for their clothing etc but still they must have had a major input into the finance of it..
 
As an interesting side note to this...

I was in Japan earlier this year and couldn't help notice that the second most popular choice of motorcycle branded clothing (based n my unscientific observations and counting) was Norton! First was HD of course, but I saw a very surprising number of Norton hats, tee shirts, etc.

I doubt all of this was 'genuine' but it does support the suggestion that there is a market for such stuff, that is perhaps bigger than we might realise.

Then you have Belstaff and Barbour, and Matchless coming back into the 'designer' arena too, all trading on a motorcycle connection.

So Norton are probably onto something.

Volume is key though, so Norton need to open many more shops, and more importantly, really attack the on line sales arena to shift the volume.

And GLB... I think most, if not all, on here wish Norton well. But that doesn't exclude the right to be sceptical !

It could be a cash cow for Norton and thus generate funds to put into motorcycles., as you say...

It could also be a money pit, taking funds away from motorcycle development...

Personally, I still struggle to understand why relatively minor faults keep being built into new bikes. It seems that either money or other resources are not in a plentiful enough supply, and I can't help but ask myself if these 'other ventures' are not diluting the effort and resources away from 'core business?

Nevertheless, I'll be checking out the merchandise... Christmas is coming... I wonder if they do kids ranges...?!?
 
Hi Fast Eddie


I appreciate scepticism. I currently have my glass half full hat on. I hope that I am right in that it increases revenue.

As for the minor faults, I have said it before, our bikes are hand built. Not built by a robot. Hands make mistakes, robots don't apparently. That said, in 2001 I bought a Honda SP1 new from a dealer. Within six weeks the block started to leak a mixture of oil and water. They took the bike back and I was supplied with a new one two months later! That was a major manufacturer with a reputation for never going wrong. I still had to wait two months without a bike.

In respect of core values I think we all have to remember that without the other interests Stuart Garner is involved in he would never have been in a position to resurrect Norton in the first place. Maybe these other businesses enable him to fund Norton rather than distract from the core business.

Regards
 
I think we almost agree. You are, of course, quite right that Garners other ventures are what enabled him to resurrect Norton in the first place. Hopefully, that same entrepreneurial 'flare' will continue to be a positive force.

The only point I'd challenge is that there is a difference between 'hand built assembly errors' which, as you say, one should expect on an hand built product, and 'built in design / engineering errors' that are repetitively built in, despite being well known, these should not be expected.

But anyway, we both, and I think all on this forum, hope Norton succeed. I hope they get the 961 reliable enough to persuade me to buy one, as I very nearly did recently.

Until then, I'll support as best I can, a tee shirt, a hat, maybe even some of those posh 'Jeffery West' Norton boots ( I do like them)!

BTW, I had an SP1 as well, but it was a race bike. Very nice I thought.
 
I have a friend with the new Duc 1200S Monster. Leaking oil upon delivery. Took two months and a special tool for gasket replacement. Another friend with an Aprilia RSV4. Needed a complete motor replacement before 1K miles. The new motor went in for a stalling problem 5 times to no avail. Finally, (18 months later) they gave him a new bike. Ran into bikers with Beemers with drive shaft problems, Harley tranny problems, a pushrod failure, electrical problems. It happens. Are we only to purchase the few vanilla bikes out there with stellar reputations? Are there any? Shall we talk Royal Enfield? Some get a good one, some don't.
 
I think 961 development will take a back seat for some time to the new 1200 V4, and 650 twin that are scheduled to be released year end.
These more contemporary designs will be very important to Norton's long term goal of becoming a true engineering company, something like Triumph.
The mistakes made with the 961 should not be repeated.
The new models will continue to represent a limited production boutique brand but with modern design technology.
If these new models are successful, They will put Norton on the map as a real motorcycle manufacturer again.

I also think that if the new models are successful, it will change Garner's vision of Norton as a boutique brand.
If demand is high for these models, he'll do the the arithmetic in his head and realize just how profitable mass production would be.

Time will tell.
 
I don't think the 961 will sit back at all. Obviously I know no more than you guys.... but that's my gut feeling is 961 is here to stay at least for a few more years. With all that has been developed and invested, why put it away now??. And the clothing is very high quality. I have the messenger bag too and its fantastic. I wear it all the time on the bike. It looks awesome and again, very well made. I have two Norton t-shirts and both are very nice, well made, good looking shirts. Just like the bikes I suppose. Good looking, very high end and well made. (Except some of the bikes have a few gremlins from assembly - I know, ... I know.....).
 
Richard,

I know Garner has said in interviews that there are no plans to discontinue the 961.
Bringing the new models to market, and addressing any developing issues with them will require considerable resources from Norton.
I just think the small factory staff will have its hands full for a while.
The 961 will need work to become euro 5 compliant, and this will probably require engineering changes.
So something will have to be pushed to the back burner for a while.
Norton just doesn't seem to have the resources to handle all of this simultaneously.
 
My thinking is how many V4's will they sell a year? Not a lot at the price point they will be. How many super leggeras do ducati sell a year??. Probally less than 10. So they cannot afford to slow 961 range at all. Could be wrong tho but this is what makes sense to me.
 
Richard,

I hope you’re right about the 961.
It deserves continued development and refinement.
I don’t know how many super leggeras Ducati sold, but they did sell 1400 Desmosedici RR’s for $65,000-75,000 over several years.

Anyway, my apologies to all for hijacking this thread that was originally about the new Norton store in soho. :oops:
 
Having watched the teaser video I hope they don't repeat the mistake on their clothing - anyone else spot it, UK military and ex mil types should spot it straight away.
 
Madnorton said:
Having watched the teaser video I hope they don't repeat the mistake on their clothing - anyone else spot it, UK military and ex mil types should spot it straight away.

Union flag wrong way up...

Well spotted !
 
 

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WIthout Stuart Garners money in the first place Norton would surely not exist.
There are many of you out there who have had issues, some major, some not.
Hopefully most of them have been sorted out by now, I know there will be some shouting that they havn't.
From what I have read Norton are working hard at sorting the issues and it seems the Mk 2 has most of the mods.
Norton are a boutique company and I expect to a degree will stay that way. All you have to do is read the reviews of the 961 v the new Thruxton. Both generally loved but the differences are well documented.
I don't think they have ambition to be like Triumph. I doubt they have any ambition to run greasy shops with random bits hanging everywhere either, something I love by the way but its not the image that Norton want.

Of course the business is being built on a first class product, when their range starts at about £15000, what do people expect, and want?
I for one cannot see development being ignored at the expense of a new range although there will be a slow down, hopefully complementing the vast amount of development already done.

I own a 74 Commando and approaching 60, hope in the near future to buy a 960 but its not guaranteed.

I will however be going to Soho in December to see what the new shop is all about.
 
To open these shops whilst the 961 is still not Euro4 compliant baffles me - the energy and so called enthusiasm should have been directed there. It smacks of the attitude that NMUK could not care less about the future sales in the UK and Europe - unless you want a Tee Shirt. With BSA now sold according to the Indian press it will be good to see how what they will produce will affect the sales of the 961 if it exists after Jan 17. I imagine the Triumph Thruxton hit sales and I bet BSA will do the same and compete in that sector.

Norton has survived, and will be about in the future - it is the Jewel in the crown of motorcycle names, it just needs to listen what people say and take onboard some of the ideas, there should be the all out race models, fast tourers (not sports tourers) and the get to work machines like Norton have produced in the past. At the moment - race bikes, well sort of, tourers if you can get it in a rucksack, get to work all weather middleweight machine, non-exisitant. The last would be a winner as sales have increased year on year since Garner has made bikes and with an ever increasing traffic problem here and no doubt elsewhere on the planet the two wheel commute will grow.

I really like the 961, actually better looking than the Domi in my opinion, and yes I could by several 961's tomorrow if I wanted but after talking to some owners that is not going to happen - NMUK fails when it comes to their customers passing on the good word - not good advertising for the product.

So, despite all this and what could have been, we have two shops. I bet the ownership of the Tee Shirts they sell to customers will be longer than the time scale some owners keep their 961's. Maybe in November the V4 is not the only announcement and that the 961 has been replaced with some nice new models - but I doubt it.

Enjoy the Tee-shirt at Christmas, as of 01 Jan 17 you will not be able to buy a 961 to go with it in the UK and Europe to go with it.
 
"Enjoy the Tee-shirt at Christmas, as of 01 Jan 17 you will not be able to buy a 961 to go with it in the UK and Europe to go with it."


Of all the negatives re Norton this is one I don't understand, can you explain please?
 
Madnorton is referring to the fact that the 961 is not currently Euro 4 compliant, and unless it is so by Jan 1st 2017, it cannot be sold in Europe as a new vehicle.

At least that's what it seems like. Does anyone actually know if this is correct? Or if the 961 is able to pass euro 4 or not?

I know bikes need ABS for Euro 4, which the 961 doesn't have, but that should be quite straightforward to buy 'off the shelf' and fit on the assembly 'line'. So my question is more towards the emissions (noise and pollution), and how close Norton are to passing, or getting around, the emission requirements.

Does anyone actually know the situation?
 
Ok, thanks, read up on that!
I would like to think that Norton are on top of this, it would be good to hear their take on it.
Cannot for one minutia think they would have put the investment in only to let it die next year!!
 
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