Electronic Ignition+ E-Start MK III

Hello everybody

Thinking about replacing my points with an electronic ignition. Which one would you choose? It has to work together with the e-start on a mkIII. Which one needs the lowest voltage?

Thanks for your answers.

Greetings
Marcel

Interesting. Note the mention of the new one from Germany below. Personally I've become quite a fan of the Tri Spark.

Hi Marcel,

I put Pazon Surefire ignition systems in both my Victor and my Mk3. Pazon claims that their product will work down to 8 v, which is critical for the mk3 using electric start. My Mk3 starts every time, cold or hot, with a touch of the button. However, I installed some mods (a consensus from the forum; I'm not smart enough to have figured this out for myself) that are essential if you plan to use the electric start:

1. Install a big-ass battery of 18 A-H, with 300 CCA. I bought a Yuasa, which just barely fits with only a bit of metal bending required. There are many such batteries on the internet; pay attention to the dimensions.

2. Buy or fabricate the three heavy-duty cables that tie the starter, solenoid, and battery together. Dave Comeau sells these cables as a kit; they must be at least 6 gauge. Dave reckons that an initial surge of over 300 A is required to turn the starter; this will drag down the available voltage if the cables and battery are not stout enough, and cause some ignitions to wildly advance at start-up, resulting in kick-back.

3. Install a 3-phase heavy-duty alternator to keep the battery charged while motoring at low speeds. SPARX makes a good one, as do others.

4. Buy Dave's starter. If your starter has been converted to quadrature windings (four brushes) and is in good condition, you could use your existing starter. Dave's starter is in another class; isn't peace of mind worth $350?

5. Check out Dyno Dave's website Atlantic Green; Dave has thought about and tested this problem extensively. I believe that he's a bit pessimistic regarding the combination of electronic ignitions and electic start, probably due to his considerable experience with Boyer systems. A big battery and a Pazon (or, I hear, TriSpark) will work for you.

Marcel said:

Hello everybody

Thinking about replacing my points with an electronic ignition. Which one would you choose? It has to work together with the e-start on a mkIII. Which one needs the lowest voltage?

Thanks for your answers.

Greetings
Marcel

Click to expand...

Hi Marcel, Just fitted Tri-spark onto my Mk3, seems to be very good easy start on the button and steady tickover from not long after starting , I also fitted welding cable as the starter, solenoid, and battery connections, probably a combination of these helps s will a good battery. For me it would be the Tri-spark.

Thanks for all answers. Somebody knows the lowest voltage a tri-spark needs? Will be interesting to see its curve.

Greetings
Marcel

Shoot them an email at Tri Spark. I did a really unusual installation and they were quite helpful to me.

ludwig said:

i heared that Boyer improved their product , lately , maybe someone can confirm this ?

Click to expand...

I can at least confirm they are now selling the Micro MkIV system which as they say, is an improved version with more stable low-voltage characteristics? http://www.boyerbransden.com/micromarkiv.html

My Mk III is fitted with 8 ga cables that serve as power and ground for the CNW starter, I have a TriSpark and a standard Yuasa 14L; it is easy to forget that this model is fitted with a kick starter.

IIRC the TriSpark functions down to 8 volts; I like that it completly fits under the points cover, eliminating the need to fabricate a mount for a "black box".

RE: Four brush conversion for starter: The kits that add the other two brushes do not add the corresponding two addition field magnets, this will insure that you put all available voltage on the commutator, but will not increase, materially, the umph the starter addresses the engine with. If you are very skilled or have a talented rebuilder Presto-Lite offers the additional parts to convert your starter to 4 brush/4 field. The Comeau or the CNW starter is a much more reliable way to go.

RS

I have one of the Comeau starters on my mk3 . It worked pretty well with the analogue Boyer although
I typically used it only after stalling the bike or in those instances where it was too much of a hassle to
put it on the center stand to kick . Leo Goff likes the Pazon but after all of the positive reviews
here I told him I wanted to try the Tri-spark. He's impressed with it and likes the "no black box"
feature . We'll see how well it works when we get the engine back togather . The cam is supposed to
arrive tomorrow . I plan to upgrade the cables and will probably install a Sparx 3 phase and maybe
an Odyssey battery after we get it going . I have a sneaky suspiscion that it won't be as much fun to kick
after the ported , cammed , hi-comp 880 transformation is completed

Ron

...and when you get that starter motor turning over strongly and reliably, you start breaking sprags. I've given away the idea of having a working electric start for now, after several bad experiences. Including having the sprag engage while riding, all on it's own, thereby trying to make a generator out of the starter. Awesome engine/regenerative braking :shock: Not really funny, almost threw me over the bars. And it certainly can be problematical with the Boyer, it may have the voltage to crank over at a good speed, but it drops enough to see no spark. Often starts as you release the button. I have a four-pole conversion, heavy leads, and a larger battery. If the sprag simply failed to engage and you had to kick it, no problem for me, but when it does jam on, it locks the motor, and you are stranded. Has happened to me twice now, so it can stay off for a while until i get too old to kick it. At 56, that should be a fair way off , yet. :wink:

And if I did have a working version, it would be saved for stalling in traffic, that sort of thing..has anyone actually used them as the electric assist touted in the original brochures, kicking at the same time? Never got around to trying it, myself...

I always use it just as an electric assist by kicking at the same time...

Greetings
Marcel

I have a Micro-Digital Boyer fitted to my MK2A, the blurb that came with it says it advances the spark below tick-over and retards at tick-over before advancing again above tickover, this is to stabilise the tickover. Rules it out for MK3's I would say.

I have a MK3 Commando, and I use the electric starter 99% of the time, and I have used a Boyer MK3 for two years and now have a Tri-spak system on. I do kick start it very occasionally just to prove to myself that I still have what it takes :wink:

I haven't had any problems with either system, and so could recommend either to you. I do have a large battery, a Dave Comeau starter and heavy duty cables which I assume are a big help.

The Tri spark system seems to give a slightly more reliable tickover than I experienced with the Boyer.

kommando said:

I have a Micro-Digital Boyer fitted to my MK2A, the blurb that came with it says it advances the spark below tick-over and retards at tick-over before advancing again above tickover, this is to stabilise the tickover.

Click to expand...

I think that would be more to do with the dynamic function of the system while the engine is actually running because the digital system can recognise when the engine is slowing past the normal idle point and advance the ignition to stabilise the idle, rather than the amount of advance provided for starting?