Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?

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T95

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I now have run across two items on my bike that have me wondering if I have a high bread or a bastard.

The first being a mixed bag of Smith instruments. One of the instruments is sporting a solid green globe while the other has the line fade. I originally assumed this was due to a change out by PO. After encountering my rear hub assembly I am wondering if the factory sent it out this way. Any other cases out there of mixed instruments from the factory?

Most recently I was dissembling my rims and hubs and I realized I had a hybrid rear hub/drum assembly. My bike has a bolt on rear drum with a solid cover plate on the opposite side. The factory manuel refers to either; the pre 71 with a bolt on drum and cover plate with holes to access the bolts, or the post 71 with the cushy mounted hub.

I have read that parts were intermingled to use up what was on hand following a change. Just curious how common my wheel / hub combo is and what other deviations from the manuel I will encounter in the future?

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
 
That's a 68/70 drum and hub. Don't know if the factory mixed parts, I'd doubt it. What's the numbers on the frame, GB and motor?

Dave
69S
 
But, think about what it was like in the late 70s on up: very few surviving dealers who would even look at a Norton, no parts back up to speak of, etc. A lot of people back in those bad old days did what they had to do, to keep the things running. Need a new rear wheel or speedo/tach? Bolt on what you could find at a swap meet or basically anywhere you could find anything. I remember gleaning Triumph / Norton / BSA parts out of a back room of an old independent shop until the late 80s when they sold everything to a guy who hauled it all out to his farm, where they still sit. There were many situations like that back then, when these bikes weren't the darlings of a lot of people, but more of an old discontiuned bike that we were trying to milk a few more years out of. Truly the golden age now, and getting better!
 
DogT said:
That's a 68/70 drum and hub. Don't know if the factory mixed parts, I'd doubt it. What's the numbers on the frame, GB and motor?

Dave
69S
Click to expand...

Dave,
I know all the number are matching- 145099. The ID plate is stamped march 1971.
 
The numbers and dates certainly line up with the factory numbers. Maybe there was a problem with some of the parts and they got replaced with whatever could be found, cheap.

Dave
69S
 
builder said:
I'm guessing that your bike is a bitsa from the PO.
Click to expand...
Well if we were playing Stump the Chump then you win. BITSA- back in the saddle again?
Where did the abbreviation reference go?
 
T95 said:
I know all the number are matching- 145099. The ID plate is stamped march 1971.
Click to expand...


Around 4000 1971 Commandos would already have been manufactured by 145099, so I think it's unlikely the factory would be using up any left-over 1970 parts by then?
 
T95 said:
builder said:
I'm guessing that your bike is a bitsa from the PO.
Click to expand...
Well if we were playing Stump the Chump then you win. BITSA- back in the saddle again?
Where did the abbreviation reference go?
Click to expand...

It comes from "bits of this, bits of that" or "bitsa".

After this many years you have to assume that any bike without full documentation is going to be unoriginal. Never assume the bike left the factory the way you got it unless you have proof.
 
DogT said:
That's a 68/70 drum and hub. Don't know if the factory mixed parts, I'd doubt it. What's the numbers on the frame, GB and motor?

Dave
69S
Click to expand...

I guess I can live with the 68/70 hub providing it supports the same rim drilling pattern as the 71. My long awaited rims just arrived from CWW.

This is the only picture I have handy of the front hub & rim, Does it look like a 71 set up?
Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
 
swooshdave said:
T95 said:
builder said:
I'm guessing that your bike is a bitsa from the PO.
Click to expand...
Well if we were playing Stump the Chump then you win. BITSA- back in the saddle again?
Where did the abbreviation reference go?
Click to expand...

It comes from"bits of this, bits of that" or "bitsa".
BITSA- now that sounds Italian! I assumed it would be something more on the lines of bag of assholes.

After this many years you have to assume that any bike without full documentation is going to be unoriginal. Never assume the bike left the factory the way you got it unless you have proof.
Click to expand...

I was the second owner and I bought her in 1972.
 
T95 said:
BITSA- now that sounds Italian! I assumed it would be something more on the lines of bag of assholes.

After this many years you have to assume that any bike without full documentation is going to be unoriginal. Never assume the bike left the factory the way you got it unless you have proof.
Click to expand...

I was the second owner and I bought her in 1972. [/quote]

Do you know anything about the bike between when the factory shipped it and the person you bought from? The original owner could have easily wrecked the bike and put whatever parts were available on it.
 
L.A.B. said:
T95 said:
I know all the number are matching- 145099. The ID plate is stamped march 1971.
Click to expand...


Around 4000 1971 Commandos would already have been manufactured by 145099, so I think it's unlikely the factory would be using up any left-over 1970 parts by then?
Click to expand...
L.A.B.,
With your estimate it doesn't sound likely that my wheel had been just sitting in the corner while 4000 bikes were assembled!

I now suspect that it was replaced the same time as the speedo. I bought it in 1972 from my friends brother who was working at a shop. He told me it had been dropped and a couple bits replaced. I don't really have the recall on what was replaced but it looks like the mystery is going to unfold bit by bit.
Thanks, Gary
 
swooshdave said:
T95 said:
BITSA- now that sounds Italian! I assumed it would be something more on the lines of bag of assholes.

After this many years you have to assume that any bike without full documentation is going to be unoriginal. Never assume the bike left the factory the way you got it unless you have proof.
Click to expand...

I was the second owner and I bought her in 1972.
Click to expand...

Do you know anything about the bike between when the factory shipped it and the person you bought from? The original owner could have easily wrecked the bike and put whatever parts were available on it.[/quote]

Dave,
Nice detective work! I think that is exactly what happened!
 
You might want to check the length of the bridge to see if it's a 68/70 front fender (mudguard) or the longer 71 and up mudguard. Here's the 69, the 71's are about an inch longer, and the curve of the fender itself is different for the 2 years. Otherwise, the front drum is no different until they went to the disk, as far as I know.

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?


The stays are also about an inch longer and shaped a bit differently for the 71 up. Here's the 69.

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?


If you have a 69/70 front fender and want to update to the 71, I know someone that would want it, not me.

Dave
69S
 
Brithit said:
But, think about what it was like in the late 70s on up: very few surviving dealers who would even look at a Norton, no parts back up to speak of, etc. A lot of people back in those bad old days did what they had to do, to keep the things running. Need a new rear wheel or speedo/tach? Bolt on what you could find at a swap meet or basically anywhere you could find anything. I remember gleaning Triumph / Norton / BSA parts out of a back room of an old independent shop until the late 80s when they sold everything to a guy who hauled it all out to his farm, where they still sit. There were many situations like that back then, when these bikes weren't the darlings of a lot of people, but more of an old discontiuned bike that we were trying to milk a few more years out of. Truly the golden age now, and getting better!
Click to expand...
If I am not running stock factory parts they were changed out in the first year of her life. Considering he worked in a shop it is vary likely he put it back together with what was on hand or easily sourced. I can understand how easy it is to damage the speedo where it would need replacement. I am scared to think why you would need to replace the rear wheel! The good thing is he was a top mechanic and not just a goof ball and I road the bike for a solid four years without incident.
 
DogT said:
You might want to check the length of the bridge to see if it's a 68/70 front fender (mudguard) or the longer 71 and up mudguard. Here's the 69, the 71's are about an inch longer, and the curve of the fender itself is different for the 2 years. Otherwise, the front drum is no different until they went to the disk, as far as I know.

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?


The stays are also about an inch longer and shaped a bit differently for the 71 up. Here's the 69.

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?


If you have a 69/70 front fender and want to update to the 71, I know someone that would want it, not me.

Dave
69S
Click to expand...
Dave,
Good information! I'll measure up the bridge and the length of the stays. I do know the fender in only 4" wide.

So the big question, do the 69 70 & 71 have the same drilling pattern on the rims? I haven't put the new rim side by side with the old rim yet.
 
As far as I know the rims didn't change at all until they went to the disk brake.

Dave
69S
 
I am considering my options of either keeping my current hub/drum arrangement or replacing it with the cush drive.

I would like to hear about the advantages and disadvantages of the shock absorber drive system.
 
I am not sure how this cover plate should look, is it suppose to be concave in the center? Its clear the speedometer hub was rubbing on and I can only assume its due to a misplaced washer or spacer.

Is My 71 Roadster a Factory Bastard?
 
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